The Old World: Dark Age of the Empire

That said, @Warkeymon, about the Crusades Against Araby, shouldn't there be an chapter of the Knights of the Blazing Sun somewhere in the Empire? If so, could we request a diplo action to try recruit them for our cause, or open a way into our province?

They exist, but for most Imperials that's really as much as they care to know. The Knights of the Blazing Sun don't do much of note in the period between the Great Crusade and the Great War Against Chaos and as a Myrmidian Templar Order they're not the first pick of any Imperials.

As the High Temple in Nuln is dedicated to the Mother of Invention rather than to a more martial aspect of Myrmidia they're not making any moves to reach out to the Blazing Sun on their own but you can Engage with the Cult of Myrmidia to ask them to establish a chapter in Nuln if you'd like.

@Warkeymon
This vote feels a bit weird in combination with the Threfold Partition in the vote above it.

If I want Threefold Partition, is "In our Hands" the only viable option here, or are there other possible combinations?

You can also pick Our Own Trials, this would cause an Engage action with the Heir's Faction next turn. At that point if you've gone for Trifold Partition you'd be negotiating for you to get the County of Flensburg and for Averland to get a slice of the pie too.
 
You can also pick Our Own Trials, this would cause an Engage action with the Heir's Faction next turn. At that point if you've gone for Trifold Partition you'd be negotiating for you to get the County of Flensburg and for Averland to get a slice of the pie too.
Okay.

It just seems weird, to promise Averland to cut the province into three and to tell the heir that he'll rule if he passes our tests.
I guess then the Heir's part of Stirland also counts as Sylvania's?
 
Okay.

It just seems weird, to promise Averland to cut the province into three and to tell the heir that he'll rule if he passes our tests.
I guess then the Heir's part of Stirland also counts as Sylvania's?

Yes, if you put the heir into power then Vlad'll forget about any land grabbing and most of the third you'd have taken will remain part of Stirland. You and Averland only get a little bit of what you would've gotten.
 
So generally, if we pick "our own Trials", then Stirland will have equivalent of "First Partition of Poland" (each partitioner takes small part), while picking "In Our Hands" causes equivalent of "Third Partition of Poland" (each partitioner takes one-third of "whole thing") happen to Stirland

Side-Note: I'm from Poland if anyone is concerned
 
So generally, if we pick "our own Trials", then Stirland will have equivalent of "First Partition of Poland" (each partitioner takes small part), while picking "In Our Hands" causes equivalent of "Third Partition of Poland" (each partitioner takes one-third of "whole thing") happen to Stirland

Side-Note: I'm from Poland if anyone is concerned

Yes, but Our Own Trials comes with the risk of Sylvania deciding to act while you're busy with the trials and Stirland mostly being split how von Carstein likes.
 
Working on making a plan. Open to changing the mine and serial killer investigation but i think we need to do the others though.

[x] In works v1
[x] Appoint an Ambassador-At-Large
-[x] Liesel von Eigenhof
[x] The Anti-Sylvanian Pact
[x] Our Own Trials
[x] The Combined Hierarchs
[x] The Congregation of the Stirland
[x] Increase the Stipend
[x] The Auditor
[x] Agree to Both
[x] Family Matters 1 dice
[x] We do Negotiate with Ranaldians 3 dice
[x] Engage with a Neighbour 3 dice
-[x] Stirland
[x] Engage with Cult
-[x] Cult of Soll
[x] Expand Mines
-[x] Jengen Quarry
[x] Unknown Serial Killer 2 dice

No reason why Taal and Rhya shouldn't have an Electoral Vote. Sure, it will make the Otillians more powerful but hey if we want the priesthood of Verena to become Electors in the future, might as well start now with an already established god and goddess.
I was thinking along a similar line. Getting the cult of Taal and Rhya their own Electoral Vote creates a good living precedent for us to agitate for our Cult to become an Elector in the future too.

We certainly can't just let Vlad nab Stirland for himself or even just place a thrall on the Stirlander throne(?). Choosing Our Own Trials is pretty risky, we'll be seen as suckers if Vlad does decide to seize Stirland for himself. Acceding to nab Flensburg via an agreement with Vlad just rubs me the wrong way.
If we uncover that the heir is a vampire thrall or any other sort of fuckery that's even better.
Their heir's son rather than the heir himself seem to be the cats paw that Vlad seem to be angling for. Which i think we have room to disarm in the future.

