Let's Play Might and Magic

[clockworkchaos]

Part 1: Of Might and Magic, no Heroes

So like half the forum, I've been loving Omicron's let's play of the Final Fantasy Series, and, in turn, it's made me want to do a let's play of my own.

Now granted, unlike the spirit of Omicron's I'm not going to be exploring a set of famous games that are new to me, and instead I'm going to be replaying a lesser known series I loved because I want to bring it to more people. Might and Magic.

Now some of you are probably going to go "lesser known!? I loved Heroes of Might and Magic III", and yes, if I was talking about Heroes, you would be right. Instead I'm talking about Might and Magic, the RPG series that came first.



I played the shit out of MM6-8, and am looking forward to playing them again starting at 6, but…@akuz bullied me into starting with one like Omi-senpai did. As older western RPG's, they are sadly going to have a lot less character than FF, but I'm going to try to give my thoughts as I find them.

So let's start with MM1.

First, the manual. This is important, because older games didn't have the disc-space for extended tutorials, and a large part of the game intro was meant to be in the manual. Which honestly… I miss a lot. These beautifully detailed manuals that games expected you to read and enjoy.

https://www.starehry.eu/download/rpg/docs/Might.and.Magic.1-Manual-Apple2.pdf

Starting off "Might and Magic is an ongoing journey that can last hundreds of hours". I hope not, given the LP is going to be looooong if I have to do that. Making your own maps… uggggh, but I played Etrian Odyssey. I can do this. Read though huh… "Surrender may be a necessary maneuver, to get into a particular area" interesting, kill keep note of that. "Gems are required to cast higher level spells." Interesting.


Now some of you might go "wait, what? Uh, Clockwork, you want to tell us anything about the lore? This is a game with a full manual, should it… give some backstory?"

Nope. There is no backstory in the manual. The best you get is

When you begin, the uncharted world of Might and Magic is as strange and unfamiliar to you as it is to your characters. It is up to you to map the world while traveling through it.

The world is divided into towns (there are five), underground caverns and dungeons, open terrain, rivers and seas, and mountainous areas. In general, the more dangerous an area is, the more treasure you can expect to find there...if you survive"[/Manual]

Click to shrink...

There are 5 towns. Other than that. "Hey go explore this world, here are the mechanics, here are some dangers. Now go out and find stuff." I have no idea what's going on*. There is no starter quest, or even an inkling of what our end goal is. Not even a vague 'defeat ganon'. It's really trying to sell itself on 'mystery' which, with a name like 'secret of the inner sanctum' makes sense? It's a title that more about mystery and exploring that something like

"Wizardry: Proving Grounds of the Mad Overlord"
"Ultima I: The First Age of Darkness"

Both of which suggest much more… danger/combat? (To be clear those often were very mystery, but Ultima at least tells you who the bad guy is as the start)

*Okay I lie, playing MM6-8 gives me some idea but… yeah



But with all that, let's get going.



I can't do justice to this constantly switching screen in a screenshot, it is headache inducing. But seems to revolve around a orb held up by a pedestal in the shape of a claw. Now I just have to press the escape key-

… press the escape key…

Oh, my god. I just discovered my escape key is broken ARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRGH.

Okay one day of working on stuff and I managed to remap my num9 key to escape, so I can play this game.






Very old school. I can make my own characters, but I have no idea what is good or not, so… default party I guess? (there are 6 premades, you can make as many chars as you want, and you choose which ones you take out each time you exit a inn)

Also take a note of the 'go to town' bit. One of the fascinating things about old school games is the way they don't… have as many rules as games these days, can can do weird things. There are a total of 5 towns with inns, and you select which one you start the game from. This might seem like you can start the game from any, but that's… inaccurate. Once you start in a tavern, you have to gather your party, no party members in that town, no going out. The premades, and any characters you create, start in Sorpigal. So you effectively start there. If you managed to get your party to another inn, you could leave from there, but, notably, if you wanted to head back to Sorpigal you would have to use a set of characters in Sorpigal. It's… interesting, but feels very weird in the way that any mass parties are going to involve a lot of couriering people. Especially because as far as I can tell there is no reason to have multiple parties.


But onward, meet our heroes

(6 char slots, 6 classes, which from my "oh no what if I pick the wrong class" neurosis viewpoint is great)

And with that, it's time to start



A quick look around


Since we want to start mapping, I started with casting the location spell,which tells us that
Sectors C-2
Surface X=10, Y=10
Inside X=6, Y=5 Facing South

A second cast gets us a move in the X coordinates on inside, but not any others, which gives us a good idea where we are in the absolute of the map (which I checked and are all 16x16)

Exploring around gets me a



Which I'm gonna but a pin in and- my first encounter behind a locked door


A few misses here and there but a pretty easy victory… followed by the light going out.


I'm not sure why the light went out, there was text, but I missed it. But all I have to do is cast the light spell-... and I realize I'm out of sp (spell points). I'm kinda annoyed since there were visible torches on the walls so no idea why losing my light should make it go dark, but, after an embarrassing amount of time stumbling around, I remember I can rest anywhere and just uh… rest. One cast of light later and-





Oh… oh I am not where I was previously. My guess (note from the future, correct) is that I encountered a pit or trapdoor, and dropped down. The 'location' spell giving me 10' below backs this up.

A few nasty encounters force a retreat, which moves me to a 'safer tiler' in this case right next to the stairs back up. Interesting. The retreat system placing you in odd locations really adds a layer of mechanics when your base location data takes spell points (Sure it's 1,but I only have 5 right now). Since retreating can make you worryingly lost.

I end up finding my location again in the city, and find some interesting stuff, including a status with the phrase-
One by Water, One by Land
One by Air and one by Sand
The Wheel of Luck
Will Favorably Pay, the more of these Menacing Beasts you Slay!
Although Wishes May Come True
All Beast Will Become Anew

So it looks like there are elemental bosses(sand=fire?) for bonuses? I think

Also I encounter a jail that says 'stay out' and follow the advice, before opening a different locked door and getting killed by a poltergeist I didn't know to run away from until too late.

Which means no progress since you can only save at a in… or no in-game progress, I have a map much more filled out. So a sort of victory.

One issue at the moment is that there is the game is old-school enough that text is limited, and that leaves analysis a bit bare. The thoughts that come to mind are that this world feels very… unsafe. Behind locked doors in the starting town are monsters, and sorpigal feels more like a dungeon than a town aesthetically. I'm not sure if that's limited backgrounds, or meant to be that way ,but it feels almost fortressy, with broken catacombs just beneath. A place you build if your world means you can't afford to live in anything but the most fortified of places.

This speculation is then validated by statues I find on the South west, specifically the Blue Dragon statue, which states that "Before the days when the towns moved underground, dragons were few and far between." Which means yes, the town is explicitly an underground dungeon itself, and implies that deadly monsters have been grown since. I'm pretty happy that it lays out that.

Also, exploring around, I find my first encounters within the general town



This is actually surprising, as previously all encounters were behind locked doors, which felt like a layer of safety that there apparently isn't? Both encounters were around the South-West, and I explored the rest of the map (minus areas behind doors) safely, so I'm assuming it's not everywhere. (also they kill me, via being impossible to hit, but this isn't news)

I have to retreat from the sprites since I can't manage to hit them. But come back and continue exploring to find a passage outside, so hypothesis that monsters are entering the town near there.


