Are the five magical materials indestructible?

Only when worked into an Artifact, and even then 'not exactly indestructible'- that gets into a weird which-edition morass too. But basically the 5 MMs + Adamant have phenomenal properties on their own, but don't really do anything until worked into a magical craft or device. The point of the MMs is not their innate material properties like say Steel or Copper has for the 'real world', but that they have assocations and thematic resonances that in turn interact with Creation and Essence in general. Basically an 'Artifact' is a device that shapes Essence into a specific effect, it's just that the language/grammer for that effect is complex and multi-layered.

Take a Daiklave for example- it is 'Sword Magic'- that is to say, by creating a tool that is Symbolically (and practically) a sword, and adding in the Magical Materials in the right way, it creates the Daiklave statline as it's 'Magic'. Yes the Daiklave is sharp, sword-shaped and so on, but without investiture of Essence, it's at best a giant heavy sculpture.
 
Alright thanks. The /tg/ thread had been arguing about whether they were indestructible and how that effected Warstriders for like two days and I wanted an actual answer. Ironically someone posted evidence they weren't indestructible right after I posted this.
 
Alright thanks. The /tg/ thread had been arguing about whether they were indestructible and how that effected Warstriders for like two days and I wanted an actual answer. Ironically someone posted evidence they weren't indestructible right after I posted this.

Oh, Warstriders (Magitech in general) from 2e at least CAN be destroyed/damaged. That's part of the weakness of Mtech is that it's more fragile outside of specific exceptions. Of course, that gets into the thematic morass of what Mtech is supposed to do/how is it different from regular artifice and so on. Which 3e (4chan firmly adhering to 3e) doesn't contend with as much.

Basically even an 'indestructible' 2e artifact can be damaged by specific action, it's just that non-mtech repairs itself miraculously at the start of the next scene. A shattered Daiklave restores itself whole and unmarred unless another effect prevents it from doing so. I can't speak for how 3e handles it sadly, so you'll have to trust the thread or other sources.
 
...I suppose this is the correct thread for this.

Okay, in Revlid's She Who Lives In Her Name charmset, and related custom Yozi charmsets (Isidoros, Metagaos, Elloge, ES's Szoreny and Oramus), there are 'Infernal Geomancy Charms' inspired by an edit of canon's Holy Land Infliction.

These Charms, as part of their text, describe how they warp Creation's environment, and how any Wyld-Tainted land they are used on becomes pure- if Yozi-tainted- Creation.

My actual question, therefor, is what about Shadowlands? Do these charms close them? Do they warp Shadowlands the same as regular environments? Do they not work?

Now tagging the two people most obviously qualified to answer the question @Revlid @EarthScorpion

As a broad guideline for interpreting Charm text, charms only do what they say they do. In an exception-based system, it's important to read exception-blocks fairly strictly.

Hence, since they do not say they close shadowlands and do not say they cannot be used in shadowlands, they can be used in shadowlands but do not close them.
 
Alright thanks. The /tg/ thread had been arguing about whether they were indestructible and how that effected Warstriders for like two days and I wanted an actual answer. Ironically someone posted evidence they weren't indestructible right after I posted this.
The magical materials are hyper-durable in Ex3, but not literally indestructible. Without an Exalt or mighty crafting god dedicating effort to destroying it, though, it won't be destroyed. I highly suspect there are daiklaves just chilling deep inside volcanoes, waiting for an eruption to throw them back out into Creation.
 
As a broad guideline for interpreting Charm text, charms only do what they say they do. In an exception-based system, it's important to read exception-blocks fairly strictly.

Hence, since they do not say they close shadowlands and do not say they cannot be used in shadowlands, they can be used in shadowlands but do not close them.
Fair enough. Its just that Yozi and Necrotic stuff doesn't generally mix, so I was wondering if there was any interaction.
 
