Warhammer Fantasy: A Dynasty of Dynamic Alcoholism

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They've progressed past such things. Now they've got ancient Wight King bone ash and vertebrae of a Shyish-inclined Slaughtermaster rent apart personally at the very literal hands of a being born roughly just before the Old Ones arrived on Mallus, and all a manner of other reagents and what not picked up from their journeys across the world.

Ya gotta remember, they were kids, with barely any understanding of magic compared to themselves now.
 
Hands could be made into something like "Thing" from the Addams Family?

Maybe the Twins yoinked knowledge to build a Golem Construct like a Nehekaran Sphinx?

Not sure if that counts as Necromancy?

Could a Dragon Skeleton be used as the Core Framework for such a Golem Construct?

Not an Undead, but as Materials/Reagents?
 
That would be not so much toeing the line between Amethyst Magic and Necromancy as straight up straddling it by deliberately shoving your feet on both sides of the fence so the barrier goes up your ass.
 
Torroar, I have a question about the rules of the magic collages. Why are there rules about marriage, and apparently rules saying that the twins shouldn't every see Fred and Natasha again? Or am I completely misunderstanding?
 
Whatever is in that small chest, it's something the twins don't want their master knowing about.

My guess is some ofuda. They were very interested in studying something that allows magic of multiple winds to be stored by a human user of that type and then used by someone who uses another wind. But that is straddling the line of the Colleges' rule against studying ways to use multiple winds and Elspeth did not support it.
 
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coalface said:
Torroar, I have a question about the rules of the magic collages. Why are there rules about marriage, and apparently rules saying that the twins shouldn't every see Fred and Natasha again? Or am I completely misunderstanding?
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that is only for the Amethyst collage , pretty sure since said rules are not even a generation old they aren't set in stone yet seeing as Freddy visited the twins when they were at the Amethyst collage often enough , the Amethyst being the wind of death thus having ties to necromancy to ignorant masses often have their members be disowned , exiled and kicked out of their families so those same members made the rule about cuttings ties with their families in response both as a mechanism to cob and a why to win points with the empire by showing how impartial and disciplined they are without losing anything ,
 
Uh, so...'why are there rules about marriage' is easily answerable, in at least one vein.

Because that's what occurred in the source material.

We can tear a lot of excerpts out of Realms of Sorcery for this, keeping in mind that Realms of Sorcery 2ndED is generally considered to be just after the now kinda sorta non-canonical Storm of Chaos Event, so somewhere around 2522 IC:

[All italisized is from Realms of Sorcery]

1. Few people in the Empire ever suspect that theymight have an aptitude for magic. Aside from this, becoming apprenticed to a Magister to study magic is viewed everywhere as a bad idea.
2. The Imperial Colleges of Magic normally regard celibacy as the ideal. However, there are some Magisters who not only pursue personal relationships but also welcome children into their lives. The Amethyst College and the College of Light are strictly celibate Orders. It is both forbidden to form unique relationships with man or woman by the laws of their Orders. It is also rumoured that the individual Winds embraced and pursued by these two Orders steals from their brethren the very desire and will to form such relationships. The Gold and Celestial Colleges have no laws forbidding personal relationships, but the Magisters of these Colleges tend to be so wrapped up in their studies that it is almost unheard of for any of them to marry or have offspring. No one really knows much about the beliefs and rules of the respectively misanthropic and highly secretive Amber and Grey Colleges when it comes to the matter of relationships. However, the Jade and Bright Colleges have no restrictions on such matters, either by internal rules or external influence.

As for 'most' parents with regards to their children showing magic:

1. There are a few people born to ordinary families who suddenly manifest what appear to be magical powers. Most parents in the Empire are so superstitious that they would probably regard the supernatural occurrences as a demonstration that he child is possessed by a daemon. They would most likely seek out an exorcist to "cleanse the taint" from their child. This is the most pleasant fate for a child like this. It is not unheard of for some frightened parents in rural areas, or towns lorded over by particularly hell-fire and brimstone type priests, to simply kill the child and make it look like death by misadventure. Though forbidden by law and holy writ, infanticide is not uncommon right across the Old World.

Additionally, a lot of the time, many children may outright resent their families for sending them away, or regard their magic as a curse and blame their family for it, etc. There is not, necessarily, a rule which is hard coded to prevent Agatha and Alisa from seeing their family again, no. Unless I've contradicted myself somehow at some point in the past, that is not the case. It is simply that, most of the time, no one willingly goes and visits them. Furthermore, unless you're a journeyman and above, you're not really allowed to leave the Imperial Magic College campuses, perhaps with some allowances for wandering around Altdorf a smidge but little above that.