A cast of location tells us we are at C-2 X/Y 10

So we have a decent set of mapping here since I did read all maps are 16/16
C-2 is probably the outside map. Leaving us with at min 6 outdoor maps (probably more if we assume C-2 is in the middle, then 15, which matches with the outdoor maps in MM6).

I head back in, finding stairs near the same location, leaving it ambiguous if it's the dungeon monster coming up or the outside coming in, face a group of skeletons and



For context,my tank has 12 hp at this point. So yeah, no surviving that.

It leaves me a bit worried. That's two encounters in a row that have kicked my ass. In the starting area. So I need ways to level up, but based on my MM6 experience, that usually takes gold which I used to buy armor… and encounters don't seem to give them.

Hopefully I can find sources of exp and gold that aren't as deadly. For now,I'm continuing mapping, including going to the jail. Which includes gnomes we murder, (bandits? The guards? Who knows) and cells when hilarious are unlocked going in,but lock behind you. Well come game.

As is, we have nothing left, so it's time to start exploring the dungeon, if only because of my own desire to finish things here before exploring the world. Checking in, I see the pit was actually a trap door. Some more exploring and… another death from an encounter.

I am not cautious enough in this game…

Still I've at least managed to map Sorpigal

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/110iK5UMdRrtVQEKlgnhSyx4GM01q3pETYTox4F6SDfE/edit#gid=2034773277

(side note, the manual comes with a map of Sorpigal, but I wanted to map so I could compare and make sure I had them right[/quote]

 

[Omegahugger]

As someone whose M&M experience is mostly limited to Heroes and the starter Island of 8, it is weird seeing names like Crag the Hack this early.

 

[clockworkchaos]

As someone whose M&M experience is mostly limited to Heroes and the starter Island of 8, it is weird seeing names like Crag the Hack this early.

Click to shrink...

Given the number of games where Crag Hack appears in in some form, I have to assume it was someone as NWC's dnd char.

 

[Gun Jam]

Given the number of games where Crag Hack appears in in some form, I have to assume it was someone as NWC's dnd char.

Click to shrink...

Looking it up on google - it was Jon Van Caneghem ad&d character (source. Another.)

 

[LordInsane]

As someone whose M&M experience is mostly limited to Heroes and the starter Island of 8, it is weird seeing names like Crag the Hack this early.

Click to shrink...

Yeah, we're already at two-and-a-half Heroes I heroes (the half being Sir Galand/Sir Gallant), and that's just from the default party and looking around the de-facto start town. And I know there's more familiar names to come...

 

[AKuz]

IT BEGINS

 

[clockworkchaos]

Part 2: On Combat, and Gold

This is a bit of a side-note, but Omi suggested I break down the combat which is a good idea, so you all have some context.

So Combat.


The first screen looks like this, or at least it does if no one ambushes each other, (if you get the ambush, you can opt to avoid them, if they get the ambush it forces combat).

We get a picture of one of the enemies. While this encounter has all enemies of the same type, this isn't a requirement and the limitations of this game means you will always see only one enemy. Thought the top right gives us a list of all enemies.

We have 4 options.

Attack starts a fight.

Retreat tries to run away. This option is interesting, because it doesn't work like you'd expect compared to most modern RPGs where that would simply put you on the tile you were at, encounter gone. Instead it takes you to the 'nearest safe tile'. Which is the in for Sorpigal, the entrance to Sorpigal for outside, and the stairs up for a dungeon. This means that you can't get super far in a dungeon by simply running from all encounters, but, also it acts as a safety button. If you find yourself needing to get away from a dangerous trek you don't have to try to brave several random encounters to get out.

Bribe offers monsters a bribe,which can be food, gold and/or gems(secondary currency for casting the more powerful spells). You get the choice if you accept the demands they make, and then it's give it away or combat. In the case of Rapid Jackal's you get 'no response' because uh… rabid?

The final one, surrender, is perhaps the most intriguing. Since it gives up your loot and has the monsters 'take you to a more dangerous tile'. The guidebook hints this might be the only way into certain jails and stuff, so interesting but…. Ugh giving up all your gold/gems sounds painful.

The on final bit of weirdness is all options are combatish and the opening screens…


Which is backed up by a part where it talks about how the term MONSTER is misleading and some might prefer bribery, or run away, or even help you. And I'm not sure how you deal with a monster helping you? Can you bribe someone for good things? Should you just defend? Not sure. Anyways, on to the combat screen.



It's a turn-based game. In the top left is your party formation, you can see 1 and 2 in front, with everyone else behind, and that is the order.

On the right are the enemies. You probably notice that some party members and enemies have a +marker. This marker denotes that a unit (party member or enemy) is in melee range. All attacks are either ranged or melee. Ranged attacks and spells can hit anyone. Melee attacks can only be made by those in melee, at those in melee. Some(most? So far) enemies, like the rabid jackal, have only melee attacks. So the C,D and E rabid Jackals can't attack until one in front dies. Which reduces the 'alpha strike' advantage of a lot of rpgs, since the enemies don't start doing less damage till you are down to two.

This also acts as your way of tanking, since your front two are always in melee, while your back two are never in melee unless others have gone down or the enemy gets an ambush. Weirdly the middle ones are mixed, sometimes they start in melee and sometimes they don't and I'm not sure why.

Delay/Protect/Quickref/View ch are all mechanical combat options. Ie, delay the message speed, see what spells you have active, look up character sheets.

The "Handicap" refers to the side with an advantage in speed which I think is just a buff to turn order.

On any turn you always have the option to Exchange (swap places). Use an item. Try to retreat (according to guide it's harder in combat, but increases its chance the later in combat you do it). And block, which is a basic defend command.

Our first party member, wizz, being a wizard, can't equip bows or slings, so has no ranged attack, and isn't in melee, so casting is our only option.

You enter a spell level, enter a spell number (every level of spell has up to 8 choices) and then any targets. The spells are detailed in the manual, so for example I just entered 2 and 1 to get electric arrow annnnd…



You can also see the target is now 'wounded' which means any damage, as far as I can tell there is no way other than keeping track to tell how damaged something is.

Next up is Zenon the archer, who has no spells and is not in melee,but does have a bow.


So we can shoot. Which can hit anyone.

Finally we get to one of our melee combatants (and you can see that killing the A jackal moved everyone forward)

Melee has two options. The first fight makes a melee attack against a chosen enemy in melee combat.

The second attack always attacks the first (A) monster. No advantage other than it's faster. I am wishing that game was smart enough that anyone not in melee but equipped with a bow had a similar 'attack' option that would auto-use their bow to shoot a but… well can't have everything. (note from the future, I am wrong on this, Alt-A does that)

Winning gives us a victory screen, and our reward.


Also, taking away from the literal rules, there are also the assumptions combat is built around. It's based on dnd, which means that misses are common. Compared to rpg's that don't hail from dnd rules, it often feels more random for that, a set of lucky/unlucky rolls being much more swingy than a game where the difference between a high roll and a low roll is 1000 or 1300 dmg.

The combat is… mmm. 'Unfair' is probably an okay term. Not just difficult or hard, but… unbalanced? Some encounters are easy, but some are utterly murderous. In general, in a modern game, I expect most enemies in an area to be of similar difficulty. One might be more dangerous or annoying, but you expect it to be beatable. Or if one encounter is hell, most of them will be some variation of hell as well. MM1 doesn't do that. In an area, some encounters might be easy but others…



That spray hits everyone in the party, and my highest hp character has 14 hp at this point.

I am dying a lot, and maybe I'm bad but it feels like it's more the game is just deadly.

