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Deus Pater (Exalted/40k)

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[X] Defiance. Established doctrine is wrong, and the words of the Ecclesiarchy a betrayal of the God they claim to revere. Such a clean break makes further changes a lot easier to introduce, but makes you much more vulnerable to accusations of heresy and invites direct opposition.

The Ecclesiarchy eats philosophical differences for breakfast. That's a big part of what it does; there are a thousand variations of the Imperial Creed, and so long as they agree on certain fundamental points, that's enough for the Ecclesiarchy to not give a shit while the wheels of bureaucracy smother any defiance under the corpulent bosom of imperialism, corruption and institutional inertia. If we couch this breakaway in philosophy, then either we basically stay in the Ecclesiarchy proper, or we're just kicking this can down the road to when we actually break loose from the rotten, hateful edifice that is the Imperium, and then we'll have to do it with the baggage of previous dithering hanging around our necks.

This is not the juncture at which to pussyfoot around. We voted Firebrand and Cardinal for a reason: The Imperium is wrong, we have set out to rebel, so let's make a clean break of it and do some bloody rebelling!
 
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[X] Defiance. Established doctrine is wrong, and the words of the Ecclesiarchy a betrayal of the God they claim to revere. Such a clean break makes further changes a lot easier to introduce, but makes you much more vulnerable to accusations of heresy and invites direct opposition.
 
I'm not sure about the reliability of this source, but this seems like an interesting charm for a setting where gratuitous murder is the flavor of every other day.
Essence-Gathering Temper
Cost: 1m
Mins: Resistance 1, Essence 1
Type: Permanent
Keywords: Dawn, Native, Overdrive
Duration: Permanent
Prerequisite Charms: None

The more terrible the enemies and adversities they face, the greater the power of a Solar's spirit. This Charm grants the character an additional ten-mote peripheral Essence pool in accordance with the Overdrive Keyword. Whenever the Lawgiver is injured, she gains motes which are used to refill this pool: one mote for being struck by an attack without taking damage, two motes per point of bashing damage, or three motes per point of lethal or aggravated damage suffered.
Essence-Gathering Temper will only provide motes when the Solar is injured against her will; she may no more order a bound demon to assault her in order to obtain motes than she may gain them from stabbing herself. Health lost in order to pay the activation cost of a Charm likewise never produces motes.
At Essence 3+ the Solar may also refill her Overdrive pool when she perceives her allies being injured, at the same rate as though she were taking damage herself. In order to gain motes in this fashion, the Solar must directly perceive the character being injured at the moment the injury occurs, and must have a positive Intimacy toward that individual (the character's Lunar mate also always qualifies). Finally, the injuries may not be self-inflicted, as outlined above, and may not be inflicted by the Solar herself.
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Positive Intimacy: Guardsmen Being Mauled By Unfairly Large Things might be very useful to us.
 
[X] Philosophy. Construct a system of quotes, teachings and doctrine from across the ages that can be used to justify your new approach. Such a change of belief will be wide-reaching and thorough, but requires more time to convey and is easier for other priests to engage with and attack.
 
[X] Defiance. Established doctrine is wrong, and the words of the Ecclesiarchy a betrayal of the God they claim to revere. Such a clean break makes further changes a lot easier to introduce, but makes you much more vulnerable to accusations of heresy and invites direct opposition.
 
Maugan Ra said:
I should note here that 'easier to attack' doesn't mean in terms of 'priests debate with Ignatius directly' so much as 'priests sway your flock back when you are absent or prime their own congregations to disregard your message as flawed'.
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A theology thats easily defeated without our direct intervention needs our refinement too though. Thats how we know our ideas need work!
 
[X] Defiance. Established doctrine is wrong, and the words of the Ecclesiarchy a betrayal of the God they claim to revere. Such a clean break makes further changes a lot easier to introduce, but makes you much more vulnerable to accusations of heresy and invites direct opposition.
 
Sarpedon said:
To what end? At the end of the day we are a radical firebrand not some incrementalist.
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I think something to consider too is that going so hard so soon out of the gate with our schism stuff is that we more-or-less ensure that the first confrontation will happen on our terms, with our house in pretty good order, and a strong initial swell of public support behind us. And that the Imperium's first response, insofar as they have one, will be more patchwork, scattershot, and less unified as they try to piece together reports from a hostile Inquisition who doesn't want to advertise that one of their Puritan fuckbois got his ass beat by a heretical Cardinal, a Navy that doesn't know what the fuck because the Ecclesiarchy doesn't tell the local naval base anything, and a Ministorum that's frantically trying to ring up the Sororitas in the system and getting no response so either we killed them all (without anyone noticing, and with that resources? yikes) or... (and there's just no good answers to that "or").

While the Imperium can muster truly impressive amounts of men and military material that takes time and is often the result of systematically draining (often local-sector) worlds of resources and support. By ensuring that the local response is spastic and uncoordinated by essentially striking before they're ready (and Philosophy would give them time to get their shit in order is the thing) we take the local response on more favorable terms and deny any later, larger action the on-the-ground resources they might otherwise expect.
 
chocolote12 said:
I'm not sure about the reliability of this source, but this seems like an interesting charm for a setting where gratuitous murder is the flavor of every other day.

