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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
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Nimbus said:
Skywalk might be usable as a 'slow fall' spell; alternatively, it might simply cause its user to go splat against the air rather than the ground.
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Yeah, IIRC Boney ruled that Skywalk is effectively creating a surface to step on, so casting it while falling means that there's a rather high chance of you breaking a foot or something. At worst it is probably a splat and then we have to pray the Seed works on us.

Nimbus said:
If we're willing to delve into new territory, maybe a spell akin to D&D's gaseous form - just transform into a cloud of smoke/mist shortly close to the end of the fall, letting air resistance and amorphousness do the work! Could be useful as a safer but less versatile Substance of Shadow-equivalent in other circumstances, too.
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IIRC something like this is viable but extremely dangerous to make because even if your theory about the spell is extremely solid, there's always a chance that in practice the 'turn back into a solid person' part of the spell might fail when you first try it out.
 
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Does smoke and mirrors shed momentum in the same way that rune of the unknown does?

Just do the teleport as you are about to hit dirt

Andres said:
Bet there's been an uptick in nobles pestering dwarf engineers for gyrocopter commissions since Mathilde started flashing around her gyrocarriage.
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Given the way you can hear a gyrocopter for miles and navigation tends to follow landmarks, there's probably a whole swath of the empire that thinks "oh, the dwarves are protecting us" because she flies over so often.

So that means every noble between eightpeaks and Laurelorn is gonna be looking to get on that list as soon as they start asking questions about the flights.

I bet the next electoral count meeting it's when it really takes off.
 
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Man I really hope it's not rude to just ping someone...

@Boney heya, nice t'meet'cha. Don't mind the dust, I've been clawing my way out of the archives since about three weeks ago when a friend who reads gave me the hard sell. Roundabouts Mathilde getting dismissed by Roswita I got bit by the need to get back into QMing myself, which split the reading time a little, but at last, at LONG LAST, I am current. I have not seen the sun nor the stars for many days and nights now; I have forgotten the taste of food or the warmth of wine. But I'm caught up.

I'm gonna have to summarize my thoughts; after a million words and change, there's not really another option. Lemme open up by saying this: I was told of your work here in terms of glowing praise and incredible investment and I was, if anything, undersold on the quality. I don't gotta tell you that Warhammer is an intimidating interest to break into, and you've distilled a deep and wide canon into something understandable to casual or even new readers/players/enjoyers while also relentlessly giving it touches of attention and humanity that the people paid to add to that canon often fail to or scorn. The aggressive dedication to showing Mathilde putting in the work rather than passing it off as like "hey you've taken control of the Watch" is humbling in its scope, and one of my favorite things to see in written works. You've got a strong, distinct voice for every character, and while PoV changes are used sparingly each one stands out and could never be confused for any of the others. The end result is that, barring its staggering length, your Quest here is possibly the most approachable and nuanced bit of WHF fiction I've ever come across.

It ain't all playing the hits but even the downsides are very small. Press me for it and I might complain that Kislev doesn't get as much context and detail as some of the other relevant nations, instead kinda coasting on assuming your audience knows what the deal is until something is directly relevant, but honestly this is oil for nearly soundless hinges. The mechanics are intimidating, especially given your devotion to very successfully adapting the labyrinthine math that is the CK mechanics, and as a result I might hesitate to vote for a bit simply because I'm not completely certain of the consequences, but that was an up-front kinda buy in and is my problem to solve, not yours.

My original version of this post was gonna hit some highlights and plot moments that I really liked but this is already long enough at this time and there's so many iconic moments that it's hard to pick between them. I think the only parting shot I can really leave is that evidently Mathilde produces more wizards by gently walking past children than she would if she was trying to birth them; if a fourth one happens girl needs to sue Ranald for some fucking child support, man can't keep getting away with this.

I eagerly look forward to following updates live!
 
Glau said:
Does smoke and mirrors shed momentum in the same way that rune of the unknown does?
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I don't think so-
Boney said:
"If I didn't know you were here, I probably would have shot at that jumping patch of Ulgu," you comment as you slip a bookmark into Beyond the Great Bastion. "Smoke and Mirrors, I take it?"

