[X] Greed and Desire [Align offensive technique to Communication and Want]
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Threads Of Destiny(Eastern Fantasy, Sequel to Forge of Destiny)
- Thread starter yrsillar
- Start date
- Original Users' Choice!
Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
[ ] Ignorance and Delusion [Align offensive technique to Communication and Isolation]
[ ] Hatred and Aversion [Align Offensive technique to Communication and Community]
[ ] Greed and Desire [Align offensive technique to Communication and Want]
Hmm, I don't think I have a strong opinion here. One thing to acknowledge is that all of these could be quite flexible and overlap in application with the other options, depending on the context we're faced with in the field. Which might be part of why I don't have strong feelings; my brain's spinning out example scenarios and seeing a lot of similarities in practice.
The first option would assault a target's preconceptions, challenging their own understanding of where, and for what, they stand in the world. Both knowledge and ignorance can be deeply alienating, and this approach leans into that fact. Overlap with Community seems natural, since those are some of the more subjective areas of knowledge anyone has, and it fits with the Isolation lean.
The second manipulates communal ties and boundaries to attack a target. Most obviously, challenging their understanding of who does and doesn't fall within its walls, but also by twisting and enflaming the particular baggage that only comes with the intimacy of Community. Betrayal, obligation, expectation, neglect. Letting another behind the walls you put up against the world is a source of safety, but it also leaves you uniquely vulnerable to them, and its not just they who might be able to strike you through it. Overlap with Want seems natural, considering how deeply the human condition, and even spirits as we've seen, yearn for connection to others.
The third pulls most directly on direct experiential needs, or aspirations, in the target. At its most basic food, shelter, safety. More immaterially growth, status, plenty, achievement. Here, we tug on the contradictions between desires, or the insincerely masked desires denied, in order to disorder someone. Overlap with Isolation seems natural, since so much of Want is rooted in what people already believe themselves to be separated from or not.
None of these really strongly screams out at me as our necessary conclusion, and there's actually kind of the opposite going on. I look over the options, and I'm not super inspired to connect our dots to them. I could see that being different if we had our upcoming geomancy-Borders talk with Meng Duyi under our belt for this, philosophically. The pre-existing meditation on the barriers between things/people would be good fodder for this sort of choice/topic. But we don't have that quite yet; flipside, this lesson probably informs that one to a degree. Actually, with Jia Hong publicly acknowledging us as a Junior Sister, we're probably going to have a lot to talk to Meng Duyi about; he's already given us the stink-eye for reminding him of Jia Hong with one of our Huisheng-isms.
But I'm getting off topic.
In terms of narrative clarity and continuity, the framing of this being a "blade" probably makes the first option's Isolation most seamless from the generic reader perspective. Isolation's had a pretty firm claim on that analogy for offense. I think if we're going to mix that up, we should have a solid gameplan in mind. Otherwise it'll just be momentary diversion which does more to confuse than contribute. Not sure we have that level of coherence, here.
Does a given option leave space for our upcoming developments(active Domain art), does it make the elements we're likely to use there more confusing or less, that's the kind of thing we should be thinking about. But I'm just not sure we have the context to really speculate? This was the kind of situation I was worried about with this lesson plan, honestly. Ambiguity, a lack of sharp divides to help contextualize and theory craft, etc. We're drawing too much and not enough from our day-to-day perspective to view the lesson on a broader level, maybe.
Tbh, I'm not sure how much this vote even matters? It's a puzzler. I'll be interested in what takes others have.
P.S.:
Two observations:
1) Shu Yue is very cute with the way their presence is influencing the conceptualization of the nightmares towards big creepy grasping hands. Shu Yue is a spook through and through.
2) Considering the Dreaming/Pure Way framing of at least the introduction to these lessons, and the location, I wonder if we'll run into some remnant of Meng Diu's father. Iirc, he fought and died in the final confrontation against the Hui, even as his clansmen didn't, and he specifically died to rabid nightmares in the Rootways while having a religious epiphany about the inherent value of the experiences of others and the lives having those experiences, great or small, mortal or immortal.