In this game saving only available at inns(you can rest and heal anywhere, with the risk seeming to be a chance of random encounters… at least I assume, I've never had one but the game informs me that I didn't so that has implications). Right now I have only access to one inne (the starting one) and of which only 5 exist. As such I am having a lot of runs where I die and lose progress.

Yet… it's also interesting, because I don't lose everything, and the unbalanced encounters actually contribute to the one thing I don't lose. Knowledge. Not just the more detailed map I have, but I know to run from acid beasts now. I know that imps fireball but run away. I have more knowledge about which monsters I can take, and which I need to run at all costs.

So this,despite the difficulty I think largely the mechanics come together in something that works,something I can move forward with. Or would if I didn't have one tiny problem.

Gold.

Go back to the victory screen annnnnd…



It only lists exp, yeah. No gold. None of the enemies I've beaten give loot, and that's a big problem. Gold matters a LOT in Might and Magic. Not only for things like equipment, but also level. Just hitting the exp amount won't level you in MM1. Training costs gold.


(note that this pic is from the future, realized I didn't have a screenshot here and thought it was good to show the training hall)

So without gold I can't get more powerful. And resting in this game uses up food, which costs gold to refill, so unless I find gold, I'm eventually going to be out of gold and food and uh… stuck.

I end up trying both the dungeons of Sorpigal and the area outside to find enemies that give gold or chests that give it. And cast. More and more I encounter enemies that are are clearly too dangerous for me, in increasing frequency. To the point it's pretty clear that I should be a higher level, but again, no gold source, no leveling. I get desperate enough I google, and there I discover something.

Enemies not dropping gold?

Total bullshit.

The 'search' command, which I thought was to, you know, look for hidden treasure in the world? It's not. You need to use it after every encounter to actually pick up loot.

I am both annoyed and wow do I feel stupid. Checked the manual and "You should always search after defeating a monster and before moving off the square". Wow, I had not thought about how much I think of auto-gold getting after a battle as part of a turn based rpg. Like I know I had to manually loot in MM6-8, but since that game has visible corpses it fell into the part of my brain that was like "oh yeah you manually loot in games where enemies have visible corpses' compared to my brain just being like 'of course turn based is autoloot'. Shows my assumptions.

So now, I have access to gold. I have access to exp. And I know that my level 1 ass can't managed either the dungeons of Sorpigal or the outside, so it's time to grind.

 

[Omegahugger]

The first screen looks like this, or at least it does if no one ambushes each other, (if you get the ambush, you can opt to avoid them, if they get the ambush it forces combat).

Click to shrink...

That 'Rabid Jackal' sprite is so ugly cute it should probably been called a Rabbit Jackal.

That spray hits everyone in the party, and my highest hp character has 14 hp at this point.

I am dying a lot, and maybe I'm bad but it feels like it's more the game is just deadly.

Click to shrink...

It probably is just that the game is deadly. A lot of old games were more lethal in their gameplay design.

 

[clockworkchaos]

Part 3: Advancing, Grinding, Exploration

So, before I get into the grind, I do want to show a few things I found. First when I went outside I found this behind a set of trees (there are three 'wall' types in the overworld, trees seen here, which block sight but can be walked through. Denser trees, which block sight and usually, but not always can't be walked through, and mountains which I've never found one I can walk through)



… offensive stereotype aside, I went ahead and recorded these, which appear to be a combo of "color' and some nonsense worklike "ogram" which, on a hunch I tried putting into a anagram solver to get… nothing.

Another hidden one gets me to a bunch of 'minor demons' that fireball me to death.

And with that, on to the grind.

The spot I pick is-



One thing I've worked out is that MM1 random encounter rate is… honestly pretty low? It's not zero, but I feel like I can manage a lot of exploration without one. Instead, it seems to mainly use guaranteed encounters on certain tiles. These encounters are, as far as I can tell, random ones from the pool of random encounters you get, but step on that tile, and you will always get an encounter. Or at least the first time in a map you do, after that it's a normal tile, resetting when you leave the map or save at an inn.

The jail has one behind its locked door, and there is a second right behind a door to the south. Neither are far from the inn, so I can both reset them and save so I am sure not to lose progress. Grinding up to level 2 nets me near double hp (I think it's dnd semi-random? With max first level). And makes exploring below much, much more viable. Also, side note, but I have to share two of MM1's most bizarre/amusing mechanics.

First up


So this is a loot drops, (it's trapped obviously, everything is)

But open it and…



See how it says "each share"?

Yeah, that's because gold doesn't go to the party. Gold, gems and food are tallied individually. This isn't a huge limitation because at every merchant you have a "G" button for gathering all gold the party has, which you are going to use before any purchase. It's such a bizarre little mechanic, because it like… is really trying to replicate dnd groups where you do give shares. But since you control everyone…

The other one is the training. Classes have two different exp curse, a faster one for rogue/cleric/knight, a slower one for Pally/Archer/Sorcerer. That's not surprising, pre 3E Dnd did that (even if there is was individual classes). No that isn't the weird mechanic

Let me compare my level 2 knight to my level 1 archer.




Given the stats probably not noticeable, but as a hint, everyone starts at age 18.

Level increases your age by one. This is interesting in the story it tells.That this isn't a short quest that happens over an afternoon or even a year, but a quest that takes years, lifetimes. But it does create the amusing bit that we have comic book aging where everyone ages at dramatic times and thieves are going to get older than wizards.

With my first level on everyone, and around doublish hp on everyone, I'm ready to give the downstairs another go.

And discover some things.

1. Some areas cut off your spells, which turns out the lights since light is, in fact, a spell
2. Being clever and going 'oh that's why the shop has torches, for when you can't spell cast.' doesn't work because torches work by 'casting' the light spell.
3. They devs love to put guaranteed encounters in these spaces

1. Death does not prevent HP recovery

(yes really, no he's still dead and won't act)

1. It's 200 gold to rez, so better to just reset if someone dies

Incidentally I have a party member die twice to that square and it drives me nuts trying to figure out why, they go unconscious in the fight sure, but they don't get attacked again, and I can't figure it out, almost thing maybe snakes are special somehow until I realize-



It's the locked door. Normally after any combat where a person goes unconscious, I have my cleric heal them. Buuuut in this case, no magic can be cast, so without thinking I try to move out to a square I can heal, attempt to unlock the door, trap goes off, and the already unconscious member dies.

So lesson learned. Rest if you can't heal before trying to unlock a door.



Lore wise, I encounter two things in the caves below Sorpigal. The first is a courier service.

.
(I read this wrong at first and think he's offering one, and try to figure out what it might be, maybe a way to transfer items from chars in one inn to another before I realize it's a request for us to do a courier service, aka our first real quest)


This… weirdly works for me? In a way a lot of came courier service stuff feels very 'kill the basic rats you grunts.' The selling of the world as dangerous makes a courier feel more… more dangerous than places with clear working roads and developed trade networks.

The second lore bit is the Arena.



I'm initially really excited about this. The arena in MM6-8 is a good source of gold early game, and I figure it might be possible here. As it turns out, no, you can fight monsters, but not gold

Non-lore wise I encounter two things of note. The first is a swirling portal.



Which takes me to a new dungeon, to be explored later (I have to find my way back to Sorpigal but luckily it's not too far)



The second…


This makes me thinks, because I only found two cells in the jail, so going back and trying every wall, I find… a hidden passage.

