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Losing Mhonar gives the Orcs full access to the Underway, which means you open up a second front on Karagril as well as the new front at the Eastern Valley.

Right, how could i forget about the bloody Caldera. Oh well, maybe we're lucky and Gorfang decided that bashing his head into Mors defenses was getting boring and took over the Waaaghboss position in Karak Drazh in Birdmunchers absence.
 
In the same vein, how the hell will the Dragon respond to Orcs, after we told him there was a dwarf king around?
The general theme with the dragon was that if its rest got disturbed it would break out the genocidal cans, and that they expected this to only happen after the dwarfs had gotten steamrolled.

Presumably anything except getting cute and deliberately funneling the Waagh into its den will fulfill that expectation.
 
It knows the orcs are coming, intends to destroy them if they give it trouble, and says Mathilde can consider that it taking vengeance for her death if she likes.
Ok. So that makes plan two more viable again. Let them come in the caves. Let them face traps. Let them wake a dragon in the face. That's why they are here anyway. Dragon won't care for how many snotlings there are.

This boss is uniquely suited to killing the Dragon though. Big on ranged and anti-air. Which is less useful underground, where we'd force them all with the Eye.

Counter-counter point: We know there are tunnels too small for the dragon. Those would be a problem for it.
 
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Ok. So that makes plan two more viable again. Let them come in the caves. Let them face traps. Let them wake a dragon in the face. That's why they are here anyway. Dragon won't care for how many snotlings there are.

This boss is uniquely suited to killing the Dragon though. Big on ranged and anti-air. Which is less useful underground, where we'd force them all with the Eye.

Counter-counter point: We know there are tunnels too small for the dragon. Those would be a problem for it.
The Wyvern Caves are below the point on Zilfin claimed by the dragon, so unless they deliberately turn and go punch Sparklebutt, it isn't going to be a factor.
We've plugged Yar's escape route, as well as other fissures, towers, and side-doors, but our problem is the Wyvern Caves on Zilfin. They haven't actually held Wyverns since the days of the ancestors, when Grimnir slew them and they fed him and Grungni and Valaya during their work here, but they are a massive network of caves, too massive to block off in the time we have. We could take a heavy toll off them trying to climb up build their way up it, but we'd also be exposed to anything they might have in the way of siege weapons or other surprises. It's also below the point the Ice Dragon has 'claimed'.
 
Ok. So that makes plan two more viable again. Let them come in the caves. Let them face traps. Let them wake a dragon in the face. That's why they are here anyway. Dragon won't care for how many snotlings there are.

This boss is uniquely suited to killing the Dragon though. Big on ranged and anti-air. Which is less useful underground, where we'd force them all with the Eye.

Crossbows and wagon mounted looted guns are not going to help him against this particular dragon. He tore through Skryre, and they had much heavier arms available. Also, If Birdmuncher shows his face above ground we'll melt it of, so he will have to face the Dragon underground, or do what Mors and Eshin did and hide from it in smaller side caverns.
 
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Hmmm... a thought for later, when we either go scouting or send out scouts. Where in the column of Orcs is Birdmuncha?

Orc psychology, and warhammer tactics in general, tend to suggest that a leader should be near the front, and not in the rear, which to me suggests that he'll be entering the Caldera at some point unless we divert them into the Wyvern Caves. Since we don't plan on doing that, he'll probably get in range of the Eye of Gazul.

I suppose the more relevant question is: can our lens array give us good fidelity for sight of the West Gate, so that we may know when he comes in range and make a special note of taking the opportunity?
 
If we did the west gate approach, we could leave the tower to someone else after the initial blast, and then move towards the Wyvern caves and make their advance hell with shadows and chaos, making them consider going above the mountain towards the dragon.
 
The Wyvern Caves are below the point on Zilfin claimed by the dragon, so unless they deliberately turn and go punch Sparklebutt, it isn't going to be a factor.
Unless the fight turns out big and noisy and the Orcs use inaccurate Orc siege weapons against the Wyvern Caves' defenders, like they very well might. One unlucky miss could easily hit the side of the Dragon's new home.
 
I feel like Orks immediately yeeting themselves on dwarves fortifications at a full sprint is suicidal even by their standards.

If they muster in the Caldera, they can be nuked with the Eye, if they do yolo the citadel, the stream of Orcs can be defeated piecemeal.
 