I think getting Averland move in if Vlad jumps the gun is how we should counteract Vlad while we're testing the Heir.
[ ] The Anti-Sylvanian Pact
Don't you think that the secessionists are a problem in the long run?
Sure, they are loyal because the circumstances suit them, but in my opinion humanity cannot survive without a united empire.
..
This update in particular is worrying when the secessionists join forces with our pacified Sollanders.
Oh, yes they definitely are. But, the secessionists are being run on bitter Wissenland pride most of all. Their cause started when the GT left Wissenland for Reikland and von Liebwitz doing a fair job being their Elector. We could theoretically disarm the Secessionist threat by forming our Imperial Claimant Faction like some of them have been agitating for, even if its something for Eldred or his heir to pick up.
I would prefer the banker Mariele Althaus.
She has contacts and seems to be an experienced negotiator.
See, i thought the Banker wasn't bad either but i want to conduct diplomacy with the Cult of Ranald, and the Ranaldians have been targeting the Bank for several turns. Appointing a Bank Board Member as our chief diplomat will not result in anything good.
The issue I'm seeing here feels the same as that other quest of the Warhammer Advisor with the Grey Wizard, where the players kept focused on the internal affairs only, to the point of ASKING the Elector Count of Stirland if they could investigate and spread a espionage network abroad only to be told that they should have done this long ago.
It's more a thing about the Option not being put on display rather than excessive isolationism imo. But, yeah this inactivity has been resulting in us playing second fiddle to Vlad.
Ranald saved the Empire that day. They are dangerous but useful assets.
Part of why i feel that diplomacy with the Cult of Ranald will be useful to us. We could theoretically maneuver things such that Ranaldians could help us get better understanding of machinations across the Empire. Their network is good enough that it stole Elector only information after all. It could conceivably get us eyes in Sylvania too. Vlad would've purged Sylvania for Sigmarites but he can't exactly kill every thief or the downtrodden, and for all the waxing about how Vlad is a good ruler, he's a vampiric monster whose response to a plea of aid was laughing.

"Some lesser noble from the outer reaches of the county had taken it upon himself to make a pilgrimage to Drakenhof to petition Vlad von Carstein for aid in feeding his own people. The count had laughed in his face dismissively and told him to get on his knees and beg. When the noble did as he was told von Carstein laughed even harder and suggested that he might as well kiss the dirt at his feet for all the respect he had for a man who would beg at the feet of another. Instead of aid, von Carstein disenfranchised the noble, allowing him to leave Drakenhof with the shirt on his back and nothing more, no shoes, no trousers, no cloak to guard against the elements, and promised to send one of his most trusted family members to the man's home to rule in his stead. "A man should be able to care for his own, notprostrate himself at the feet of strangers and beg for mercy. It is a lesson you would all do well to learn." - Inheritance

There's definitely seeds of extreme discontent in Sylvania that would lead to a cult of Ranald.
 
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[X] Plan: Stall Vlad, expand into border princes.
-[X] Appoint an Ambassador-At-Large
--[X] Arch-Lector of Nuln
-[X] The Anti-Sylvanian Pact
-[X] Our Own Trials
-[X] The Combined Hierarchs
-[X] Refrain from Overexpansion
-[X] Pledge to Invest
-[X] Increase the Stipend
-[X] The Verenans
-[X] Agree to Both
--[X] Note that the Tax exemption is only applicable to Bugmans own deliveries and that the wording of the agreement must prevent unscrupulous merchants from using it for tax evasion.
Martial
-[X] Fortify the Border (Select a Settlement)
--[X] Heisenburg Village - 284/500 Cost: 2,000 Marks and 400 Materials per Die 1 Action
-[X] Restore the Ranks (Select an Iron Company)
--[X] The Garrison - 0/154 Cost: 1,540 Marks, 154 Materials, 1,540 Food 1 Action
--[X] The Nuln Ironsides 0/208 Cost: 208 Marks, 416 Materials, 208 Food 1 Action
-[X] Roadwarden South Cost: - 0/150 600 Marks, 200 Materials, 500 Food per Die 2 Actions
-[X] Launch an Expedition: 50
--[X] Tordorno 1 Action Cost: 16,900 Marks, 15,000 Food and 8,400 Materials
Stewardship
-[X] Riverine Docks (Select a Settlement)
--[X] City of Nuln - 231/300 Cost: 1,000 Marks and 200 Materials per Die. 1 Action
-[X] Invest in City Institutions (Select an Institution)
--[X] The Bank of Nuln - 0/250 Cost: 1,600 Marks and 300 Materials per Die 1 Action
Intrigue
-[X] Investigate Threat (Select a Threat)
--[X] Unknown Serial Killer - 150 Cost: 100 Marks per Die 3 Actions