A question. Solar exaltation. What, exactly, does it look for? I mean, I'm looking at Arianna's situation, she faced sexism and ostracisim, but never gave up. Conviction and Valour. That's the virtue. She was a scholar, a learned woman. There's the excellence. But what, exactly, triggers the solar exaltation?
 
A question. Solar exaltation. What, exactly, does it look for? I mean, I'm looking at Arianna's situation, she faced sexism and ostracisim, but never gave up. Conviction and Valour. That's the virtue. She was a scholar, a learned woman. There's the excellence. But what, exactly, triggers the solar exaltation?

As a rule, all Exaltations look for: "Healthy and Whole, Free Will, Willingness to use the power."

It varies from edition to edition, but the common consensus is as follows:
  • Solar: You step up to do something amazing, and in the act of stepping up, you are Exalted as a Solar and then Do the Thing.
  • Lunar: You are put through a situation or achieve something amazing, and then by enduring the great hardship or challenge, you are Exalted as a Lunar
  • Sidereal: You are selected by Fate at the moment of your birth and live a charmed life that prepares you indirectly for your role as a Sidereal Exalted. You Exalt as the stars dictate.
  • Dragonblooded: You go through an intensely stressful situation during your early years (puberty, essentially, but possibly before or after), which awakens the blood of the Dragons within you.
  • Abyssal: You must be heroic and otherwise qualify for a Solar Exaltation, but you are killed- just before you actually die, the Exaltation makes you an offer- kill the world and everything in it in exchange for life.
  • Infernal: if the Solar Exaltation requires you to step up, the Infernal Exaltation looks for those who had the chance to, and failed. Either as a failing of their own morality and convictions, or by actually attempting the feat and failing.
 
A question. Solar exaltation. What, exactly, does it look for? I mean, I'm looking at Arianna's situation, she faced sexism and ostracisim, but never gave up. Conviction and Valour. That's the virtue. She was a scholar, a learned woman. There's the excellence. But what, exactly, triggers the solar exaltation?
Doing what other people won't. It doesn't even have to have you do anything. In First Edition, Panther Exalted because the Sun saw something in him no one else did, and Exalted him. It was only with the Exaltation that the brutish thug decided to change his life. Solar Exaltation goes to those who will use it to do grand things. Those who stand up and say "I'll fight this injustice." "I'll get my revenge even if it kills me." "No child will ever lose their parents on my watch again."

Solar Exaltation asks that you be willing to use it and do something that matters. Be great. Doesn't care if you're terrible, mind. Just so long as you're great with it.
As a rule, all Exaltations look for: "Healthy and Whole, Free Will, Willingness to use the power."

It varies from edition to edition, but the common consensus is as follows:
  • Solar: You step up to do something amazing, and in the act of stepping up, you are Exalted as a Solar and then Do the Thing.
  • Lunar: You are put through a situation or achieve something amazing, and then by enduring the great hardship or challenge, you are Exalted as a Lunar
  • Sidereal: You are selected by Fate at the moment of your birth and live a charmed life that prepares you indirectly for your role as a Sidereal Exalted. You Exalt as the stars dictate.
  • Dragonblooded: You go through an intensely stressful situation during your early years (puberty, essentially, but possibly before or after), which awakens the blood of the Dragons within you.
  • Abyssal: You must be heroic and otherwise qualify for a Solar Exaltation, but you are killed- just before you actually die, the Exaltation makes you an offer- kill the world and everything in it in exchange for life.
  • Infernal: if the Solar Exaltation requires you to step up, the Infernal Exaltation looks for those who had the chance to, and failed. Either as a failing of their own morality and convictions, or by actually attempting the feat and failing.
Not actually true. You don't need to be healthy and whole. Exaltations are fine Exalted the broken and the crippled. That was an ableist 2eism and has gone the way of the dodo, and good riddance to it. A scared child with a broken back can Exalt the same as a career warrior who has shrugged off sword blows and infection with ease. Humans discriminate, Exaltation doesn't.
 
Yeah. About that.