Either way, there are strenuous efforts made to try and create a distinct separation not just physically but mentally and emotionally with the life before and after coming to the Colleges, if only to prevent as many angry children becoming angry adults who will someday have to be put down themselves after getting 'revenge' upon their families.

Frederick and Natasha, and the Hohenzollerns in general, were the very first noble family to break with such newborn traditions and general mentalities by willingly and repeatedly visiting their children.

They are, also notably, the only noble family to have ever done so again with their children aside from the Kessels.
 
Omega said:
Does anyone happen to know the post where this happened? I'd like to re-read it.
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torroar said:
The Freaks
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It's a fun interlude, as younger torroar wrote it. The Twins were 6-ish in it, and they read people like a book in it's opening narration. Kind of a shame that "see how fast people are dying" thing got somewhat dropped later on. I know I'd like to know how they see vampires, necromancers, and things like that through the purple wind. Are vampires dying, and visible on sight if they get a good look, or are vampires "normal" to their senses?

Another question I have is if Elspeth, Agatha, and Alisa kept the white ofuda they still had after fighting Emperor Jubei of Nippon. I'm not sure, but I think they might still have 6 of those white ofuda in total.
 
Frederick and Natasha, and the Hohenzollerns in general, were the very first noble family to break with such newborn traditions and general mentalities by willingly and repeatedly visiting their children.

They are, also notably, the only noble family to have ever done so again with their children aside from the Kessels.
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Not all trends are easily set.
 
Hmm... ... ... Maybe it's one of the Ghost-Blades, purified and de-attuned, which they intend to bind to the Hohenzollern family? (Or maybe just use to capture their parents' souls specifically after they die. ... That would probably be a bit of a no-no. ... Or maybe they intend to bind themselves to the Ghost-Blades? So that after the Twins die, they'd go to the Ghost-Blades?)

In which case, it would be "a thing which Von Drakken would not like" because, well, because it uses up one of the fancy Ghost-blades they got and intended to have the Amethyst College research... and also because it forms a pretty strong familiar connection. While being an Amethyst Wizard.

The strong familiar connection thing might be pretty weird and out-there for Amethyst Wizards. I mean, Ghost-Blades worked because of familial legacy and familiar bonds, so maybe this is how Ghost-Blades would have to work. And so it's not against the affinity and predilection of Shyish. Merely something very weird and unexpected for the Amethyst Colleges to encounter; they really weren't expecting to see Shyish-related artifacts bound to family lines as a cultural thing, and weren't really sure how to deal with that, and so the Twins actions will be an annoying surprise to them philosophically and culturally and politically.


Or maybe it's letters, or gifts, from Genevieve and Johanna.
 
torroar said:
They are, also notably, the only noble family to have ever done so again with their children aside from the Kessels.
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what are the odds this cause change in imperial noble culture ,as both the Hohenzollerns and the Kessels are straight up the very top of the imperial noble hierarchy in terms of status , power , influence , reach and pedigree as elector counts and prestigious ones at that so you could say they are among the top trend setters for nobles and those who want to be like nobles and nobles tend to look to their superiors in rank and status for stuff like precedent or newest trends
 
mmgaballah said:
what are the odds this cause change in imperial noble culture ,as both the Hohenzollerns and the Kessels are straight up the very top of the imperial noble hierarchy in terms of status , power , influence , reach and pedigree as elector counts and prestigious ones at that so you could say they are among the top trend setters for nobles and those who want to be like nobles and nobles tend to look to their superiors in rank and status for stuff like precedent or newest trends
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Minimal. Everyone regards the Hohenzollerns as a bunch of weirdos and the people of the Empire have been taught to hate and fear magic for over two millennium.
 
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mmgaballah said:
what are the odds this cause change in imperial noble culture ,as both the Hohenzollerns and the Kessels are straight up the very top of the imperial noble hierarchy in terms of status , power , influence , reach and pedigree as elector counts and prestigious ones at that so you could say they are among the top trend setters for nobles and those who want to be like nobles and nobles tend to look to their superiors in rank and status for stuff like precedent or newest trends
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Uh, pretty damn low considering it's been decades and they are still the only ones.
 
TheOmnimercurial said:
Hmmmm.... Animated Black Dragon Skeletons for the Twins?

Or give them the Dragon Egg?
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If you want to see the twins with a dragon, hope and pray they're with Elspeth if she enslaves a Carmine Dragon like her canon descendant, to either learn the technique and do it themselves with their own Carmine, or if there's other Carmines there to get their own. That's probably the absolute most likely way any Hohenzollern is going to be getting a dragon, as by god can we not afford one ourselves. Doing any animation shit with the skeleton, whether it's something like Nehekharan constructs, like Dawi golems, etc. is just "necromancy without the Dhar" and will also absolutely get whoever does it burned at the stake.
 
