Slay the Spire: FTL meets Dominion

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FTL was one of my favorite games in a while, an excellent roguelike. I've also been fond of deckbuilding games. So I was quite pleased when I ran across Slay the Spire on Steam, which is still in Early Access.

The strategic level resembles FTL. You have to proceed through 3 sectors got your 'sector' analogue:

You got your shops and their piles of choices that are often more nailbiting then the actual combat:

And then you got your turn-based combat:

The core combat is:

*Spend energy to play as many cards as you can afford to play, primarily to inflict damage or provide block that neutralizes incoming damage for this turn.
*Discard remainder of hand.
*Draw back to 5 cards, reshuffling deck as needed. Go back to full energy.

Like Dominion, you have a starter deck of 10 cards, which you will be adding to, upgrading (cards generally can be upgraded to a more powerful version, but only once), or removing. You also get Potions that are one-use consumables that don't cost an action to use, and Relics which provide key bonuses though they sometimes have negative effects too, reminiscent of Binding of Isaac. Some cards Exhaust themselves or other cards, removing them from your deck for the remainder of the Encounter, which can be a good and/or bad thing. Attacks deal damage, Skills block or do various effects, Powers are costly but once played stay out for the remainder of the Encounter providing passive effects and not clogging your deck. At the end of combat encounters, you get various rewards plus the opportunity to pick 0-1 of 3 proffered cards.

As noted before, the strategic structure resembles FTL. You have an HP bar that carries over from encounter to encounter. Instead of multiple ships, there are several (2, going on 3 by release) characters each with a huge deck of cards unique to them plus 'colorless' cards available at the merchant for anyone. There are a large number of builds, but at the same time there are a lot of enemy encounters, many of which punish or counter some strategies while being vulnerable to others. There are tons of cards which scream 'build around me' and tons of various synergies to exploit. That said unlike FTL certain elements of randomness are removed, which is a good thing as the game is laden with a lot of randomness so making some things more predictable enhances strategizing. On the strategic map, the approximate contents of locations (standard encounter, tough encounter, non-combat encounter, shop, rest spot) are made clear though its guesswork what they'll specifically have. Meanwhile in tactical combat enemies clearly communicate their planned action, allowing you to kill them, initiate blocks, or otherwise act as needed.

So far I'm still pretty early in, having played three games and getting to Sector 2 in two of them, but overall I can already tell this game is gonna be a good time sink and I'll be getting my money's worth. The graphics and sound are quite solid by indie game standards, if a tad repetitive. Has anyone else here played it? If you like deckbuilders (a la Dominion or Thunderstone, not MTG or Hearthstone) or FTL or turn-based dungeon hacky roguelikes. Now that I'm done chattering about how awesome it is I need to go play it some more.
 
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I'm liking this game as well. I'd played MTG before but not any of the Dominion-like deckbuilders, so I've been learning when to remove cards (whenever possible) and when to skip them (surprisingly often). I've got one win on each character so far. Ironclad had a weird cost-manipulation build with Double Tap and Whirlwinds. Silent was a pretty standard Noxious Fumes / stall deck.
 
Yeah, it's pretty awesome, though I'm still waiting upon a digital version of the Mage Knight board game. I think this game is still good even if you are coming from a MtG or Hearthstone framework. But don't forget that deck thinning is amazing, because deck-builders (like Dominion, Valley of the Kings, or Eminent Domain) do not have a minimum decksize.
I'm liking this game as well. I'd played MTG before but not any of the Dominion-like deckbuilders, so I've been learning when to remove cards (whenever possible) and when to skip them (surprisingly often). I've got one win on each character so far. Ironclad had a weird cost-manipulation build with Double Tap and Whirlwinds. Silent was a pretty standard Noxious Fumes / stall deck.
Overall deck-thinning is pretty hard to come by (once per shop visit, plus a fair number of random events) which is especially irritating when even upgraded starters are low value at best. However the Exhaust mechanic allows you to temporarily deck-thin for the duration of the encounter. Which means:

*Self-Exhausting cards in StS are safer picks because they don't clog the deck the same way as other cards, providing a powerful or cheap effect once per encounter then never drawn again.
*Powers similarly get played once, then remain in play indefinitely, keeping your deck size down while making the remainder possibly stronger.
*Cards that can Exhaust others can potentially trim your deck down to the point you can draw your deck every turn, playing your best cards over and over while thinning the weak ones.
*Certain other cards can create copies of cards until end of combat. Rather than getting rid of weak cards, you multiply your strong ones.

Keeping deck content focused is essential. My impression is that its not enough to have merely good individual cards. To use MTG terms, you want a Combo deck, simple Aggro or Control might work early on but to get over the finish line you need to assemble something which isn't just efficient, but grossly OP. I've won once with each character, and with each I had to develop something obnoxious:

Ironclad: Anger deck. For those who haven't played, its a card that deals mediocre damage, but costs 0 to play and puts a copy of itself in the discard pile. Playing in conjunction with card draw and other tools for card replication meant I quickly had huge hands of free cards, with the "draw when you take damage Relic" in conjunction with the "free Power card that's always in your starting hand and gives 1 draw for 1 HP every turn" meant I had at least 7 card hands. Flex providing a big strength bonus into vampiric Reaper card allowed for huge HP gains.