This area proves very annoying to explore as while it doesn't stop magic, any light cast lasts one round. If I want to map i either have to cast like every time I move or even turn, or map very carefully. Which…. I'm mixed? If this is going to be a preview of a dungeon, somewhere long, this is going to turbo suck and I might just look up that dungeons map. But as a small section, it kinda works? Putting your mapping skill to the test by giving must more incentive to 'premap' by looking at walls and judging distances. I find a couple other hidden passage out of the extra area, getting to the northern area that appeared blank before.

The 'reward' for this area is a guaranteed encounter with some higher level monsters, which... yeah okay that's unique, but I was hoping for a chest at the end or something? Feels like there should be more.

I'm really wondering if I missed something and end up looking it up. Apparently not? Except all encounters are more difficult until I rest, which… huh leveling implications. Also I find out missed several secret doors when exploring which since as far as I can tell the look identical, means so much more work

For context


Secret door


No secret door. So the only way to tell is by trying to get through ever wall.

Mapping stuff can be fun, and working things out logically can be fun, but trying every wall isn't. Like I suspected this might be the case and have been semi-randomly trying walls,but I don't wannnnnnna. It's… honestly discouraging after a session where I felt like I was having a grasp on things.

I… I'm gonna be honest, it really makes me want to just look up maps, esp once I finished mapping. If someone who played knows a way to detect secret doors, I'd love to hear it. Ramming myself face first into every wall is not my idea of fun. Like I've talked about how unfair it is, the rest can be fun, but also like… I wasn't surprised. I enjoyed Etrian Odyssey, which is similar, if a modern take on it. But this just feels….. Uggggggh. I was hoping there would be something I could look for to try to puzzle it out, but since a lot of them aren't going to be hinted at as there isn't a distinguishing visual it feels… like a tax of 'bump into every wall. Which is frustrating

A exploration of Sorpigal level 1 yields
-A room that you can't cast magic with a encounter, nothing else
-A statue I missed earlier (not hidden)
"In Honor of Corak, For his Mapping expedition of the land of VARN and rediscovery of the Lost Town of Dusk". Incidentally this is the first mention of any land's name, and in context it's not clear if this is a specific land, or the entire world.

A second statue which reads



Hey, first real hint of a main quest. Not telling me what I'm fighting, but gotta get some brothers together.

And, finally



Which lets me TP to other towns. Given that it's hidden, I think this could be useful later, but I imagine they are murderous rn, and the biggest advantage of going to town early in most rpgs, buying op loot, requires gold which I have barely any of.

Also I visit the bar and have gold now so I remember I can buy drinks and tip barkeep


"See man in cave below!(2,1)

Checking that against my map,that's the courier location, so this would have given me directions to my first quest

One last statue hidden behind a secret door. With the

There are Many Dungeons Like Me, Find the Right Pair and You'll Discover the key
The ancient Seer og has lost his sight
The idols will help to end his Plight

So more quest hinting. (positive note, all of this exploring has pushed me to level 4)

Summed thoughts.

One thing I noticed especially with the lower dungeons of Sorpigal is there are a lot of 'dead space' dead ends, rooms that are empty. Things with 'no point' often behind guaranteed encounters. While my initial reaction to these was disappointment like the hidden room in the jail, I've given it some thought and think that it kinda works for simple dead ends?

As I said before, you get your normal progression in this game, exp, gold, probably quest triggers? But you also have the progress you as a player have. And dead rooms help that. If that room has a chest you want, then if you die, you will need to go back to get it, so that you lose all progress by dying. But, if the room is empty, then you know it's empty now, you can skip it, and choose to get exp/loot in a better spot for it. (this applies less to hidden areas, where the disappointment rules)

Secondly lore wise… I feel the caves beneath Sorpigal tell a story. Those things that are dangerous, things where you get real tasks, like a courier or arena, are located below, away from where inexperienced people could get to them. My party spends nearly 3 years in their 'intro arc' just learning to navigate Sorpigal safely before they are really ready to take on the world. Safety is limited in this world.

The biggest issue lore wise I have is the encounters that appear even in the top level of Sorpigal (and I learn later it can happen anywhere not just near the entrance(, I get that it makes it a place with its own danger/exploration, but it feels silly. Yes a world with danger all over the overworld is silly on its own, no place for farms, but I can kinda… sorta work with that? But one where you can't step outside the inn to get to the tavern without monsters… feels sillier.

Though lore in no way hints at it, the headcanon that most makes sense to me is simple, monsters won, the town is occupied and most people bow their heads. Your group are rebels, and the 'encounters' in town are guards finding you. Of course, this doesn't feel entirely compatible with staying two years but…

Well nothing is perfect.

Also updated maps

Sorpigal

Sorpigal 0,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,13,14,15 15,v,v 14,^ v,^,Ta,12>,< 13,>,> 12,^ v,3 11,^,v,Jail?,Tr,Magic Les 10,No access 9,8 8,2,<,> 7,^,v 6,7 v,Tr,Train 5,>,BS,1,Fd,Ta,Tavern 4,6,11,BS,Black Smith 3,>,Inn,10,<,FD,Food 2,5 v^,^,Inn,Inn 1,>,T,9 0,E1,E2,E1,Outside E2,Stairs Down

docs.google.com

 

[illhousen]

M&M8 was one of THE games of my childhood. I've obtained it at just the right age to be old enough to understand how various systems works and how to play more or less well rather than simply flailing around. As a result, I've spent a probably unhealthy amount of time on the game, learning all of its nooks and crannies, solving all of the puzzles and figuring out how to cheese the shit out of it. It also contributed greatly to my love of necromancers.

Unfortunately, this didn't translate to me being a fan of the series as a whole because the next M&M game I've played was then newly-released M&M9 and, well, those who know, know.

Spoiler: Spoiler for a specific M&M9 graphic bug

The model switch bug was hilarious, though. See, at random intervals models of furniture - chests, cabinets, chairs, tables, etc. - would switch to that of a dwarf woman without changing the texture or relations to other static objects. Just wood-colored torsos growing out of the walls, the floor, sometimes, IIRC, the ceiling. You could open them and take what's inside.

I did eventually played M&M7, which allowed me to appreciate some pretty hilarious design decisions in M&M8. This is... probably the most refined game out of that M&M era? Probably the best entry point for someone interested in trying out the series without going into trenches of old school gaming.

Anyway, I know exactly nothing about M&M games before 6 beyond the fact that they've established some of the Deep Lore for both the RPG series and Heroes offshoot, so this should be interesting. Hardcore old school gaming with zero expected modern QoL is absolutely not my thing, but seeing someone else struggle through would definitely be interesting.

 

[clockworkchaos]

M&M8 was one of THE games of my childhood. I've obtained it at just the right age to be old enough to understand how various systems works and how to play more or less well rather than simply flailing around. As a result, I've spent a probably unhealthy amount of time on the game, learning all of its nooks and crannies, solving all of the puzzles and figuring out how to cheese the shit out of it. It also contributed greatly to my love of necromancers.

Unfortunately, this didn't translate to me being a fan of the series as a whole because the next M&M game I've played was then newly-released M&M9 and, well, those who know, know.

Spoiler: Spoiler for a specific M&M9 graphic bug

The model switch bug was hilarious, though. See, at random intervals models of furniture - chests, cabinets, chairs, tables, etc. - would switch to that of a dwarf woman without changing the texture or relations to other static objects. Just wood-colored torsos growing out of the walls, the floor, sometimes, IIRC, the ceiling. You could open them and take what's inside.