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Marlin said:
I know I'd like to know how they see vampires, necromancers, and things like that through the purple wind. Are vampires dying, and visible on sight if they get a good look, or are vampires "normal" to their senses?
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Oh it's still a thing, they just don't remark on it as constantly as they did when they were younger. They 'got used to it', basically. Being able to use that sort of sight is actually quite valuable when it comes to doing surgeries and anatomy studies, it turns out.

Vampires are not dying, no. They're a horrid sort of stasis thing, Amethyst coils and wraps around them regularly, but it is not the same sort of envelopment as a living person, where it passes through and out, it hangs unnaturally in place - clinging paradoxically to a being so close to the line of death yet not. There's actually a Blood Gift from Night's Dark Masters which directly has to combat this sort of thing - Aethyric Cipher:

Your natural mastery over the Winds of Magic allows you to cloak and dissipate the Aethyric distortions around you. Those with Witchsight observing you must make an opposed Will Power Test and achieve at least one degree of success in order to detect anything unusual about you. You are also immune to Daemonsroot, Witchbane, and any other similar wards.

Vampires, by their very nature as unnatural/natural Dhar generator/batteries, literally distort the Winds around them subtly by their very presence. They look like, to those with Witchsight, something fucked up unless they conceal it with effort or have the natural gift to do so.

Necromancers are also awful, pallid things, Shyish drawn through them and purposefully filtered and touched by the curdling, acidic, nastiness that is Dhar as well.
 
torroar said:
The Amethyst College and the College of Light are strictly celibate Orders. It is both forbidden to form unique relationships with man or woman by the laws of their Orders. It is also rumoured that the individual Winds embraced and pursued by these two Orders steals from their brethren the very desire and will to form such relationships.
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TBH, I believe that if it is true that most Light and Amethyst wizards are celibate it is far more likely that it is because the Wind they use ends up killing their libido than for any sort of rule or law... Celibacy vows have been IRL the most Frequently-Broken Unbreakable Vow in history (no matter the ethnicity, culture, or religion of the ones involved) and I don´t see how Mallus would be different from Earth in that regard.
 
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iggyfan said:
Minimal. Everyone regards the Hohenzollerns as a bunch of weirdos and the people of the Empire have been taught to hate and fear magic for over two millennium.
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A reminder that Sigmar himself is known to have said that those people with magic are, quote: "Clearly cursed" owing to much of his own life being spent fighting wizards, including Nagash himself, and the Empire's close relations with the Dwarfs during Sigmar's time, who themselves have a deep distrust of magic dating back to the Asur's devastating use of it against them during the War of the Beard.

In fact there were literal riots in Altdorf when Magnus himself ordered for the Colleges of Magic to be constructed. And that was ordered by Magnus, fresh off his victory against Asavar Kul no less.
 
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torroar said:
Oh it's still a thing, they just don't remark on it as constantly as they did when they were younger. They 'got used to it', basically. Being able to use that sort of sight is actually quite valuable when it comes to doing surgeries and anatomy studies, it turns out.

Vampires are not dying, no. They're a horrid sort of stasis thing, Amethyst coils and wraps around them regularly, but it is not the same sort of envelopment as a living person, where it passes through and out, it hangs unnaturally in place - clinging paradoxically to a being so close to the line of death yet not. There's actually a Blood Gift from Night's Dark Masters which directly has to combat this sort of thing - Aethyric Cipher:

Your natural mastery over the Winds of Magic allows you to cloak and dissipate the Aethyric distortions around you. Those with Witchsight observing you must make an opposed Will Power Test and achieve at least one degree of success in order to detect anything unusual about you. You are also immune to Daemonsroot, Witchbane, and any other similar wards.

Vampires, by their very nature as unnatural/natural Dhar generator/batteries, literally distort the Winds around them subtly by their very presence. They look like, to those with Witchsight, something fucked up unless they conceal it with effort or have the natural gift to do so.

Necromancers are also awful, pallid things, Shyish drawn through them and purposefully filtered and touched by the curdling, acidic, nastiness that is Dhar as well.
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torroar said:
Oh it's still a thing, they just don't remark on it as constantly as they did when they were younger. They 'got used to it', basically. Being able to use that sort of sight is actually quite valuable when it comes to doing surgeries and anatomy studies, it turns out.