[ ] Hatred and Aversion [Align Offensive technique to Communication and Community]
[ ] Greed and Desire [Align offensive technique to Communication and Want]
Hmm, I don't think I have a strong opinion here. One thing to acknowledge is that all of these could be quite flexible and overlap in application with the other options, depending on the context we're faced with in the field. Which might be part of why I don't have strong feelings; my brain's spinning out example scenarios and seeing a lot of similarities in practice.
The first option would assault a target's preconceptions, challenging their own understanding of where, and for what, they stand in the world. Both knowledge and ignorance can be deeply alienating, and this approach leans into that fact. Overlap with Community seems natural, since those are some of the more subjective areas of knowledge anyone has, and it fits with the Isolation lean.
The second manipulates communal ties and boundaries to attack a target. Most obviously, challenging their understanding of who does and doesn't fall within its walls, but also by twisting and enflaming the particular baggage that only comes with the intimacy of Community. Betrayal, obligation, expectation, neglect. Letting another behind the walls you put up against the world is a source of safety, but it also leaves you uniquely vulnerable to them, and its not just they who might be able to strike you through it. Overlap with Want seems natural, considering how deeply the human condition, and even spirits as we've seen, yearn for connection to others.
The third pulls most directly on direct experiential needs, or aspirations, in the target. At its most basic food, shelter, safety. More immaterially growth, status, plenty, achievement. Here, we tug on the contradictions between desires, or the insincerely masked desires denied, in order to disorder someone. Overlap with Isolation seems natural, since so much of Want is rooted in what people already believe themselves to be separated from or not.
None of these really strongly screams out at me as our necessary conclusion, and there's actually kind of the opposite going on. I look over the options, and I'm not super inspired to connect our dots to them. I could see that being different if we had our upcoming geomancy-Borders talk with Meng Duyi under our belt for this, philosophically. The pre-existing meditation on the barriers between things/people would be good fodder for this sort of choice/topic. But we don't have that quite yet; flipside, this lesson probably informs that one to a degree. Actually, with Jia Hong publicly acknowledging us as a Junior Sister, we're probably going to have a lot to talk to Meng Duyi about; he's already given us the stink-eye for reminding him of Jia Hong with one of our Huisheng-isms.
But I'm getting off topic.
In terms of narrative clarity and continuity, the framing of this being a "blade" probably makes the first option's Isolation most seamless from the generic reader perspective. Isolation's had a pretty firm claim on that analogy for offense. I think if we're going to mix that up, we should have a solid gameplan in mind. Otherwise it'll just be momentary diversion which does more to confuse than contribute. Not sure we have that level of coherence, here.
Does a given option leave space for our upcoming developments(active Domain art), does it make the elements we're likely to use there more confusing or less, that's the kind of thing we should be thinking about. But I'm just not sure we have the context to really speculate? This was the kind of situation I was worried about with this lesson plan, honestly. Ambiguity, a lack of sharp divides to help contextualize and theory craft, etc. We're drawing too much and not enough from our day-to-day perspective to view the lesson on a broader level, maybe.
Tbh, I'm not sure how much this vote even matters? It's a puzzler. I'll be interested in what takes others have.
P.S.:
Two observations:
1) Shu Yue is very cute with the way their presence is influencing the conceptualization of the nightmares towards big creepy grasping hands. Shu Yue is a spook through and through.
2) Considering the Dreaming/Pure Way framing of at least the introduction to these lessons, and the location, I wonder if we'll run into some remnant of Meng Diu's father. Iirc, he fought and died in the final confrontation against the Hui, even as his clansmen didn't, and he specifically died to rabid nightmares in the Rootways while having a religious epiphany about the inherent value of the experiences of others and the lives having those experiences, great or small, mortal or immortal.
Last edited:
- Location
- United States
[X] Greed and Desire [Align offensive technique to Communication and Want]
[X] Hatred and Aversion [Align Offensive technique to Communication and Community]
I like this one because as Ling Qi herself acknowledged, she doesn't understand hatred very well. And since it's such a common motivation, she ought to learn. It gives us a little more conceptual variety too, which I think is good for developing further.