"With enough Skywalks to keep downwards velocity down." He looks out at the view he'd just teleported his way up. "Your Magesight must have gotten pretty good to pick up an Ulgu chain-cast."
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Still… drop three feet, flicker Branulhune, catch yourself on the momentumless sword, drop three feet, flicker Branulhune… :V
 
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Morrowlark said:
Man I really hope it's not rude to just ping someone...
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I think very few writers here would mind getting pinged for the purposes of praise.

Morrowlark said:
I don't gotta tell you that Warhammer is an intimidating interest to break into, and you've distilled a deep and wide canon into something understandable to casual or even new readers/players/enjoyers while also relentlessly giving it touches of attention and humanity that the people paid to add to that canon often fail to or scorn. The aggressive dedication to showing Mathilde putting in the work rather than passing it off as like "hey you've taken control of the Watch" is humbling in its scope, and one of my favorite things to see in written works.
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I'm glad that this is appreciated. I'm a big believer in that major accomplishments need to feel earned. In my time as a GM I've known a dozen different characters that could trivialize a difficult fight because they knew which game mechanics to exploit, but I also knew one party that trivialized a difficult fight because they spent five hours meticulously planning every detail of an ambush, and the contrast between the two was very dramatic and taught me a lot. Putting in the work is important, and if you can make that work fun and interesting, then you've got a powerful dynamic for keeping players interested in a game.

Morrowlark said:
It ain't all playing the hits but even the downsides are very small. Press me for it and I might complain that Kislev doesn't get as much context and detail as some of the other relevant nations, instead kinda coasting on assuming your audience knows what the deal is until something is directly relevant, but honestly this is oil for nearly soundless hinges. The mechanics are intimidating, especially given your devotion to very successfully adapting the labyrinthine math that is the CK mechanics, and as a result I might hesitate to vote for a bit simply because I'm not completely certain of the consequences, but that was an up-front kinda buy in and is my problem to solve, not yours.
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Without going back and rereading myself I'll accept it as very plausible that there never was a sufficient onboarding for Kislev, but for the sake of what was initially reflexive defensiveness but is now a behind-the-scenes exposition, there were two problems at play there: one was that the first dabblings in Kislev were just passing through and thus a full Kislev 101 would have been overkill, and then by the time full Kislev arcs were happening Mathilde had happily bimbled through it a number of times and was on first-name basis with a number of movers and shakers and it would have felt silly to do a loredump there. The other is that this is an era where absolutely no lore exists - in most Kislev timelines it leaps straight from Tzar Alexis during the Great War to Tzar Boris reconstructing the damage done during it. That a Vampire ruled Kislev for a century and a half between those two points is mostly only detailed in the backstory of an obscure group of Vampire Hunters, and how we get from that to Boris' father is mostly unknown. And all the details of Kislev in its dark age is something that needed to be built entirely from scratch, and it was still under construction during Mathilde's first forays into it.
 
Boney said:
in most Kislev timelines it leaps straight from Tzar Alexis during the Great War to Tzar Boris reconstructing the damage done during it. That a Vampire ruled Kislev for a century and a half between those two points is mostly only detailed in the backstory of an obscure group of Vampire Hunters,
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Feels strange that it's only a footnote given how Kislev is the Empire's next-door neighbor. But considering how often Bretonnia is ignored, not surprising.
 
FalloutCow said:
Feels strange that it's only a footnote given how Kislev is the Empire's next-door neighbor. But considering how often Bretonnia is ignored, not surprising.
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WHF has this problem in a few places. I still remember friends of mine going "hey whats' the lore on Grand Cathay what kinda army are they getting in the videogame" and like. That conversation went places. It went many places.
 