I got several ideas, for solar exaltation:

1. A doctor, of no small skill. Compassionate and hardworking, he entered a country where it was struck by plague. Tirelessly, he treated them, with little food and rest. He treated them as mass graves piled up around him. He treated them as the village he entered was quarantined and he was left to die with his patients. He treated them, as, one last patient laid before him. The last survivor of the village, still struck by plague, with her family long dead. He held her hand, answering her as she called for her mother and father, letting her think she did not die alone.

2 days after he buried her, the plague appeared on him. As he lay sick and dying, he thought of his life. And decided that, given the chance, he would simply bring more medical supplies. It was then that he exalted.

2. A sorcerer, serving a kingdom in the threshold. A hardworking one, who served the kingdom with all his heart. He negotiated with gods and elementals. He brought crops to fields. He burned away disease and mended broken artifacts. He summoned Sesseljae and Aideara, and treated the weqlthy and powerful in exchange for favours and donations. The kingdom prospered, yet he was always ever humbled. No titles, no adornments, and no great palaces.

He exalted as he was overlooking plans for canals and sluices, for irritating the fields
 
A canon night caste exalted for saying "fuck this" about his homeland's shitty caste system and deciding to take a cheap murder contract instead of a street sweeper and then strangling the target in an alley.

(now he's an awful fucker who murders rich people and lives their lives until their wives go "wait why is my husband suddenly so horny all the time")

You don't need to do something amazing to exalt. 2e fandom kind of pumped up the expectations for what a mortal should do to be worthy by a TON
 
A canon night caste exalted for saying "fuck this" about his homeland's shitty caste system and deciding to take a cheap murder contract instead of a street sweeper and then strangling the target in an alley.

(now he's an awful fucker who murders rich people and lives their lives until their wives go "wait why is my husband suddenly so horny all the time")

You don't need to do something amazing to exalt. 2e fandom kind of pumped up the expectations for what a mortal should do to be worthy by a TON
Panther literally just watched the sun rise. That was it. He went on to do amazing things...but what he did to earn it? Walked out of the bed he shared with three different women every night, saw the sun rising, and Exalted.
 
Panther literally just watched the sun rise. That was it. He went on to do amazing things...but what he did to earn it? Walked out of the bed he shared with three different women every night, saw the sun rising, and Exalted.

The point of Panther that the memes forget is that he looked at his life of excess and decided 'I can do more than this'. *That* Exalted him.
 
That was an ableist 2eism and has gone the way of the dodo, and good riddance to it.
As was mentioned the last time this came up, 2e has a sidebar that says healthy adults are preferred because they generally already have the ability to act on the power. It was never 'you can't have a disability'.
 
2e Scroll of Heroes had the flaws where you got extra bonus points if you were missing pieces of your body. Exalts got fewer points out of it because it's trivial to negate the penalties they applied if you put a little work into it as an exalt, and they IC justified this by being ableist shits about it.
 
As was mentioned the last time this came up, 2e has a sidebar that says healthy adults are preferred because they generally already have the ability to act on the power. It was never 'you can't have a disability'.
Yeah, this.

This is also, y'know, not actually ableist. It's just more open to the, "you can be the disabled person who overcomes prejudice; here are some narrative tools to do so," brand of disability rights stories than the "here is a story where the disabled person gets to have no problems and face no discrimination for once," version. Both are valid paths with their respective virtues (do you want cathartic triumph or a soothing utopian vision?) and failure states - the latter, for example, often risks justifying the lack of discrimination by some form of technological/magical 'solution' to disability, which is verrry easy to read as presenting disabled people as a Problem to be Solved... But that's a whole other topic.
 
A purely hypothetical question.

Let's say you build a building. Well ventilated. Well lit. Put in a bunch of beds. Stock it with food.

Summon a bunch of aideara and stomach bottle bugs. Give them the command. "Heal anyone who is inside."

Anything that can go wrong with this? Demon behaviour that can go wrong? Some obscure clause that I didn't read of? Will the stomach bottle bugs explode from too much poison?