Vampires are not dying, no. They're a horrid sort of stasis thing, Amethyst coils and wraps around them regularly, but it is not the same sort of envelopment as a living person, where it passes through and out, it hangs unnaturally in place - clinging paradoxically to a being so close to the line of death yet not. There's actually a Blood Gift from Night's Dark Masters which directly has to combat this sort of thing - Aethyric Cipher:

Your natural mastery over the Winds of Magic allows you to cloak and dissipate the Aethyric distortions around you. Those with Witchsight observing you must make an opposed Will Power Test and achieve at least one degree of success in order to detect anything unusual about you. You are also immune to Daemonsroot, Witchbane, and any other similar wards.

Vampires, by their very nature as unnatural/natural Dhar generator/batteries, literally distort the Winds around them subtly by their very presence. They look like, to those with Witchsight, something fucked up unless they conceal it with effort or have the natural gift to do so.

Necromancers are also awful, pallid things, Shyish drawn through them and purposefully filtered and touched by the curdling, acidic, nastiness that is Dhar as well.
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:wtf: Uh...torroar what is the difference between these two posts? Cause I can't tell.
 
torroar said:
Oh it's still a thing, they just don't remark on it as constantly as they did when they were younger. They 'got used to it', basically. Being able to use that sort of sight is actually quite valuable when it comes to doing surgeries and anatomy studies, it turns out.

Vampires are not dying, no. They're a horrid sort of stasis thing, Amethyst coils and wraps around them regularly, but it is not the same sort of envelopment as a living person, where it passes through and out, it hangs unnaturally in place - clinging paradoxically to a being so close to the line of death yet not. There's actually a Blood Gift from Night's Dark Masters which directly has to combat this sort of thing - Aethyric Cipher:

Your natural mastery over the Winds of Magic allows you to cloak and dissipate the Aethyric distortions around you. Those with Witchsight observing you must make an opposed Will Power Test and achieve at least one degree of success in order to detect anything unusual about you. You are also immune to Daemonsroot, Witchbane, and any other similar wards.

Vampires, by their very nature as unnatural/natural Dhar generator/batteries, literally distort the Winds around them subtly by their very presence. They look like, to those with Witchsight, something fucked up unless they conceal it with effort or have the natural gift to do so.

Necromancers are also awful, pallid things, Shyish drawn through them and purposefully filtered and touched by the curdling, acidic, nastiness that is Dhar as well.
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"People with their souls yanked back, it's weird, looking all shiny, right. Not to mention they clearly haven't even figured it out, you know? Why would you become a vampire, can't you look at other vampires and realize they haven't worked all the bugs out yet?...Those fuckin' idiots. 'Do I look immortal?' No. You look weird. You look. Fucking. Weird. You still look like you're mortal, I just can't guess what species anymore cause I've never seen that species before, I've never seen that shiny fuckin' look!"
-Agatha and Alise talking to Elspeth about vampires

(The whims of my mind are an enigma even to me)
 
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Fanhunter696 said:
TBH, I believe that if the Light and Amethyst wizards are celibate it is far more likely that it is because the Wind they use ends up killing their libido than for any sort of rule or law... Celibacy vows have been IRL the most Frequently-Broken Unbreakable Vow in history (no matter the ethnicity, culture, or religion of the ones involved) and I don´t see how Mallus would be different from Earth in that regard.
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Also, the celibacy rules are just that... internal rules of the order, not Imperial Laws. Breaking them could be punished in the same way any breach of rules could be punished, ranging from "you are now an outlaw" to the "this is a black mark against you, don't do it again" to the "fine this is clearly important to you, so we're going to ignore it if you don't flaunt it". It's not like using dhar or something.
 
Sorry about the double reply, folks. Danger of multiple tabs being open on the same thread, posting in one tab doesn't make the draft in the other tabs disappear, meaning you can idly glance past and go 'oh I guess I didn't actually post it'. Fixed now.
 
Fanhunter696 said:
TBH, I believe that if the Light and Amethyst wizards are celibate it is far more likely that it is because the Wind they use ends up killing their libido than for any sort of rule or law... Celibacy vows have been IRL the most Frequently-Broken Unbreakable Vow in history (no matter the ethnicity, culture, or religion of the ones involved) and I don´t see how Mallus would be different from Earth in that regard.
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This is unlikely. The Von Draken line is a whole family of Shyish users. Even Elspeth has a daughter iirc. I think it's more institutional and catered towards avoiding preferential treatment of students.

Wouldn't be surprised if some "noble" wizards flat out ignored it.
 
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torroar said:
Though forbidden by law and holy writ, infanticide is not uncommon right across the Old World.
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You'd think a hammer priest would enforce this particular rule harder, to discourage people from doing such stupidity.
A priest truly zealous about his faith would not ignore the innocence of a child in the face of unfair
Czes said:
Woukdbe surprised if some "noble" wizards flat out ignored it.
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Paid a fine perhaps.
 
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