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Warcraft: The Rise of the Mag'har

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Massgamer said:
Would these be Jungle or Forest Trolls? It's important to know because the overall mindet of the Forest Trolls is on average very hard to deal with and I would rather wipe them out. Jungle Trolls however have a better chance of being dealt with through talking and maybe even get into an alliance with.
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If a human civilization and/or culture that once ruled the world was pecked down, destroyed, annihilated, conquered and slaughtered like the troll empire was, and then diminished into (comparatively) minuscule polities like the trolls were, then getting smacked around and annexed by what is basically refugees (future high elves) and newly expanding barbarian hordes (humanity), can you honestly say that we wouldn't be doing much worse in the case we won?

Most of this happened when they didn't have any reliable warning (besides one prophet seeing *doom-visions*), so you couldn't even say "you lost, buddy". After all, the elves were the main cause of everything going to shit and guess who were so gun-ho on conquering them? The high elves were like a military junta who just blew up your entire continent, got smacked to miniscule sizes and went "oh well, we can rebuild after we slaughter these newbs" *points at the remnants of the more older polity while holding a handkerchief in front of his face to block a "stench"*.
Cue further devastation via barbarian hordes and war.
 
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Okay just going to point this out, there was never a unified Troll Empire, not since the various tribes started leaving Zandalar. What fought the Azj'Aqir Empire was the combined might of the Gurubashi and Amani Troll Empires.

Also the Tolls did not fight Ahn'Qiraj, Neither Ahn'Qiraj, Azjol-Nerub nor the Mantid Empire were founded until after the war with the Trolls, each was founded by refugees from that war with the first two empires founded on captured Titan Facilities( In Ahn'Qiraj's case the prison of C'Thun).
 
Also I would like to point out that there is no evidence that Ahn'Qiraj was any weaker then Azj'Aqir. Yes it was founded by only one of the big three surviving groups of Aqir but the Qiraji spent thousands of years rebuilding and recouping from the Aqir's loss. And while Warcraft does follow several fantasy tropes, the "Blood of Gondor Grows Thin" trope that says that things were always better and greater in the past is not one of them.
 
GhostKing 666 said:
Also I would like to point out that there is no evidence that Ahn'Qiraj was any weaker then Azj'Aqir. Yes it was founded by only one of the big three surviving groups of Aqir but the Qiraji spent thousands of years rebuilding and recouping from the Aqir's loss. And while Warcraft does follow several fantasy tropes, the "Blood of Gondor Grows Thin" trope that says that things were always better and greater in the past is not one of them.
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That is right in warcraft if anything each generation grows stronger than the last, due to old knowledge being preserved and new knowledge being developed.
There are exceptions of course, but only twice has the strenght of Azeroth been permanently reduced.
During the sundering, losing 90% or so of the worlds landmass lessened the potential amount of inhabitants permanently, making a full recovery of army sizes damn near impossible the maelstromm further prevented even underwater races picking up the slack.
And during the cataclysm since more land was forever lost there of course the cataclysm being a permanent weaking is debatable since it resulted in the maelstromm dissipating so preventing on whether easy permanent underwater breathing spells are developed the cataclysm might actually end up strengthening Azeroth in the long run.
But in general each threath Azeroth overcome only leave it stronger in the long run Warlords of Draenor proves this the reason the orcs threw out the legion and became a great threat is because garrosh got sent back in time and brought with him knowledge of all the advancement Azeroth had developed in the art of war since the original invasion so in conclusion i believe Azeroth is a reversion of the blood of gondor grow thinner every generation because on Azeroth every generations blood flow thicker than the last.
 
Actually, I think it's less. Blood grows thicker or stronger or weaker. And more that the previous generation makes way for the new generation.

We know for a fact that old races like the Trolls and the Elves are nowhere near as strong as they were at the height of their civilization, and probably never will be again. And I believe the Azj'Aquir is a part of that.

It's just that Warcraft seems imply that the older generation must make way for the younger generation, rather than trying to maintain or revive past glories. Which has been shown a lot throughout the story, such as with the Night Elf Storyline where they needed the help of the younger races to hold back the legion. Or the Troll storyline for Vol'jin where the Zandalari want to go out and recreate their past nation once again and being stopped.

It's less old is better, or younger is better. But more Old makes way for the New. As the Younger races are still growing into their peaks like the Humans and Orcs. And I wouldn't be surprised that should those young races actually reach their peaks like the Trolls, Elves, and Azj'Aquir did. That if they have a shattering of their people, that they too will forever be shadows of their former glory, and must make way for the next race or generation that would follow.
 
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The Elves aren't as strong as they used to be for several reasons. For the Night Elves they spent ten thousand years as immortal hippies which means they had to follow strict population controls in order not to damage the environment thus they lack the numbers of the younger, mortal races that could give two shits about their environmental footprint. Hence why they needed help to fight the Legion(which isn't something new, they needed help to fight the legion the first time too) and why they joined the Alliance, they lacked the population to stand as an equal to the Horde or the Alliance and settled for joining the Alliance because they didn't kill Cenarius.