Aideara, the Sky-Sewn Brides
Demon of the First Circle
Progeny of the Meteoric Twins

The aideara are inhumanly beautiful women, idealised copies of the form Kinmaya's lover wore in life. To look at them is almost to fall in love, and it takes a cruel heart or an iron will to raise a hand against one. If one looks closely, the delicate tracery of stitches running across their bodies is visible, like an intricate web of tattoos which accentuate and emphasise their beauty rather than detract from it. Few find themselves in the position to make this discovery, however, for the sky-sewn brides love only Kinmaya, and to love or have sex with another is an Unacceptable Order to them. For all their beauty, they are chaste, and will not consensually accept intimacy with another.

Aideara share one mind in many parts, the transferred consciousness of the woman who Kinmaya fell for in times long past. The love between the Brides and their creator burns strong to this day, and every aideara has a Motivation simply of "Love Kinmaya". She gave her lover more than immortality when she made a race of First Circles from her, though. The aideara are accomplished medics, gifted with the same skill and patient knowledge that allowed Kinmaya to create them in turn. Sewing severed limbs back on, transplanting failing organs or treating trauma wounds from battle comes as naturally to the Sky-Sewn Brides as breathing, and no mortal can match their talent.

Although they may be First Circle demons, they have the heart of one of the Second Circle, and they are, one and all, citizens, for Kinmaya spends much political capital, and gives greatly to the Priests of Cecelyne for such respect to be afforded. Even if that were not true, though, the aideara share a mind, and they do act to revenge themselves should any inhabitant of Malfeas offer discourtesy to any one of them. In this, they show a remnant of the woman they were crafted from, an edge of her sharpness and wit, which they do not show around their lover and creator.

Summoning: (Obscurity 2/3) These demons are often summoned as medics, for transplants or battlefield treatments. In the last five years, they have also been summoned to serve as necrosurgeons, and that they perform with the same calm contentment as they do the repair of an arm. In addition, their collective mind has seen many things, although compared to the teodozija, they are much younger, and have their origin in the Age of Sorrows. Sometimes, when a woman has lived a chaste life of unrequited love, one will be called to her when she dies. Then they will take her apart, and sew their own flesh into her, making a new sister-self from her remains, the old memories added, dimly remembered, to the collective, while they all enjoy the pure love of their beloved. They can also be called out of Malfeas by the tears of such a woman; in those cases, the Bride offers to make her beautiful and give her love unending. If an agreement is made, the woman is smothered by dexterous hands, and remade. Summoners who wish to enjoy their beauty may do so, but from a distance; any attempt to engage in sexual contact with one will cause it to gain one point of Limit an action, and unless ordered to be silent, they will object most strenuously.

Motivation: Love Kinmaya

Virtues: Compassion 5, Conviction 5, Temperance 5, Valour 4

Attributes: Strength 2, Dexterity 5, Stamina 3, Charisma 3, Manipulation 3, Appearance 7, Intelligence 3, Wits 3, Perception 4

Abilities: Melee 1 (Surgical Tools + 1, In Defence of One's Virtue +2), Integrity 4 (Remaining Faithful +3), Performance 3 (Singing +1, With Kinmaya +2), Presence 2 (Inhuman Beauty +3), Resistance 4 (Resisting Diseases +3), Survival 2, Craft (Air) 3, Craft (Fire) 2, Investigation 1, Lore 2 (Eastern Folk Tales +1, Methods of Life Extension +2), Medicine 6 (Repairing Flesh +1), Occult 5 (Demonology +1, Second Circle Demons +2), Athletics 3, Awareness 2, Dodge 2 (Against Grapples +3), Linguistics 5 (Forest Tongue, Old Realm, plus others), Socialise 3 (Polite Distance +1)

Backgrounds: Backing 3 (Kinmaya)

Thaumaturgy: The Aideara have a Master-level degree in the Art of Demon Summoning, and will instruct others in it; notably, they know "Beckon Kinmaya", and will preferentially teach that to anyone who asks. They are also versed in the Art of Elemental Summoning, the Art of Geomancy, and although they do not make this knowledge available, the Art of the Dead.