Total: 24,748 Marks 10,270 Materials 17,748 Food

I'm going with the Arch lector as diplomat, to give the Cult of Sigmar a bone.
We are being played like a fiddle by Vlad and his Vampires, I don't care about starting wars with our Imperial Nabours when we have prime real-estate in the border princes right next to us.
Delay by hosting our own trails.
Set a precedent, give them a combined vote. Hopefully we can use this to give Myrmidia a vote later.
Wissenlands cult of Sigmar should focus on Wissenland imo.
I am going with both an action per turn and increase stipend, we have been ignoring the research actions for to long imo.
Verena is a good Goddess and I already gave the Sigmarites a bone in the ambasador seat.
On Bugman I'm going with both, with a stipulation about the tax request.
Under the Martial tab, Continue the Fortification project.
Restore the ranks to the most damaged regiments.
Start the roadwarden project.
Grab the free colony! Let's make this quick!
Under Stewardship, continue the Nuln docks project.
Invest in the Bank, we have been ignoring them and just snubbed them for a seat on our council again.
3 actions on finding the Serial Killer.
 
[X] Plan: The Division of Stirland
-[X] Appoint an Ambassador-At-Large: Liesel von Eigenhof
-[X] The Tri-fold Partition
-[X] In Our Hands
-[X] The Combined Hierarchs
-[X] Refrain from Overexpansion
-[X] Pledge to Invest
-[X] The Verenans
-[X] Agree to the Dwarf Amendment
-[X] Action-Plan:
--[X] Family Matters 1 Action 200 Marks
--[X] Restore the Ranks (Nuln Ironsides) 1 Action 208 Marks, 416 Materials, 208 Food
--[X] Launch an Expedition (Secure Stirland) 1 Action 16,900 Marks, 15,000 Food and 8,400 Materials
--[X] Riverine Docks (City of Nuln) 1 Action 1,000 Marks and 200 Materials
--[X] Expand Farms (Wusterburg) 1 Action 2,000 Marks and 400 Materials
--[X] Investigate Threat (Serial Killer) 3 Actions 300 Marks
--[X] Develop Gypsum Fertiliser 3 Actions 3,000 Marks, 600 Food and 60 Materials

Total Actions: 11
Total Costs: 23408 Mark, 9476 Material, 15808 Food

War is expensive, but the income from a fertile part of Stirland might make up for it.
At least we are not investing to conquer cursed ruins like the Ottilians did.

On another note, if we do this, we will also need to commit to two Diplomacy Actions next turn, to hash out the exact division-lines with Leitdorf and von Carstein.
Trying to make a division without direct negotiations between the heads of state will inevitably be a mess.
 
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We are being played like a fiddle by Vlad and his Vampires, I don't care about starting wars with our Imperial Nabours when we have prime real-estate in the border princes right next to us.
Investing in the Border Princes is wasted money.

Nobody ever made a kingdom that lasted longer than the next Whaagh! or similar event in there.

The Empire tried under Sigismund, but the new province can't be found on any map today.
Brettonia came there during the Arabian Crusade, but do you see many of their castles left?

If Empire-sized factions can't hold it, why do you think a single province can?
 
Investing in the Border Princes is wasted money.

Nobody ever made a kingdom that lasted longer than the next Whaagh! or similar event in there.

The Empire tried under Sigismund, but the new province can't be found on any map today.
Brettonia came there during the Arabian Crusade, but do you see many of their castles left?

If Empire-sized factions can't hold it, why do you think a single province can?

That is not exactly what happened here.
Tordorno just survived a major WAAGH without getting sacked.
All its infrastructure is still there just fine, only their leadership got killed for cowardice and the Dawi saved the colony.
If we move in now we get an already established colony with most of the hard work done.
 
Yes, but Our Own Trials comes with the risk of Sylvania deciding to act while you're busy with the trials and Stirland mostly being split how von Carstein likes.

That's why I more like "In Our Hands" option (ot, dark irony)

[X] Plan: The Division of Stirland
-[X] Appoint an Ambassador-At-Large: Liesel von Eigenhof
-[X] The Tri-fold Partition
-[X] In Our Hands
-[X] The Combined Hierarchs
-[X] Refrain from Overexpansion
-[X] Pledge to Invest
-[X] The Verenans
-[X] Agree to the Dwarf Amendment
-[X] Action-Plan:
--[X] Family Matters 1 Action 200 Marks
--[X] Restore the Ranks (Nuln Ironsides) 1 Action 208 Marks, 416 Materials, 208 Food
--[X] Launch an Expedition (Secure Stirland) 1 Action 16,900 Marks, 15,000 Food and 8,400 Materials
--[X] Riverine Docks (City of Nuln) 1 Action 1,000 Marks and 200 Materials
--[X] Expand Farms (Wusterburg) 1 Action 2,000 Marks and 400 Materials
--[X] Investigate Threat (Serial Killer) 3 Actions 300 Marks
--[X] Develop Gypsum Fertiliser 3 Actions 3,000 Marks, 600 Food and 60 Materials
 
It works because its so rare, how are our tollers even supposed to know whats real bugmans XXXXX and what isn't? And how would they check it?
? Buman is the sole producer and provider of the XXXXX. The only people that would even transport the XXXXX is Bugman's people. Is it your understanding that Bugman is trying to purposefully cheat us?
 