The High Elves/Blood Elves on the other hand had reached the same heights as they did pre-sundering but got damaged in the second war and then outright wrecked in the third. Give them fifty to a hundred years to recover and they'll be just as strong as they were before.

As for the Trolls, the two Troll Empires both suffered massive setbacks. First the Night Elves ganked them with Well of Eternity backed arcane magic after they had that big war with the Aqir, then the Sundering happened. For the Amani right when they were starting to recover the Elves and latter the Humans popped up and again kicked them when they were down and took their land away from them. For the Gurubashi they trucked with the wrong loa and got burned for it with the surviving tribes preceding to battle it out amongst the ruins. Trolls have diplomacy as their dump stat and have suffered badly because of it.

And again for the Qiraji, they specifically waited until they had recovered back to the strength that the Azj'Aqir Empire possessed before starting the War of the Shifting Sands, its literally a part of their back story. The Mantid too also utilize a form of eugenics to strengthen their race with the express purpose of making them stronger then they were before. Even the Nerubians who were less militant then their two cousins were the single super power in Northrend and took the Scourge and the Faceless Ones double teaming them to be defeated. Weaker then they used to be is not something any of those groups could have been called before they got trashed.
 
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Talking about the Nerubians make me feel sad since we have got no news about Warcraft: Kingdoms for awhile. :(

Also this topic of conversation is has gone off the road when the quest does not even take place on Azeroth which is funny.:D

So in an effort to return to the quest I was wondering what's the plan to try and help the Furies in the different regions? The Easiest start I would think is help the Water Fury in the Marsh get over it's issue of it's home changing from an ocean to a puddle. Also would the other Furies in this region become more powerful now that water is not dominate?
 
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On the Nerubians.

The only real Warriors from the Azj'Aqir they had were The Spiderlords, the rest were degenerate cavern-dwellers.
Read just how much face an Spiderlord wrecks, that was most likely an normal Azjiran Warrior caste.

That said, Back then all Trolls were, what? 8-9 Feet tall and rocking the shit with weaponry that not even the power from the wells of magic could overcome before the elves stole fragments of Troll knowledge later in history when the Trolls had hit their mystical rock-bottom.
 
Ahra said:
On the Nerubians.

The only real Warriors from the Azj'Aqir they had were The Spiderlords, the rest were degenerate cavern-dwellers.
Read just how much face an Spiderlord wrecks, that was most likely an normal Azjiran Warrior caste.

That said, Back then all Trolls were, what? 8-9 Feet tall and rocking the shit with weaponry that not even the power from the wells of magic could overcome before the elves stole fragments of Troll knowledge later in history when the Trolls had hit their mystical rock-bottom.
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Man I wish Kingdoms would update :(
 
Ahra said:
On the Nerubians.

The only real Warriors from the Azj'Aqir they had were The Spiderlords, the rest were degenerate cavern-dwellers.
Read just how much face an Spiderlord wrecks, that was most likely an normal Azjiran Warrior caste.

That said, Back then all Trolls were, what? 8-9 Feet tall and rocking the shit with weaponry that not even the power from the wells of magic could overcome before the elves stole fragments of Troll knowledge later in history when the Trolls had hit their mystical rock-bottom.
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Were exactly do you get that Spiderlords were the normal warrior caste? If they were then why is it that neither the Qiraji or the Mantid have spiderlord type fighters as infantry? Spiderlords are the decedents of the noble caste members of the original Aqir refugees that became the Nuerbians, they were bigger an better then the rest partly because of Noble Privileges and requirements(asskicking equals authority being a thing in Warcraft) and partly because they were a throwback to the Nerubians insectoid ancestry compared to the arachnid thing modern Nerubian castes followed. Hell the differences between the Nerubians, Quraji and Mantid are better explained by the Nerubians being descended mainly from the scholar class, the Qiraji from the priest caste and the Mantid from the warrior caste.
 
Well, since it's active again...

Next turn we should try to fight the Arrakoa in order to take control of Auchindon.
 
I believe there was talk of trying to diplomance the fragment of the Expedition we've located?

How Did they get split up, anyway? You'd think the Expedition would stick together for Survival, if nothing else.
 
overmind said:
Well, since it's active again...

Next turn we should try to fight the Arrakoa in order to take control of Auchindon.
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What about our expedition to shut down the Demon Gate in Zangarmarsh?

We'll probably get a quest in that area from the Water Furies come to think of it...

Eh, whyNotBoth.jpg Auchindon and Zangarmarsh if nothing really pressing comes up like the Horde invading Nagrand.
 
In regards to Dranosh becoming a blademaster, I wonder if by that point axes that could be seen as a barbaric weapon which would be slowly phased out in favor of swords like a blademaster just to imitate their warchief?
 
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Doubt it. Axes, swords, and maces each have their own niches. For a Blademaster they should choose a weapon that fits them. And normal warriors should be able to use whatever they can get. And Axes are much easier to make than swords.
 
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