I did eventually played M&M7, which allowed me to appreciate some pretty hilarious design decisions in M&M8. This is... probably the most refined game out of that M&M era? Probably the best entry point for someone interested in trying out the series without going into trenches of old school gaming.

Anyway, I know exactly nothing about M&M games before 6 beyond the fact that they've established some of the Deep Lore for both the RPG series and Heroes offshoot, so this should be interesting. Hardcore old school gaming with zero expected modern QoL is absolutely not my thing, but seeing someone else struggle through would definitely be interesting.

Click to shrink...

Gonna be honest if I get all the way past 8 I'm gonna thing reallllll long and hard about if I'm actually doing 9. I probably should but... I don't wannnnnnt to.

 

[LordInsane]

That is... understandable. You can see the potential for a good game in 9, but it's lost in a lot of bugginess and other signs of the game plain not being finished. That's a different kind of slog than a 1986 game being designed like a game from 1986.

 

[clockworkchaos]

That is... understandable. You can see the potential for a good game in 9, but it's lost in a lot of bugginess and other signs of the game plain not being finished. That's a different kind of slog than a 1986 game being designed like a game from 1986.

Click to shrink...

Yeah it's..

As a result of a long franchise, any came I play from 1986 is probably going to be a good game for 1986 because if it wasn't, it wouldn't have launched a franchise. By contrast the latter games, especially the very unfinished IX, don't have that. (Though in fairness HoMM IV was also rushed and unfinished and I love that).

I might try anyways, because I will admit I've never given it a super fair shake since I was salty about it also losing the 6-8 engine that I loved.

 

[illhousen]

A lot can be forgiven to M&M9 given that the transfer to full 3D did a number on a lot of companies at the time, but one sin that remains is the replacement of dress-up character models with concept art.

Dressing up your little guys in progressively more fancy clothes, culminating with artifact wear, is, like, the whole point of the game.

 

[firefossil]

M&M8 was one of THE games of my childhood. I've obtained it at just the right age to be old enough to understand how various systems works and how to play more or less well rather than simply flailing around. As a result, I've spent a probably unhealthy amount of time on the game, learning all of its nooks and crannies, solving all of the puzzles and figuring out how to cheese the shit out of it. It also contributed greatly to my love of necromancers.

Click to shrink...

For me it was #7. Its kind of weird in hindsight that 6-8 all released in a three year timespan yet I only ever got or played one of them, because it was the one my dad got, and to this day I have never played or know much of anything about the other two.

Looking at #1, it makes me think of how various strains of games have evolved from D&Desque graph paper based tabletop RPGs.

A: Dungeon crawler roguelikes have preserved the brutal difficulty and obtuseness, doubled down on the make your own adventure elements with procedural generation, but in some cases have not really advanced mechanically or even graphically.
B: Might and Magic added visuals, shifted to first person view, eventually dropped the graph paper, and started including real time as an option.
C: Bioware RPGs stayed top down, also tended to mix turn based with real time gameplay before dropping the turns entirely, and operated characters as separate objects rather than a homogeneous mass of party.

Might and Magic has kind of died out with no real inheritors... but I think that's because big studios now just make C RPGs only while indie studios do A RPGs. Might and Magic's model exists in this weird transitional space between graph paper RPGs and modern computer games that is just kind of obsolete.

 

[clockworkchaos]

For me it was #7. Its kind of weird in hindsight that 6-8 all released in a three year timespan yet I only ever got or played one of them, because it was the one my dad got, and to this day I have never played or know much of anything about the other two.

Looking at #1, it makes me think of how various strains of games have evolved from D&Desque graph paper based tabletop RPGs.

A: Dungeon crawler roguelikes have preserved the brutal difficulty and obtuseness, doubled down on the make your own adventure elements with procedural generation, but in some cases have not really advanced mechanically or even graphically.
B: Might and Magic added visuals, shifted to first person view, eventually dropped the graph paper, and started including real time as an option.
C: Bioware RPGs stayed top down, also tended to mix turn based with real time gameplay before dropping the turns entirely, and operated characters as separate objects rather than a homogeneous mass of party.

Might and Magic has kind of died out with no real inheritors... but I think that's because big studios now just make C RPGs only while indie studios do A RPGs. Might and Magic's model exists in this weird transitional space between graph paper RPGs and modern computer games that is just kind of obsolete.

Click to shrink...

I'd honestly make the argument that the elder scrolls is the inhertor. It's a single party member but compare say, daggerfall screenshots to mm6.

 

[MoogleEmpMog]

For me it was #7. Its kind of weird in hindsight that 6-8 all released in a three year timespan yet I only ever got or played one of them, because it was the one my dad got, and to this day I have never played or know much of anything about the other two.

Looking at #1, it makes me think of how various strains of games have evolved from D&Desque graph paper based tabletop RPGs.

A: Dungeon crawler roguelikes have preserved the brutal difficulty and obtuseness, doubled down on the make your own adventure elements with procedural generation, but in some cases have not really advanced mechanically or even graphically.
B: Might and Magic added visuals, shifted to first person view, eventually dropped the graph paper, and started including real time as an option.
C: Bioware RPGs stayed top down, also tended to mix turn based with real time gameplay before dropping the turns entirely, and operated characters as separate objects rather than a homogeneous mass of party.

Might and Magic has kind of died out with no real inheritors... but I think that's because big studios now just make C RPGs only while indie studios do A RPGs. Might and Magic's model exists in this weird transitional space between graph paper RPGs and modern computer games that is just kind of obsolete.

Click to shrink...

Might and Magic's addition to the formula was an explorable overworld using the same gameplay style as the dungeons, not graphics and a first-person view.

Wizardry is the game that shifted to that viewpoint, and the one that gets referenced when games of that style crop up. Which they do quite frequently! I think they might actually be the most common style of electronic RPG released again, at least outside of RPGMaker ultra-indies.

Etrian Odyssey (big collection released last year), Labyrinth of Refrain/Labyrinth of Galleria (new game just last year), Strangers of Sword City, Saviors of Sapphire Wings (first western release just a year ago), Mary Skelter (new game two years ago), Operencia: The Stolen Sun (released two years ago), and many more. All of these are first-person, turn-based, party-based RPGs with an emphasis on exploration and challenge.

The Megami Tensei series even traces a direct line to this style, although they've moved away from first person since the early entries.

 

[clockworkchaos]

Might and Magic's addition to the formula was an explorable overworld using the same gameplay style as the dungeons, not graphics and a first-person view.

Wizardry is the game that shifted to that viewpoint, and the one that gets referenced when games of that style crop up. Which they do quite frequently! I think they might actually be the most common style of electronic RPG released again, at least outside of RPGMaker ultra-indies.

Etrian Odyssey (big collection released last year), Labyrinth of Refrain/Labyrinth of Galleria (new game just last year), Strangers of Sword City, Saviors of Sapphire Wings (first western release just a year ago), Mary Skelter (new game two years ago), Operencia: The Stolen Sun (released two years ago), and many more. All of these are first-person, turn-based, party-based RPGs with an emphasis on exploration and challenge.

The Megami Tensei series even traces a direct line to this style, although they've moved away from first person since the early entries.

Click to shrink...

Yeah, love me some Etrrian (map making in MM1 is a bit of a choice since I have no dedicated mapping tools, EO mapmaking is fun) , though those...

I almost think of them as usually a side branch? Something that takes the gameplay, and evolves it, but is very niched targeted at 'maps and exploration' part, which weirdly I think MM stops giving the same focus on with MM6 onward (maybe earlier but 6 is the next one I know for certain). Hence why I put Elder Scrolls as the 'evolution' in that very free-form 'yes we have a main quest but go do what you want, explore what you want' way. Where quest tend to not have the choices that something like bioware-like quests do, but you trade that for the freedom to be able to basically 'pick a direction, start walking'.