Positive Intimacy: Guardsmen Being Mauled By Unfairly Large Things might be very useful to us.
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This quest doesn't track motes for ease of use given the medium.


[X] Defiance. Established doctrine is wrong, and the words of the Ecclesiarchy a betrayal of the God they claim to revere. Such a clean break makes further changes a lot easier to introduce, but makes you much more vulnerable to accusations of heresy and invites direct opposition.

Fuck it, let's go. I've been doing some thinking, and this doesn't actually preclude going for the Imperium at large if we want. This is literally the Sebastian Thor system: Break with a corrupt and decadent church, convert the forces sent against you, and Katamari your way to Terra.
 
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[X] Defiance.

An edifice that cannot stand a challenge does not deserve power.

Either we prove ourselves correct, or prove our cause unworthy. Win Win in my book.
 
JamesShazbond said:
This quest doesn't track motes for ease of use given the medium.
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I wasn't being particularly serious about it, but even so, the thematics of drawing power from the suffering of the guardsmen as they lay down their lives for the emperor are pretty fitting (even if, more likely, the charm meant 'individual' more specifically than would be required for my interpretation).
 
JamesShazbond said:
It is still theoretically possible for this to be walked back. If the backers above us decide to cool off, which I admit is not very likely, this can be papered over by the whole living saint thing, at least until they decide a new attack plan.
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Choosing "Philosophy" is tempting...

But I expect mc to receive a summoning to another process to determine him being a Saint, one he would have the same chances to survive as Jeanne D'Arc did.

The views are just too radical, the ecclesiarchy will want to kill him.
 
[X] Defiance. Established doctrine is wrong, and the words of the Ecclesiarchy a betrayal of the God they claim to revere. Such a clean break makes further changes a lot easier to introduce, but makes you much more vulnerable to accusations of heresy and invites direct opposition.
 
[X] Defiance. Established doctrine is wrong, and the words of the Ecclesiarchy a betrayal of the God they claim to revere. Such a clean break makes further changes a lot easier to introduce, but makes you much more vulnerable to accusations of heresy and invites direct opposition.
 
Yep @TenfoldShields and @Imrix sold me on this one.

[X] Defiance. Established doctrine is wrong, and the words of the Ecclesiarchy a betrayal of the God they claim to revere. Such a clean break makes further changes a lot easier to introduce, but makes you much more vulnerable to accusations of heresy and invites direct opposition.
 
[X] Defiance. Established doctrine is wrong, and the words of the Ecclesiarchy a betrayal of the God they claim to revere. Such a clean break makes further changes a lot easier to introduce, but makes you much more vulnerable to accusations of heresy and invites direct opposition.
 
[X] Revelation. Present your new philosophy as a direct command from the Emperor himself. This is the easiest explanation for the average citizen to accept, but it is also self-contained; any change will be focused and limited to the precise topics of the 'vision', for better or worse.

We're a living Saint for the sake of the Emperor. We just got the Soritas to prove it, and we can prove it again. Time to use that, and run roughshod over what we can with it- because there's a distinct point that buck's gonna stop working, and I want to get as much mileage as we can out of it.
 
[X] Defiance. Established doctrine is wrong, and the words of the Ecclesiarchy a betrayal of the God they claim to revere. Such a clean break makes further changes a lot easier to introduce, but makes you much more vulnerable to accusations of heresy and invites direct opposition.
 
[X] Defiance. Established doctrine is wrong, and the words of the Ecclesiarchy a betrayal of the God they claim to revere. Such a clean break makes further changes a lot easier to introduce, but makes you much more vulnerable to accusations of heresy and invites direct opposition.
 
The problem with Revelation is that it'd go against our already established beliefs. "Never assume you speak the words of the Emperor, always be aware that these words are your own"
 
[X] Defiance. Established doctrine is wrong, and the words of the Ecclesiarchy a betrayal of the God they claim to revere. Such a clean break makes further changes a lot easier to introduce, but makes you much more vulnerable to accusations of heresy and invites direct opposition.

BRING ON THE ALBIGENSIAN CRUSADE

wait they lost that one

BRING ON THE HUSSITE WARS
 
[X] Defiance. Established doctrine is wrong, and the words of the Ecclesiarchy a betrayal of the God they claim to revere. Such a clean break makes further changes a lot easier to introduce, but makes you much more vulnerable to accusations of heresy and invites direct opposition.
 
[X] Philosophy. Construct a system of quotes, teachings and doctrine from across the ages that can be used to justify your new approach. Such a change of belief will be wide-reaching and thorough, but requires more time to convey and is easier for other priests to engage with and attack.
 
[X] Defiance. Established doctrine is wrong, and the words of the Ecclesiarchy a betrayal of the God they claim to revere. Such a clean break makes further changes a lot easier to introduce, but makes you much more vulnerable to accusations of heresy and invites direct opposition.
 
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