Morrowlark said:
The mechanics are intimidating, especially given your devotion to very successfully adapting the labyrinthine math that is the CK mechanics, and as a result I might hesitate to vote for a bit simply because I'm not completely certain of the consequences, but that was an up-front kinda buy in and is my problem to solve, not yours.
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As a player, I can't remember when the last time was that we directly took any of our stats into account before deciding on a course of action. Maybe we used to, back when Mathilde was mediocre among some lines and we tried to play by her strengths, but Mathilde has since become someone who can measure herself with any mortal and many an immortal. I mean, Diplomacy is supposed to be her weakest stat and look at the journey you just finished reading.
Sure, we like training skills and say things like "let's get one more rank in swordfighting before going on adventure X" or "let's take the opportunity to buy books Y, given that we are likely to take action Z next turn", but that's just generic numbers go up chasing that would apply to any system, or even a narrative understanding of what the training or spell learning in question might entail. Like, if the numbers go up thing in question were to fail, we'd still proceed as planned.

I'd say the daunting part voting wise currently has little to do with the CK mechanics and more to do with the fact that Quest veterans have been haggling and cajoling to get certain actions in for sometimes IRL years and also the fact that the current arc (international Waystone research) has a tonne of moving parts (byzantine Elven court intrigue, a continent full of disparate magical traditions, faint threads of ancient lore to unravel, a puzzlebox of newly magical doodads and political dilemmas that shake the foundations of nations).

And if you still are intimidated, you can always stick to mostly voting during Social Turns. Those explicitly have lower impact (and no mechanical impact except occasional currency collections) and are supposed to be about what people want to read and who people want to interact with as opposed to chasing specific in-game goals. And of course major decision points outside of turn planning, especially those that are about the path through life Mathilde takes instead of about what tool to add to her current project or personal repertoire.

Morrowlark said:
My original version of this post was gonna hit some highlights and plot moments that I really liked but this is already long enough at this time and there's so many iconic moments that it's hard to pick between them.
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I know I would be delighted to read your take on highlights some time. And given the length of some of the comments we make and the facts that Boney has told us that he reads every single comment (!!!) and reacts positively to chapter breakdowns and reaction posts, I believe you are safe when it comes to overshooting your planned word counts.

Anyway.

Welcome to the front lines!
 
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Quick question and I am not going to @ because I am honestly not sure if it has been previously answered.

I was reviewing the character sheet and under the martial that we have the strategy and tactics of both the Skaven and Undead. Does Mathilde not get one for greenskins?

I completely understand if the answer is no. I feel I have to ask because between the fighting in Karak Eight Peaks and the brush with Mork that Mathilde would develop some level of understanding on their basic tactics.
 
hugo239111 said:
I completely understand if the answer is no. I feel I have to ask because between the fighting in Karak Eight Peaks and the brush with Mork that Mathilde would develop some level of understanding on their basic tactics.
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We've read the extremely detailed campaign diary of someone masterfully commanding undead forces against Skaven, but not something similar for greenskin Waaaghs. That's where the Tactics and Strategy for those forces came from.
 
Morrowlark said:
My original version of this post was gonna hit some highlights and plot moments that I really liked but this is already long enough at this time and there's so many iconic moments that it's hard to pick between them.
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I think people do appreciate this. Especially with the smaller highlights that are easier to forget over years of this quest.

On a related note are Codex and raven still doing a read through and I've just not seen it lately or did that end/stall out?
 
Alliterate said:
We've read the extremely detailed campaign diary of someone masterfully commanding undead forces against Skaven, but not something similar for greenskin Waaaghs. That's where the Tactics and Strategy for those forces came from.
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Orc also doesn't have much in the way of tactic, their strat is very simple

it so simple that honestly, having an Ork Strat perk would mean understanding how simple can be deadly
 
Boney said:
I'm glad that this is appreciated. I'm a big believer in that major accomplishments need to feel earned. In my time as a GM I've known a dozen different characters that could trivialize a difficult fight because they knew which game mechanics to exploit, but I also knew one party that trivialized a difficult fight because they spent five hours meticulously planning every detail of an ambush, and the contrast between the two was very dramatic and taught me a lot. Putting in the work is important, and if you can make that work fun and interesting, then you've got a powerful dynamic for keeping players interested in a game.
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Reading the quest I feel like the secret seems to be that whenever Mathilde takes an action the first thing that you always ask is "Who does Mathilde talk to in order to make this happen". Which means that every action introduces a new character or continues to flesh out an existing character. This is of course helped by the fact that Warhammer fantasy seems to have a very extensive cast of characters ready for you to use.
 
hugo239111 said:
Quick question and I am not going to @ because I am honestly not sure if it has been previously answered.