Charms:
Divine (Medicine) Subordination– Only on acts of surgery and other kinds of flesh crafting and sewing; it can be used to graft a hand from a fresh corpse onto a person and make it work, but it cannot be used to diagnose or treat disease.
Materialise
Benefaction
– Blesses rolls to recover from injury or fight off infection
Touch of Grace – Only to heal, leaves thin scars which do not heal as a Crippling effect. Healing Crippling Effects requires access to spare body parts, which are used in the repair.
Shapechange – May convert her hands into any tools needed for surgery or medical operations.
Portal – To the side of the most injured, still-living person within 10 miles, and affects its user with an irresistible Compulsion to do everything in their power to save the patient.
Divine Perogative – To remain faithful to Kinmaya
Plague of Menaces – Other aideara, and, via a contract of Kinmaya with Alevua, the insects of Malfeas.
Second (Ability) Excellency – Medicine, Integrity, Performance, Resistance
Third (Ability) Excellency – Medicine, Integrity, Occult

Join Battle: 5
Attacks:
Medical Implements: Speed 5, Accuracy 9, Damage 5L, PDV 3, Rate 3
Soak: 1L/6B (Perfect Skin +0L/+3B)
Health Levels: -0/ -0/ -0/ -2 / -4/ -4 /-4/Incap
Dodge DV: 3 (5 against grapples) Willpower: 8
Essence: 4 Essence Pool: 80

Other notes: Much like the teodozija, the aideara share one mind, though they are bound less tightly. With a successful difficulty 4 (Intelligence + Lore) roll by the demon's player, the sky-sewn bride may briefly access the aideara shared mind to learn any information relevant to a situation at hand that is known by any other aideara, or, at difficulty 5, that was known by any mortal woman who was made into a sky-sewn bride. An aideara will tend to accumulate fresh body parts, which, by an application of her saliva, she stops from rotting, which she will use in her medical repairs, and will collect parts from any patients she cannot save to use on ones that she can. They have a refined sense of aesthetics, and so will attempt to make the best match of a part to their current patient, but it is not uncommon to find that a patient now has one arm a different colour to, and more muscular than, the other one. The aideara may only use fresh body parts; ones where rot has set in are useless to them.
 
Summon a bunch of aideara and stomach bottle bugs. Give them the command. "Heal anyone who is inside."

Anything that can go wrong with this? Demon behaviour that can go wrong? Some obscure clause that I didn't read of?
Well, you should remember they'll heal anyone, including people you don't like, as long as they are inside the building. They also won't ask to tend to people- anyone who walks into the building will be examined for any injuries or sickness, then be subjected to surgery or having a giant insect swimming around inside them whether they want to be treated or not.

The latter is only a problem if you care about people's reactions to your demon hospital, and changing it to 'treat anyone who asks in the building' would eliminate it.

...While also creating a situation whereby an unconscious person brought to the building wouldn't be treated unless they were woken up to ask themselves.
 
Last edited:
Well, you should remember they'll heal anyone, including people you don't like, as long as they are inside the building. They also won't ask to tend to people- anyone who walks into the building will be examined for any injuries or sickness, then be subjected to surgery or having a giant insect swimming around inside them whether they want to be treated or not.

The latter is only a problem if you care about people's reactions to your demon hospital, and changing it to 'treat anyone who asks in the building' would eliminate it.

...While also creating a situation whereby an unconscious person brought to the building wouldn't be treated unless they were woken up to ask themselves.
See, what I immediately thought of was that one of the demons would start offering to push patients ahead in the queue in exchange for bribes, followed by many, many complications as other demons join in on that, engineer bidding wars, try to arrange for having things they like smuggled into the hospice in, and just generally try to manage the situation the way they would in Malfeas - grab what you can, shiv anyone who's eyeing up what you grabbed, establish who's in charge of your metaphorical cell block, and always assume you're about to be fucked over.
 