If that all makes sense?

 

[Embler]

For me it was #7. Its kind of weird in hindsight that 6-8 all released in a three year timespan yet I only ever got or played one of them, because it was the one my dad got, and to this day I have never played or know much of anything about the other two.

Click to shrink...

For me it was 6! Played it a ton, but when we eventually found a copy of the Millenium Edition bundle, I had moved on to greater things like Neverwinter Nights. Without the driving force of nostalgia, I never really got into the rest of them.


It's tough to engage with some games this old, because modern assumptions really don't apply. It's not designed as something you'll sit down and play from start to finish, making steady progress. If you did make steady progress, it probably wouldn't take you too long to beat! The pitfalls and failure cascades are part of the experience.

Or maybe I was just too scared off by the most extreme example of the genre- if you haven't read this Wizardry IV LP, you should!

 

[firefossil]

It's tough to engage with some games this old, because modern assumptions really don't apply. It's not designed as something you'll sit down and play from start to finish, making steady progress. If you did make steady progress, it probably wouldn't take you too long to beat! The pitfalls and failure cascades are part of the experience.

Click to shrink...

Part of what I liked about playing Might and Magic is that for the most part it wasn't level gated nor had enemies scale. You could clown on enemies way below your level in that dungeon you missed earlier. You could wander into areas that were way beyond your level and see if you could cheese or sneak your way through anyways. In either case those areas could be right next to one that actually is in line with your current party strength.

In many cases it felt like the game wanted you to delve into areas that exceed your level, because if you want to achieve Grandmaster rank in Potato Peeling you have to visit the grandmaster that lives in a swamp filled with hydras, and with the flexibility you got from the precision of the turn based system mixed with the evasion of the real time system you could believe you could somehow do a mad dash to say hello before the hydras digest your face.

 

[clockworkchaos]

Part 4: 3 Doors down

So with the exploration of Sorpigal complete, I have two options. 1 is to do some overworld exploring, the other is the cave I teleported to. In truth, I do a bit of both, while generally in games I like to finish a area, I don't know which areas are the next 'logical' choice difficulty wise. So I test both, eventually coming to the conclusion the Cave is probably safer? And go for that.



This is the opening to the cave, which is literally 3 doors. 2 of them lead to hallways but the third…




Oh old-school dnd dungeons, where you could have giant slides that lead to acid. Does it make any sense to have giant slides in a dungeon rather than some simiplier trap?

No.

But it does let the game massively relocate me (you get to watch the screens fly by fast enough you can't see where you are going) so as to challenge mapping skills by requiring me to recast location and map discontinuously, and also, slides are cool.

After painfully determining that anytile in the 'slide' will send me down to the pool, I try the only other route, which leads to




Uh oh

I try to run away and fail, and am forced into combat where I'm almost certainly going to die from 16hp aoe-



Huh… here where I discovered something.

The 16 hp aoe? Isn't.

Last time both Acid blobs used the aoe and did exactly 16 hp, so I assumed it was that much. This time I got aoe's ranging from 0 hp to 11. Still murderous if I was still first level but beatable.

I'm… it's weird, that should be good news, because it means I can get through them, but I'm actually disappointed? I think because it reduces my knowledge base. "This enemy is deadly" I can deal with and adapt. "This enemy has a range of dmg that goes from trivial (1 hp) to deadly (16 hp) isn't. It's a die roll" Which is less… useful knowledge?

But even with that, I take my victory and go to see where I got teleported to…



Well shit. Magical darkness (spells work, but light doesn't).

Okay. And light isn't working, so what about location



… 10' under. I'm on the second level, oh dear

In total darkness I stumble around, mapping and casting locations when I get lost, slowly finding my way out until…





Hmmm, I'm just gonna… go the other way I found…. Actually you know what? I've only a few fights this dungeon, I don't have much to lose, so I'm going to bring knowledge, yolo

But beforeI do, I cast light and discover that the area of darkness was much smaller than I realized

Going down the corridor my first encounter is easy but counters me in the most ingenious of ways… it hands me a greatbow,which means I now have something to lose if I die. Fiendish.

I go explore the other way, annnnnd



Leading to another dead end that is gonna to poof me. Another poof leading to… huh, same place I poofed originally, so at least I don't have to start mapping from scratch or find myself deep in the dungeon.

More exploring finds…



New and maybe dangerous? Guard does imply maybe reasonable/intelligent? Checking bribe options and… no response. Fight it is

I find these enemies are immune to my weapons, and have to beat a retreat, heading back to save before going in again. A few more encounters with ogres (way too much hp) and 8 acid blobs (too many) leads me to conclude I need another round of grinding.

This time, I opt for a spot I found in my exploration of the dungeons of Sorpigal


This hallway is a series of 4 tiles that all give encounters, behind one locked door, which is more encounters per run and less doors than the previous one, and, more importantly, they are all consistent. Same monsters, every time.

The first two are monsters that don't give gold, but aren't difficult
But the last two are the prize. Skeletons are gold dropping monster, and weak to turn undead, a 1 mana spell that usually kills all or all but ½ of them, and costs only 1 SP (serena has 5 SP max per level)

But the real prize are these the giant ants

Not the easiest enemies, but not deadly in any way. And they tend to drop chests. Chests have gold, but, more importantly, have items. I've gotten things I can't buy in the store, like plate mail and even a +1 Bow.

And that +1, is what I'm really grinding for. I don't know it, but a lot of dnd has monsters that are immune to non-magical weapons, or ones below a certain + number. After grinding to level 5, I managed to secure a +1 ax, bow and dagger for my warrior, archer and robber respectively. I don't have one for my paladin, but that's okay. With my new, tougher team, it's time to challenge the dungeon again.

Also level 5 gets new spells, including the key wizard spells "Fireball" and "Lightning bolt". Which are my first AoE spells. Fireball hits up to 5 but can only be used on enemies not in melee range, while lightning can be used in melee, but only hits 3. They both cost gems though.



A set of Ogre's give me a test to see if my party can handle the monsters here. (the answer is no)

Ouch. A few rounds of testing show that spot is another 'fixed' encounter, always fight, always ogres, and reveals another key information piece. If I retreat from them, and come back, the encounter is 'used up' which means running isn't entirely useless. And I'm able to find the Ogre path is a dead end.

A very nice day. WIth confirming the Ogre path leads to a dead end, it's time to try the guard path (who also seem to be fixed). My theory that +1 weapons would work is proven correct, and while slow, the guards don't do much damage to me and waste turns with dispel.

Behind them is… (hilarious I thought it was magical darkness at first, before realizing while writing it up the dispels they cast in combat dispelled my light)



Welp, why not?

This turns out to disable the slides, allowing more exploration, and means I end up staying longer than I want, as exiting the dungeons would make me since I don't want to have to re-push the button, leaving me to let some of my guys stay poisoned (max hp decrease on each rest)


That is, in fact, 2 and 1 max hp

Find another shimmer portal and take it because… well why not?





Going up reveals myself to be 'in town' so I think I found the second town. Not where I want to be rn, but worth knowing. Heading out and…



I knew I should have gone all female! I stumble around town until an encounter kills me. I do note the blacksmith is described as 'supremely beautiful young woman' and uh… combined with male draining, I have my suspicions about her.