I was reviewing the character sheet and under the martial that we have the strategy and tactics of both the Skaven and Undead. Does Mathilde not get one for greenskins?

I completely understand if the answer is no. I feel I have to ask because between the fighting in Karak Eight Peaks and the brush with Mork that Mathilde would develop some level of understanding on their basic tactics.
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A basic level of understanding is covered by her rather high Martial. Indeed, she understands them almost as well as she does Imperial troops, since she also lacks a specific bonus on those (she's very slightly ahead at 1 out of 3 advancement, but it's very slight). As others note, her even greater bonuses against Skaven and Undead are based on the Liber Mortis (a book most notable for being easily understood and its lessons applied easily), and she has not experienced or read anything properly equivalent for Orcs.
 
Alliterate said:
We've read the extremely detailed campaign diary of someone masterfully commanding undead forces against Skaven, but not something similar for greenskin Waaaghs. That's where the Tactics and Strategy for those forces came from.
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DragonParadox said:
She got those two from the Liber Mortis, the war journal part. While she does have a special understanding of Greenskins it is more mystical via Waaghbane, not something she got though mundane strategy understanding.
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Thanks for the answers. Honestly the main drive of the question is the fact that it is very mystical. All of Greenskin society/tactics/strategy/life? (I Don't know how to properly put it). At least seems to be entirely dominated by the Waagh and it's commiserate effects upon the population. Mathilde is perhaps the only non-greenskin who not only is experienced in the Waagh and got a peak behind the curtain so to speak, with how the Big and Little Waagh effect them.

If we follow the logic of Gork and Mork and the apparent connection between the Waagh and the Greenskin gods it seems like a crusade. It is a very top down argument I grant you, but Mathilde did kind of see the decision makers and how they make them.
 
The Mystical side is well covered under Waaaghbane, in my view.

Further, it doesn't seem like absolutely everything Greenskins do is entirely shaped by the Waaagh, especially as it also doesn't seem to exist at all times. Indeed, we provoked a new Waaagh into forming just last update, and set it against our preferred target. Overall, I'm not sure how much more of a demonstration of Mathilde's deep understanding of Greenskin psychology and the Waaagh you could want.
 
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Alliterate said:
The Mystical side is well covered under Waaaghbane, in my view.

Further, it doesn't seem like absolutely everything Greenskins do is entirely shaped by the Waaagh, especially as it also doesn't seem to exist at all times. Indeed, we provoked a new Waaagh into forming just last update, and set it against our preferred target. Overall, I'm not sure how much more of a demonstration of Mathilde's deep understanding of Greenskin psychology and the Waaagh you could want.
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Fair points all around, I wanted to ask and it got answered. As for Greenskins being shaped by the Waaagh, I believe in the Lecture's on Waaagh and Peace it was mentioned that a w]Waaagh is a self-perpetuating cycle. In my own opinion this means it could be argued that as long as there is a Waagh somewhere then it is calling for Greenskins. (A fairly shaky argument I freely admit and one that definitely would need more proof for me to call it anything other than an opinion)

Honestly it just seemed like it should be asked, simply because we have spent a fair amount of time fighting the Skaven and Undead and got theirs. I kind of forgot the fact that the Liber Mortis gave us the insight to understand their movements.
 
Rafin said:
I know I would be delighted to read your take on highlights some time. And given the length of some of the comments we make and the facts that Boney has told us that he reads every single comment (!!!) and reacts positively to chapter breakdowns and reaction posts, I believe you are safe when it comes to overshooting your planned word counts.
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Well if that's how it is, lemme take a deeeeep breath. These won't be in any particular order; this is because I do not have control over my life.