I like this one because as Ling Qi herself acknowledged, she doesn't understand hatred very well. And since it's such a common motivation, she ought to learn. It gives us a little more conceptual variety too, which I think is good for developing further.
- Location
- the internet
She wouldn't be just learning it though, she'd be aligning it with her concept of Communication. Right now we're developing Thief of Names and what we vote for will have long-term effects. Its one thing to learn about and understand grudges/hatred. Its another to commit to that for the long term. It's not LQs strength and it could make ToN weaker as an art. Do we want to be exploring the hatred inside people's head for a while? Does LQ? Seems out of character.
- Location
- Staring into the void
When you look at what each of the husband candidates have had to work through since meeting LQ, there's a 1-1 for each:
[ ] Ignorance and Delusion
Xuan Shi
[ ] Hatred and Aversion
Meng Dan
[ ] Greed and Desire
Bao Qian
[ ] Ignorance and Delusion
Xuan Shi
[ ] Hatred and Aversion
Meng Dan
[ ] Greed and Desire
Bao Qian
[X] Greed and Desire [Align offensive technique to Communication and Want]
Hmm, you know what, people convinced me. I'll go with this one. But... not for any of the reasons other people brought up.
The first reason this option appeals is I'm pretty uneasily ambivalent about this vote in general. But I think meditations on Want probably communicate to the audience more clearly and with fewer contradictions or muddling of past and future thoughts than the other options do, here. It's also the least likely of the three to step on the toes of whatever we end up doing with our Active Domain. If I had more confidence in this scenario, I'd probably jump at the chance to fiddle with related concepts ahead of time, but I don't, so I'd rather avoid muddying the waters groping around ahead of time.
The second reason this option appeals to me is that of the three, Isolation/Community/Want, Want seems closest to within Sixiang's wheelhouse. The ignorance and delusion of the first option does touch on Sixiang's nightmare aspect's "trip up the mighty" stuff, I think. But Want can be related to the aspiration and obsession which thread throughout Sixiang's nature as a muse as a whole. That secures them something interesting to do for the arc, and it provides opportunities to iterate on some of the differences in their and Ling Qi's perspectives, which they've been more honest about more recently.
Hmm, you know what, people convinced me. I'll go with this one. But... not for any of the reasons other people brought up.
The first reason this option appeals is I'm pretty uneasily ambivalent about this vote in general. But I think meditations on Want probably communicate to the audience more clearly and with fewer contradictions or muddling of past and future thoughts than the other options do, here. It's also the least likely of the three to step on the toes of whatever we end up doing with our Active Domain. If I had more confidence in this scenario, I'd probably jump at the chance to fiddle with related concepts ahead of time, but I don't, so I'd rather avoid muddying the waters groping around ahead of time.
The second reason this option appeals to me is that of the three, Isolation/Community/Want, Want seems closest to within Sixiang's wheelhouse. The ignorance and delusion of the first option does touch on Sixiang's nightmare aspect's "trip up the mighty" stuff, I think. But Want can be related to the aspiration and obsession which thread throughout Sixiang's nature as a muse as a whole. That secures them something interesting to do for the arc, and it provides opportunities to iterate on some of the differences in their and Ling Qi's perspectives, which they've been more honest about more recently.
- Pronouns
- he him
[X] Hatred and Aversion [Align Offensive technique to Communication and Community]
- Location
- FR
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Quick correction here, Isolation is covered by Forgotten Vale Melody, our first musical art that we assimilated in our domain. FFS's keywords are : Cycles, Endings, Persistence, Renewal, Want
also,
[X] Ignorance and Delusion [Align offensive technique to Communication and Isolation]
[X] Ignorance and Delusion [Align offensive technique to Communication and Isolation]
[X] Ignorance and Delusion [Align offensive technique to Communication and Isolation]
- Location
- E
[X] Ignorance and Delusion [Align offensive technique to Communication and Isolation]
I like how this ties in with Choice. After all, it can't be said you're truly making a choice if you're ignorant or deluded about the facts of the matter. And I'm all in on Choice.
I like how this ties in with Choice. After all, it can't be said you're truly making a choice if you're ignorant or deluded about the facts of the matter. And I'm all in on Choice.