Still a lot of knowledge gained

I head back in, exploring the entire dungeon and finding… nothing. I go to the 'hall of endless encounters' head in and find an encounter, and another, and another. And I figure 'okay one encounter each square, I can deal. Only to, at one point, turn around with mapping and find…

I am only two squares in. Every encounter puts me back a square. After puzzling it I gave up and looked it up.

Turns out the solution is a level 2 wizard spell 'jump' which moves you forward two tiles. Honestly… that's on me. I should have gotten that, jumping over the hazard square lets you continue on, to get to the end. I could argue that the 'hallway' made me think the entire hallway is trapped, but the game gives you a subtle hint by making the first few tiles not trapped, which should hint it's only specific ones.

Good show game.

Going to the end, I find…



At first I figured this is like, some special monster, and would have left, with no knowledge further, if I hadn't done one last map check online to make sure I didn't miss anything.

So it turns out it's talking about 13 guaranteed encounter spots in this dungeon. Gonna be honest I would never have figured that out if i hadn't looked it up. The jump one feels clever and one me for not figuring it out, this just feels like trying to parse what the game wants.

But, time to go for the prize. I have to take all 13 encounters without leaving the map.

So, all 13 encounters without leaving the map. I tried a few times, and I've managed to learn to deal with the ogres (the answer is lightning bolt, spam it, can you only cast it 5 times before you are out of mp? Yes. That's fine, rest after each encounter). No, the problem I have is poison. Since poison halves the max hp of anyone after resting, it's a run killer. I don't get 'cure poison' as a spell until level 7 which is two levels away (and 2 levels probably trivializes the fights honestly). And don't have access to any items that cure it, so I have to go back to town to heal. If I was being poisoned in the fights, I could at least have ways to help, go splurge on scrolls of fire and go all out on the poisoning enemies.

But it's not. Instead, the poison is happening from traps when I open doors or loot and my thief robber fails to disarm. (You may ask: Clockwork couldn't you not loot chest to increase your odds?

I would reply: You shut your awful mouth)

Eventually I settled on a hybrid approach. I give my best try, but if poisoned, I go back, heal up and save, and try again, slowly gaining exp.

Record of runs since determining this path forward

1. Ogre fight has to many ogres, die(I can deal with up to 5ish,not 8)
2. Poison darts on fight #4 chest
3. To many cyclops on fight #2, die
4. Have a MAJOR REVELATION as I realize the 'protection from poison spell lasts all day (aka till I rest), not one combat. Which means I have a method of not solving my problem, but at least mitigating it. Finally make it past the first 4 fights without getting poison! (forced to retreat at fight 5, continue to see if retreat counts)

I manage the remaining fights annnnnd-



Bronze key… interesting.

But that's for another time, rn it's time to go back and save

So while I still think the hint was ridiculously obtuse, I'm actually far more pleased with the quest than I thought. It feels almost like a… final exam? Of the mechanics of the game so far?

1. You have to understand out of combat spells, you've almost certainly gotten 'light and location' already, but here you need to add the idea of long-term protection from poison and jump.
2. You need to understand that this game allows you to rest frequently. I literally rested after almost every encounter, because they were hard, and I needed to have full mana to lightning/fireball spam. This really broke my final barrier on limiting rests.
3. Accept using gems. Look I hate using stuff that uh… usable up. The old 'save every potion' here, there is higher level stuff I might not use, but I spammed fireballs like they were going out of style. Even with it, I was net positive on gems because fireballs cost 1, and enemies that drop gems can drop 25ish.
4. You need to accept not all encounters are winnable, retreating from one still nets you victory.
5. The guards force you to get some +1 weapons

All that said, it is still semi-random, I'm betting you can still get an unlucky poison eve with protection, and running is far, far from guaranteed. But I'm… ultimately satisfied? Feels like the final exam before you can proceed to the second town, of which the cave leaves a portal for you.

Lore wise…. There isn't much here. "A crazed wizard did it" is basically a joke these days. A serious watsonian analysis isn't going to turn something up.

Doylistically though… it's old school Dnd. More than anything else this dungeon is very old school dnd. "Why is there an elaborate dungeon?" Because Wizard. There are three doors before you, one is trapped, no there is no way to tell. Your wizard has 'sleep' and 'web' spells early and lvl 5 with fireball, fly and lightning bolt is a game changer.

So yeah, dnd.

No map this time as I accidentally saved at the wrong time and broke it, and used a online map

 

[Indivisible]

I wonder if the individual gold count is intended to block the Wizardry 1 exploit where when you create a party member they added their gold to the party's, so you could just keep creating and dismissing party members to get more gold. Of course, Wizardry 1 saved after every action you took, meaning that a party wipe meant that you had to start over with Level 1 characters, meaning that that sort of thing was more necessary.

In terms of Indie Might and Magic successors:

The Legends of Amberland series is probably the closest to MnM, with an open world, turn based combat, pay to level up, and the like

The Legend of Grimrock series is closer to after MnM goes to real time combat.

Paper Sorcerer is Wizardry 4 but less incredibly difficult.

 

[clockworkchaos]

I wonder if the individual gold count is intended to block the Wizardry 1 exploit where when you create a party member they added their gold to the party's, so you could just keep creating and dismissing party members to get more gold. Of course, Wizardry 1 saved after every action you took, meaning that a party wipe meant that you had to start over with Level 1 characters, meaning that that sort of thing was more necessary.

In terms of Indie Might and Magic successors:

The Legends of Amberland series is probably the closest to MnM, with an open world, turn based combat, pay to level up, and the like

The Legend of Grimrock series is closer to after MnM goes to real time combat.

Paper Sorcerer is Wizardry 4 but less incredibly difficult.

Click to shrink...

That exploit is already blocked by new chars always starting with nothing though (only the premades start with equipment and gold). And you can force transfer gold, so it wouldn't stop that.

 

[clockworkchaos]

1.5 It's for the combat advantage I swear

So… There is an oddity with Might and Magic, one that I've kinda been avoiding for a bit, but have to confront.

It's open world.

In something like Final Fantasy, you have a game that tells a story usually pretty linearly with some side-quest. Racist Western Devs aside, that's a pretty good way to do it, and for all Bioware toutes choices, they usually do the same.

This game isn't like it.

Nor is it like most of the open world games of today where it is often level-set so that all areas are appropriate for your level, or, at least you know very quickly when they aren't.

Both types of games tend to lead to a gameplay where you go to a place/quest/dungeons. Complete that place/quest/dungeon, and go on to the next one. Even something like Skyrim, which I consider the evolution of the latter MM games, and one of the most 'oh look at that' type games, tends to have you complete your dungeon, and then get distracted on the way to your next one.

Here… that isn't true. For one thing, I don't go into any dungeon knowing it's difficult, at least until an encounter. And the game's encounter rate of random encounters is low. It's balanced around the fixed encounters, so if I don't find those I can end up going around the area a lot before realizing I should go somewhere else. Adding to that, further in areas tend to have more diversity of creatures, so I end up fighting packs which have one high level guy and several low levels and think 'okay this is a place I can take' before the pack with all high levels comes in and I go 'oh'.

The narrative problem here is that discussing a place fully is good, it's narratively satisfying and easier to follow, but I should note that the appearance of such is, to a degree, a lie in this LP. I'm almost always poking at multiple areas in bits until I determine I can finish one and follow that. But the cleaner narrative here is a historian's fake.