The Sylvania Campaign - As starting arcs go, Stirland was fascinating; it ensured that Mathilde couldn't be passive and turtle up, which is a common problem I've observed in questing as a medium; players often give in to the urge to not take risks, and stall plot momentum for dozens of updates or, in some cases, literal real life years at a time. But the final attacks into Sylvania really cemented both the stakes on deck and showed Boney to have a deft hand at writing war in a dramatic fashion, wearing only enough trappings of milfic to enhance verisimilitude while keeping emotional investment and tension very high. RIP to Van Hal Senior, man died like a true WHF RPG protagonist: to bullshit rolls on a percentile die.

Reclaiming Eight Peaks - The initial campaign here was likewise fascinating, and it coming on the back of Sylvania had just enough air to let tension ratchet back down before getting it up again. But more than the combat, the way Boney writes the Dwarfs is with far more compassion, nuance, and thought than they get from, let me check my notes, literally everyone. We live in a world where it took Bioware 4 fucking games to let the player date a Dwarf, and here Boney's outdoing AAA games for free. Which then brings us to...

Arc-We - Mathilde is a fairly thoughtful person. It's honestly kinda amusing to see the dramatic irony of Eike, now, going "oh she just bludgeons her way through diplomacy very well" when along this entire journey she's weighed pros and cons of getting involved with this particular person or that one, showed remarkable foresight about the consequences, and often gotten things done by engaging the shadowy machinery of her networks, business contacts, and favor-trading. But with the We, the dramatic irony is on the other foot, and I wonder if Mathilde will ever truly understand her legacy here. Yes, this started as Mathilde deciding to try and do something unambiguously good, and I love that for her - she knows when and where to be a Professional Mother Fucker - but now, as she's patiently cultivated this relationship and prepared the We to join a world full of peers and fascinating new people, her thought is turned to how the Split-We ensure the immortality of her own legacy in the library...but arguably the greater, and more glorious legacy was found far earlier, when her allies admitted that they would have just killed the We. In front of the Ancestor Gods and everybody else, Mathilde gave peace a chance, and Karak Eight-Peaks will be reaping the rewards of that decision for an amount of time even Dwarfs find appreciable, and telling everyone who comes or goes from there why it happened, and what they learned. From a single act of kindness...

Guess You Had To Be There - This isn't so much a moment as a persistent strength of the writing, one I got done selling another new reader on earlier (RIP my friend, she's got the same million word death march I just went through); the writing never forgets anything, and as a result we get to see how a Wizard ends up with a batshit insane life from the inside. Why is this woman with the approximate size and body weight of a Smurf using a Greatsword? Every choice on the way made perfect sense, and yet it is insane. Why is a spider hivemind being employed as the head librarian of a landmark multicultural library? Every choice on the way there made perfect sense, and yet it is completely insane. Even for things that didn't quite hit me as hard - I'm less madly in love with, say, Mathilde ending up as a divine avatar for the brief period of time - the way they stick around, and recur, and influence her thoughts and life elevates them. Our Heroine is very much made up of the events of her life in a way writers often struggle with.

The Romance - Panoramia my FUCKING BELOVED. Despite the relationship being somewhat out-of-focus during this arc, given the distances involved, it's great to see how the two of them put in the work to be there for each other, how they meet each other's needs (to wit, Panoramia sees through Mathilde without hostility, and Mathilde lends a voice of practicality that Panoramia sometimes struggles with, among other things), and the warmth that exists here. I would kill and die for Panoramia, lost my mind when I was finally caught up and went to look at the fan art so I couldn't be spoiled here. And just like, for the record? For the record? I had to be sold on Panoramia, on my way to being current I'd actually been holding a torch for a Roswita romance & Boney hit me with this druid so hard that I got fucking isekai'd. I hope she can come back into focus soon(ish).

I could probably think of more if prompted but it's 3 AM and I gotta go update my own Quest, those are the strongest ones in my head at the moment.
 
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