Master Bugman would never attempt to pass off any of the five Bugman's as one of the others, or even more shamefully attempting pass of a brew of the Bugman's selection as some foreign brew or vice versa. And Bugman's Brew (XXXXX) is prohibitively expensive and rare for an ordinary merchant to use it to subvert the tax code. At least at the moment. That doesn't rule out someone like von Eigenhof, who almost certainly has a keg or two, however.
 
That is not exactly what happened here.
Tordorno just survived a major WAAGH without getting sacked.
All its infrastructure is still there just fine, only their leadership got killed for cowardice and the Dawi saved the colony.
If we move in now we get an already established colony with most of the hard work done.
The forces of Tordorno got smashed because the tried to fight a Whaagh! on open ground.
Can't have been very defensible.

Sure, then they got saved by a Dwarven expedition, but that's more or less just luck.
The Dwarves came down from Karag Izor to smash an already very weak Whaagh and prevent it from building up steam again.
If a fresh one had come along, they'd have closed their gates and weathered out the storm, as always.
 
what if we take Our Own Trials & Tri-fold Partition together?

Warkeymon already talked about it:

It's basically a gamble. There are two situations possible:
1) Wissenland, Averland and Sylvania take small parts of Stirland, while Heir rules what's left
2) Vlad partitions Stirland between Wissenland, Averland and Sylvania in whatever way he likes
 
Oh, yes they definitely are. But, the secessionists are being run on bitter Wissenland pride most of all. Their cause started when the GT left Wissenland for Reikland and von Liebwitz doing a fair job being their Elector. We could theoretically disarm the Secessionist threat by forming our Imperial Claimant Faction like some of them have been agitating for, even if its something for Eldred or his heir to pick up.

I don't quite understand it yet, if that's the plan in the end, why vote for The Combined Hierarchs?
All three plans have this and I think it only makes sense if we are in the Ottilian Empress camp.
That's a vote we would never get.

The meteoric rise of the Secessionists means that in a few years we will have no choice but to either lay claim to the Empire or declare independence.
It becomes internally impossible to submit to a claimant if one wins the election or to support a claimant in an election.

Independence is a short and perhaps medium term solution, but once the empire reunites they will send an ultimatum.
If we can't move the mountains to our south or west to the north, I don't think we'll win in the long run. Even if we could, it would only weaken the Empire, which doesn't bode well for the survival of humanity.

If we want to advance our own claim, we should do everything we can to bring Averland to our side and under no circumstances allow other factions to create votes for themselves out of thin air.

If we don't want the throne or independence, we must start by containing the secessionists politically or we will regret it. Liesel von Eigenhof must then not be allowed to become Ambassador-At-Large. It would be bad enough that our Grand Marshal of the Iron Companies now has a direct connection to the Seccessionists.

I think it's time we decided what our goal is outside of our province. If we want to remain neutral, we need to contain the secessionists or we won't be able to claim that we support the unification of the empire if only one person wins the election.
 
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? Buman is the sole producer and provider of the XXXXX. The only people that would even transport the XXXXX is Bugman's people. Is it your understanding that Bugman is trying to purposefully cheat us?
No, the problem here isn't bugman, its other people trying to evade taxes by pretending to have (or just having some) Bugmans XXXXX in their transport.

Lets say im a decently wealthy merchant trying to avoid taxes I:
1. learn of this law
2. commission a dwarf to make me a nice barrel
3. write bugmans XXXXX on it and fill it with some good ale.
4. have said barrel on my ship and enjoy tax free passage because the tollers haven't actually seen a real XXXXX Barrel in their lives, nevermind know how to differentiate it from other good ale.
5. Profit.
 
Even if taking over a Border Princes colony had any serious chance of success and profit, it also means sending away a good chunk of our army.

With possible war in Stirland happening any moment now.

Voting for the Anti-Sylvanian Pact and then sending our troops south is effectively lying, because we actually need those troops ready to intervene, if we want to stop Sylvania's expansion together with Leitdorf.
 
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