All that said, my thought is that the game naturally is pointing me to portsmith. I have a portal to it, and I swear I saw a bronze gate there (forgot to screenshot) before I got the bronze key, I went back and checked, but it appeared normal now, so not sure if it was a case of the key meaning it didn't count, or I misremember.

But… well I don't have to, and I kinda don't want to? I want to start exploring the overworld, I don't like the idea of traveling via portals only now knowing a basic way to get back (spoiler, the fly spell, instead of letting me cross mountains at I thought it was, let's me select a overworld map and instal port there, so getting back to Sorpigal is easy)

I start with the Northern Map, C-1, which provides the first indications of human civilization outside the towns I've seen.




First indication of human civilization I've seen.



So apparently there are trade networks? Huh…

The Wagons lead to ambushes, mostly with monsters that are higher-level than the random encounters, and kill me sometimes, though carefully trying all of them leads to one with a "Merchant Pass".

Also I find a icy regions

(Fun fact the limited data means the tilesets are colored by region you are in, not inherent to the particular mountain, so looking at this mountain one tile back makes it look non-frosted)

C-1 Finishes with no other major discoveries, and I opt to now try East of Sorpigal
D-2. There I encounter-





The desert seems force you to be 'lost' by randomizing/forcing turns in a particular direction (not sure which). While it's possible that this area is navigable, it seems like I'm probably going to want to find some item/quest to help mitigate the heat. (I know protection from fire, jump and levitation all don't work)

Also I do find a new tileset

(it acts as a basic forest, blocking vision but not travel)

With nothing else of interest in D-2, I decide to tackle underportsmith rather than continuing to explore, mostly on the basis of getting close to level 7, which gets the cleric's first aoe spell, lightning bolts. It's outdoor only, so I figure level 7 will make outdoor a lot easier, but not change indoor that much. Underportsmith I encounter a central passage with 4 directions and, I opt to start exploring the side, managing pretty good progress until-




Ohhhhh shit.
(prettys sure this is a very specific fixed encounter as it's in front of a door)
(I die before I even get a round, given this is no-where near the difficulty of any other encounter, I'm sure this is a specific 'fuck off' encounter. Behind that door is probs endgame stuff)

That sends me outside again. (Getting lightning bolt, which turns out to not be nearly as good, since it's non-melee only and my cleric is slow enough she usually doesn't cast until later in the round when most non-melee are dead, unlike my wizard who always goes first).

I opt to go exploring outside for a bit finding some new monster and a cave









I get a Broadsword +2 and decided to head out to save. Going back to save and equip stuff I look up what things can be equipped where (yes I'm looking it up online, the system for trading items between chars is a pain, and trying each person to see what the requirements are for this weapon is just… annoying , and notice something odd.

Might and Magic 1: Items List

Complete List of Items from Might and Magic Book One: The Secret of the Inner Sanctum in sortable table with category filters...

www.oldgames.sk

That broadsword can't be equipped by either of my melee fighters (Neutral and Good) because of alignment restrictions. Fine it's evil right? ,But the table says +2 broadsword is good only and…



Crag Hack is now evil

And looking at it, all my neutral characters are now good, and my good now neutral. I did something evil and I… have absolutely no idea what? Did I kill something I wasn't supposed to? (Spoiler from the future, yes. Turns out opening a fight with Unicorns or pegasi with hostility is evil, even if the bribe/surrender option forfeits all your gold. What do those greedy ponies need it for anyways.)

Well it doesn't matter really this is old school dnd where alignment is just teams. The level 5 spell "Restore Alignment" restores anyone to their original, at the cost of 2 gems (that's two fireballs, aka 1 easy fight). So Gal is now good and everyone else… eh, I'll get to making them non-evil eventually.

Maybe

I head back in to find-

A fixed one.

First one that's fixed.

Continuing exploration I find 10-16 fixed, and… it's a magic square. I'd like to say I figured that bit out myself, but I'd stumbled upon the fact that MM1 contains a Magic Square dungeon earlier by accident. That said, I did solve the square myself.



I am a cool dudette. (the gems and gold are tiny, exp is okay, the int is unique and awesome thought)


Finishing that I opt back to the dungeon under pondsmith, feeling like I'm strong enough to really take it. This time I opt to take the straight path and-



(that is, by the way, the other side of the tile where the demons killed me, turns out if I had gone from the front way, I would have known. It was supposed to force you to go around, but I went around the first time, and didn't know).

I continue to explore to find



I step in to get a reversal!

Zenon III: What?
Wizz Bane: Fascinating we seem to have had our gender reversed

Sir Galand: We should…. Probably go back to our original genders… you know 🙁
Wizz Bane: Actually maybe we shouldn't
Sir Galand:?
Wizz Bane: Well, tactically, the area above seems to drain males, so if we want to continue our quest, it would be only wise to remain female
Sir Galand: You are right!
Swifty Sarg: Didn't we decide that was succubi lust?
Wizz Bane: We all know Serena's a flaming lesbian and she wasn't drained

(The party looks over, to see Serena in a catatonic state)

Sir Galand: Well, I mean… that is reasonable. It is vital we complete our quest. And changing to a girl would help it, not that I want to be a girl or anything, having fantasized about it. But you know… for Justice.
Wizz: You know the rest of us are still evil, and haven't have our alignments restored?
Zenon III: Speak for yourself, I was always evil, damn unicorns.
Swifty Sarg: What about Crag? is he gonna be okay, he's always so manly-

Crag: I'm gonna wear the prettiest unicorn pelt dress and have so many cute weapons-
Zenon III: He's fine, so we're agreed no: changing back?
Serena: FUCK NO. YOU GIRLS DO WHAT YOU WANT BUT I AIN"T STAYING THIS WAY, TURN ME BACK INTO A WOMAN.

(this actually is a pain since I can only use the pond once a time each trip, so I have to exit, go down to change everyone back, then go up, remove Serena from the party, and go back down. The only saving grace is Wizz is now level 7, and while the lvl 4 spells don't add much firepower, they do add the amazing time warp, which is a 100% guaranteed run away, so I can use it to clear fixed encounters without risking death or worse- ⅚ of the party getting exp and one member not and having uneven exp counts).

I find a few fountains, one that poisons me and one that-

Okay… that is good enough I need to figure out what 'worthy' is to make sure everyone gets it. Looked it up and… turns out it's everyone 'worthy' just means made it there.

With the party now able to explore the town without drains


Really?

Also every female shopkeeper is described as hot, which I theorize is because all the party is sapphic, but the succubi are comphet enough they only drain from people they see as males. Tragic.

More exploring finds a few points of interest.


Brother.. Hmmmm. The statue back in Sorpigal mentioned two brothers.

But yeah, after mapping the town, I find two notable unmapped areas, the first is by the temple which I check every wall, to nothing. The second,more promising, is a series of 10 by 1 by one rooms, with each back up against inaccessible rooms, I go through each one (requiring a unlock and a fight) to finally find the opening on the final room, and find…



Zenon III: Lady I promise you it was not hard.


Well, this is definitely not a fight I can win. (thankfully retreat works, but yeah, notes for later).

And with that I am done with Portsmith mapping, and have a high end boss to fight later. (also serious complaint, why is the boss with greater devils, when 3 lesser devils is a challenge right now ? It's like… frustratingly out of scope with the area)

But with Portsmith done, and my characters feminized a good time all around. With no more portals suggesting new places, it's time to explore the open world

 

[illhousen]

Well, that's an unexpected turn. Definitely a game written by a bunch of 80th AD&D nerds. You can smell the dev room from here, across time and internet.