I mean, the obvious problems would be the Aideara turning women who show up into more aideara, possibly consensually, or teaching people how to beckon more Aideara into creation, who are not bound to any orders, or enacting plans to jailbreak Kinmaya, who they love, into Creation.

Or all of the above.

Other pitfalls:
Stomach bottle bugs convincing mortals to bring them booze and drugs and assorted toxins to gorge themselves on until they die.
Demons deciding they don't like healing anymore, and barricading all the entrances to the building so that no one can get inside and require healing.
Demons getting bored when they have no one to heal, and hurting each other and/or random mortals so they can heal each other again, and forming a bizarre torture-cult.
Demons trapping mortals inside the building and refusing to allow them to leave so that they have someone to heal.
Someone knocking the building down, and having a large herd of demons in Creation trying to figure out what "inside" means now, and whether their binding is complete now, or they're obligated to heal everyone in the world since inside and outside are the same now, or whether they have to rebuild the building so they can fulfill their binding.
Demons, over an extended period of time, dividing up into factions and having a tiny civil war.
Demons wandering off to nearby villages to amuse themselves, as long as enough stay behind at any given time to handle any required healing.
 
2e Scroll of Heroes had the flaws where you got extra bonus points if you were missing pieces of your body. Exalts got fewer points out of it because it's trivial to negate the penalties they applied if you put a little work into it as an exalt, and they IC justified this by being ableist shits about it.
Kaiya said:
Not actually true. You don't need to be healthy and whole. Exaltations are fine Exalted the broken and the crippled. That was an ableist 2eism and has gone the way of the dodo, and good riddance to it.
Again, this is not the case and an attempt to paint 2e as some kind of aberration. This is the relevant passage from both the 1e (Players Guide) and 2e (Scroll of Heroes) versions of the Amputee flaw where this comes up,


So if you take issue with this, that issue is with Exalted as a whole as it has always been written, not that 2e by itself somehow perverted the intentions of a once broadly-accepting, all-inclusive game.

1e's Player's Guide in particular drew a focus on the disabled as the fiction for the Merits and Flaw chapter itself, introducing us to Emerald, someone with very real, very deliberate problems stemming from the inequalities of the time and how the proliferation of magic and even the presence of Exaltation is not a society-wide balm for conditions like his. Can it be seen as overly maudlin and uncomfortable in how quick it is to narratively cast him aside once he's served the purpose of detailing his victimhood? Oh it sure can, it was written like 14 years ago and representation of the disabled was nowhere near as conscientious as it is now. But much like most of Exalted's writing which focuses on mortals, the point here is that people like Emerald exist in Creation at all and not swept under the rug by vague notions of mystical public-works and the goodwill of demigods.

The critique of power is pretty blunt here, and uncompromising in how it says that yes, if you're the war-mongering type who seeks to solve everything with shows of military force, the moral judgement lies on your shoulders not to overlook the human cost of your campaign. Even in a setting where Exaltation is universal and unbiased, there will always be vastly more who end up like Emerald rather than win big in the grand scheme of things, and Creation will never be especially kind to those who can't fight the Social-Darwinists of the world on their own terms.
 
I mean, the obvious problems would be the Aideara turning women who show up into more aideara, possibly consensually, or teaching people how to beckon more Aideara into creation, who are not bound to any orders, or enacting plans to jailbreak Kinmaya, who they love, into Creation.
What are aideara, by the way? Also, who is Kinmaya?
 
What are aideara, by the way? Also, who is Kinmaya?

It was in the demon description posted above by Accelerator. I don't recall encountering them before, so I imagine they're homebrew demons, but the blurb given for them was straightforward enough.

They're some kind of hive-mind of stitched together nurse demons. Kinmaya is listed as both their progenitor and obsessive love interest, so probably a 2nd circle demon.
 
Back
Top