I feel like Orks immediately yeeting themselves on dwarves fortifications at a full sprint is suicidal even by their standards.

If they muster in the Caldera, they can be nuked with the Eye, if they do yolo the citadel, the stream of Orcs can be defeated piecemeal.
The problem is that while the Citadel will hold the Karaks are all full of holes. We've seen this happen at Karagril, there's just too many entrances.
 
The Wyvern Caves are below the point on Zilfin claimed by the dragon, so unless they deliberately turn and go punch Sparklebutt, it isn't going to be a factor.

Well, it should be noted that the Orks almost certainly have no intel about what we accomplished in K8P over the last 24 hours. As far as they know every mountain should be full of enemies to fight. Therefore i could easily see the Waaagh splintering with a bunch of them running of to fight ratty boiz or those moonie gitz if we make getting to grip with us too frustrating for them.
 
Well, it should be noted that the Orks almost certainly have no intel about what we accomplished in K8P over the last 24 hours. As far as they know every mountain should be full of enemies to fight. Therefore i could easily see the Waaagh splintering with a bunch of them running of to fight ratty boiz or those moonie gitz if we make getting to grip with us too frustrating for them.
That really depends on the Boss. If he's on the ball he'll try to steer all the Orcs in one direction. If not, we might see a spread similar to that of the Karag Rhyn greenskins, where some orcs go into every mountain.
I'm not going to stake anything on the hopes that the dragon might get forcibly involved.
Considering our options involve basically trading space and hoping the Waaagh runs out of Orcs before we run out of places to run to, I'm not against any options that might cut into their numbers.
 
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The Wyvern Caves are below the point on Zilfin claimed by the dragon, so unless they deliberately turn and go punch Sparklebutt, it isn't going to be a factor.
Crossbows and wagon mounted looted guns are not going to help him against this particular dragon. He tore through Skryre, and they had much heavier arms available. Also, If Birdmuncher shows his face above ground we'll melt it of, so he will have to face the Dragon underground, or do what Mors and Eshin did and hide from it in smaller side caverns.
Thing is, they came because of a Dragon Roar. They could be coming for it's head. The minute the first snotlings go up there (and some of them will spill in every direction) the dragon wakes up, and the Orc Boss has his target, IF the Dragon is his main target.

After all, what's a better, more propa fight, then an Emperor Dragon? Espetially, if the stunties are running and hiding?

EDIT: Votes away!

[X] FIRST LINE: Caldera
[X] SECOND LINE: Hold
[X] THIRD LINE: Eastern Valley

Hold them for a few hours and melt them again from the Citadel. If we hold, the core breaks, and we fall on their backs. I'll not gamble on the dragon.
 
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Moratorium's up. I think the thread zeitgeist has consolidated around this slate of choices, which is nice. I'm gonna go try the new Imperator patch.

[X] FIRST LINE: Caldera
Sucker punches are the best punches.

[X] SECOND LINE: Hold
Pro tip to anyone planning to wage infantry warfare: do not concentrate your force under guns emplaced in an enemy fortress! It never ends well!!!

[X] THIRD LINE: Eastern Valley
If things get this bad, we'll do a better job holding here than underground; we're going to want most of our artillery above ground for the first part of the plan, so the Underway will be brutal tunnel fighting. Would rather have the Eye and air support available.
 
New guy to the thread. It's been a journey.

Though I don't think this has been asked before, but if the Orks are getting bottlenecked by the west gate while getting pummeled by artillery fire, wouldn't their shamans decide to do something about that immediate threat? By widening the gate opening via magical means, or returning fire on artillery positions, or even both?
 
New guy to the thread. It's been a journey.

Though I don't think this has been asked before, but if the Orks are getting bottlenecked by the west gate while getting pummeled by artillery fire, wouldn't their shamans decide to do something about that immediate threat? By widening the gate opening via magical means, or returning fire on artillery positions, or even both?
*Laughs in Kragg, Thorek, and Mathilda*
 
Though I don't think this has been asked before, but if the Orks are getting bottlenecked by the west gate while getting pummeled by artillery fire, wouldn't their shamans decide to do something about that immediate threat? By widening the gate opening via magical means, or returning fire on artillery positions, or even both?
The Shamans can certainly try to do a bunch of stuff, but Kragg the Grimm and Thorek might have a say. And if Kragg the Grimm or Thorek have a say about what an enemy caster can do, that enemy caster should really reconsider casting that spell.
 
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