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Relics of the Third Age: A Lord of the Rings Quest

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[X] Agree to be the Envoy.

For all her displeasure with Elessar, Arphazêl doesn't strike me as the type to let her feelings jeopardize the people who've shown her kindness. Besides, adventure!

[X] Arphazêl the Monarchist.

I mean, given her history and background, it seems like a pretty obvious choice. And it's an objective improvement in the circumstances.

And hey, as a daughter of Númenor and someone who's traveled with Gandalf, Arphazêl is kind of qualified, isn't she?
 
Blademaster said:
[ ] Agree to be the Envoy
[ ] Arphazêl the Republican
with Nurn's history at the hands of Sauron, I can see how a king is problematic. but strong, central rule is neccessary if we do not want to become orcs. I support turning the council into an actual ruling body, rather then a king

would this be an acceptable write in?
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That seems fine. Really, anything that would make sense in-universe as a position on the government of Nurn is fine.
 
[X] Agree to be the Envoy
[X] Arphazêl the Anarchist

Critically, Arphy is a child of Nurn; and I don't think it's a political climate conductive to supporting a monarchy. No one wants a repeat of the Big Eye, but more importantly no one likes Elessar; they don't need a king.

Never again will Nurnites bend the knee, what was once Mordor is now free.
 
[X] Refuse to be the Envoy
[X] Agree to go along as an Escort to the Envoy

[X] Arphazêl the Anarchist

Arphazêl is a bad choice to be envoy for a number of reasons. Her family history, and even her given name, are going to be a hindrance dealing with court. Additionally, her youth acts against her. You might send someone her age as a messenger, but using someone that junior as a diplomat could be taken as an insult. Arphazêl would know enough to know that she is a bad choice for the job. And jumping into the Gondorian sphere of influence isn't something to be done on a whim or in a moment of desperation.

It would be better to find out what is going on with the orcs, what is driving the change in behaviour?

Edited to Expand: This is actually something that you can observe in real world diplomacy. Countries will have someone very junior sit in the UN general assembly whenever someone they despise is planned to make a speech. Having only twenty year olds present when a senior member of another government is speaking is a calculated insult. Unless a young person is elevated in status by something else, Celebrity or Royalty, they are going to be viewed in this way

So sending Arphazêl as the envoy sends one of two messages: that Nurn is sending some random twenty year old or that Nurn is sending someone elevated by her birth. The first will be taken as an insult in Gondor. The second will invite uncomfortable questions about why Nurn considers this young women elevated to address a king's court, and could wind up even worse than the first.

That's why I added in the Write-in. If Arphazêl goes along as Escort to the Envoy she can still look around and be consulted on court protocol, but will receive much less scrutiny and avoid the appearance of insult.
 
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[X] Agree to be the Envoy

Not only are we likely the most qualified for the job. (Our experience of practical rulership likely matches that of anyone else sat at the council thanks to our role as secretary and our experience of treating nobles as equals eclipses theirs, which is a scary but sad result of this being a nation of freed slaves.) But we have a unique experience which might help, we spent several days with Gandalf and even got some wisdom from him on the dangers of meddling too much which the Gondorians might need to hear.

[X] Arphazêl the Republican

The problem with this is that there's not really a model for this in middle earth. The closest I can think of is the shire which benefits from not having to worry about a military and even then it's technically a vassal of some lost kingdom. (I learned this today!).

I'm still voting for it because both other options are unpalatable from the perspective we're sitting in. Anarchy is weakness and the fear of tyranny should make sense to us by now. Our parents might have taught us that the noble are born different but we've had 10 years to see exactly what us being treated differently cost everyone else. Whilst the only kingdom we have any knowledge of is Gondor and we are not in a position to see its benefits.
 
Apologies, double post, we should go with someone who's had more experience of the world. Sending a small team is just good sense and we'll almost certainly find ourselves needing advice
 
[X] Agree to be the Envoy
As much as it galls me to be forced to beg for aid from the heirs of Elendil's kingdom, Mayor Leofwyn and Captain Tigkiz are right. We need help, and Gondor's in the best position to provide it. Giving up our people's lives just for the sake of my pride would be inexcusable. Plus if it's not me, whoever they send instead might mess it up.

We voted last round to be a Noble Daughter of Numenor, to move in high circles and do court politics. It is no coincidence that we are now presented with a chance to do just that. Let us commit, and not shrink from the consequences of our actions.

[X] Arphazêl the Monarchist
I understand why everyone is wary of a strong leader after being enslaved by Sauron, but without someone providing leadership the Orc problem is just going to get worse. If people are worried that whoever our ruler is will become a tyrant, then we just need to make sure we pick the right person for the job.

"And that person is I."
 
[X] Agree to be the Envoy
[X] Arphazêl the Monarchist

she did not reaffirm her roots as a daughter of numenor just to throw herself to anarchism or worse republicanism.
 
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[X] Agree to be the Envoy
[X] Arphazêl the Republican

I think, if we are to manage this, we might need a Tyrant in old Roman style at some point, but we need stability more, and while centralized power would allow us to respond to things, Nûrn is not a small area geographically, plus it's surrounding an inland sea, so a republic type system would actually be better long term, as it would allow enough decentralization for rapid reactions locally, while having sufficient centralized power to react to larger external threats together. Plus if we do something like give every settlement a vote then we could potentially have an easier time incorporating new areas by allowing them to maintain their traditional styles of local government.
 
[X] Agree to be the Envoy
Let's try to put those "Lady of Numenor" skills to use.

[X] Arphazêl the Apatheist
Ultimately, the Núrniags were not her people, and Núrn not her homeland, not truly. However the chips would fall regarding its system of government, it would matter little to her conscience. As far as she knew, all the realms of her people, the true Numenoreans, were lost or desolated, but she would still refuse to admit that she could never go home.

Getting some Louis XVII vibes from the whole story.

legomithras said:
The problem with this is that there's not really a model for this in middle earth. The closest I can think of is the shire which benefits from not having to worry about a military and even then it's technically a vassal of some lost kingdom. (I learned this today!).
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There IS a model, but Middle Earth suffers from a Medieval republican imposter syndrome. Due to how organized religion worked in the Middle Ages the republics, even when they were portrayed as Most Serene and tried to holy-up the position of the ruler, were seen even by their own citizens as something limited, historically temporary in comparison to the rule of a king. And so, quite developed and progressive republics would either turn into de-facto monarchies (Orange Netherlands), use a titular Prince as their monarchist cover-up, until that Prince would decide to rule de-facto (Novgorod), or end up vassalized to a "proper monarch" and later annexed after a slow erosion of the republic's rights (Cossack Hetmanate). Middle Earth similarly has republican forms of governments, but they are portrayed as a limited, temporary form of the people waiting for the king to rise again: the people of Esgaroth trade elected magistrates for historical kings, baptized in battle, the men of Bree fold into Gondor-Arnor without any mention of dissent, and the Shire, well, at least it gets a tax writeoff in the new order... This is DESPITE no known commandments from Eru Ilúvatar about the divine rights of kings, or anything like that (if anything, it is Sauron who tried to use religious undertones to support his political domination plans). So it should be pretty reasonable to have Republican views, the problem is, everybody else is going to be like "Well, you can vote for your mayor, but there should still be a king ABOVE the mayor."
 
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[X] Agree to be the Envoy
[X] Arphazêl the Monarchist

Kir the Wizard said:
[X] Agree to be the Envoy
Let's try to put those "Lady of Numenor" skills to use.

[X] Arphazêl the Apatheist
Ultimately, the Núrniags were not her people, and Núrn not her homeland, not truly. However the chips would fall regarding its system of government, it would matter little to her conscience. As far as she knew, all the realms of her people, the true Numenoreans, were lost or desolated, but she still would refuse to deny that she could never go home.

Getting some Louis XVII vibes from the whole story.
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Very cool take, approval voting.
[X] Arphazêl the Apatheist.
 
[X] Refuse to be the Envoy
[X] Agree to go along as an Escort to the Envoy

[X] Arphazêl the Anarchist
[X] Arphazêl the Apatheist.

EDIT: Added one more vote for something that does appeal.
 
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