Silent: Poison deck. Two of the +6 Poison card, two of the one-use Triple Poison Level cards, one of the +3 Poison/per enemy/per turn card, and Nightmare, whose ability to create three replicas of a card in your current hand to appear as additional cards in your next hand is so friggin broken when you have 5 energy to work with. Both in conjunction with things like the Triple Poison (which let me do things like one-shot end bosses with the right hand) but also with utility cards like Bandage (easy HP recovery) or Footwork (so much Dexterity that you 1-2 block cards can block even the nasty alpha strikes of elite and boss monsters).

That said another game it reminds me of is Darkest Dungeon. Its combat is basically what I wished Darkest Dungeon combat was like. DD tended to favor trying to win an encounter in 1-2 turns thus making effects more complicated than "hurt enemy now" largely superfluous, and since you couldn't predict what enemies would do you couldn't respond to it anyways. In StS combat requires planning, enemies are HP sponges that you usually can't finish quickly, you can power up as the encounter goes on but so do your enemies, their indicated intent tells you whether its time to attack, block, or power up. It feels much more tactical as a result.
 
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Game has zaku slime. Took me seeing it a few times, but I just noticed spike slimes are totally smooshy zakus. Can't help but see that as a point in the game's favor.

Other than that, later level stuff reminds me pretty strongly of nerdook's monster slayers (well, the newer one). Probably unsurprising considering the nature of the general design, but spire seems to pretty strongly encourage lots of cards being played in any one turn and MS was fairly fond of nudging you in that direction, too, from what I recall.

... not that that's a criticism, particularly considering spire doesn't seem to make it as easy to rig effectively or entirely infinite looping decks, mind. It's pretty fun, if somewhat absurd, when that kind of thing really takes off.
 
Heavy Blade Strength decks are the strongest Ironclad decks right now. Other decks might see greater damage, but Heavy Blade being so common means that you'll definitely see it. Combine with Spot Weakness and some draw/defense and you can kill anything. Demon Form can work, but it eats 3 mana off the bat so you'd best have some way to deal with that problem. Limit Break is rare, but when upgraded allows you to snowball your strength gain like crazy. Two casts of Spot Weakness and two casts of Limit Break will guarantee a 50+ damage Heavy Blade+, you'll easily hit hundreds of damage as a fight continues.
 
Heavy Blade ironclad with 2-3 demon forms = hilarity for boss fights. I ended up blindly doing that as my very first run in the game (whcih I won, all the way to tier 3!) and only solidified on the position. If you can get an Apotheosis it's even better.

Poison-built SIlent with 2-3 catalysts is *also* hilarious. You can go from barely hanging onto survival to literally melting a boss in one round with the right combo (Bullet time yo).
 
Am I the only one who thinks that Ironclad is a bit underpowered? Like, Silent can legit go infinite with right cards, Ironclad can't come close with the same amount of luck.
 
Am I the only one who thinks that Ironclad is a bit underpowered? Like, Silent can legit go infinite with right cards, Ironclad can't come close with the same amount of luck.
Silent has some pretty major liabilities.

Sustain: Ironclad starts with higher health, a "gain 6 HP at end of combat" Relic, plus Reaper can give piles of HP gain with adequate damage while Feed can permanently improve max HP every combat. Silent only has Bite. My successful Silent run relied a lot on getting Bandage (heal 6 HP and exhaust, colorless ability any character can purchase at a store if it turns up) while using Nightmare to replicate it three times when running low on health AND getting the Vampire event that gets rid of Strikes in return for 5 Bites and a major max HP reduction. But you can't exactly count on that. Silent thus has a much harder time recovering HP or increasing Max HP.

Exhaust: Ironclad has 8 cards that exhaust other cards (one of which self-exhausts), 2 power cards that give effects when cards are exhausted, 1 card that can recover an exhausted card (and self-exhausts), and 11 other cards that self-exhaust. By comparison, the Silent has 10 self-exhaust cards, and nothing else. Both have one card which upgrades to not exhaust. So in review 28% of Ironclad's cards interact with Exhaust, but only 12% of Silent's cards do. Ironclad also starts with only 10 cards to the Silent's 12. This makes it much easier for Ironclad to thin their hand down to just the cards they need.


Also I'm not sure where you get the idea that Silent has easier infinite combos. The kit for each is:

Ironclad: Needs 2 Dropkicks (common) or 1 Dropkick and 1 Dual Wield (common), and something to apply the vulnerability stat. Ironclad also is better at thinning their deck down.

Silent: Needs 2 Heel Hooks (uncommon) or 1 Heel Hook and 1 Nightmare (rare) and a weakness giver to duplicate Ironclad's combo, but rarer and Nightmare won't deliver on first turn. That said Silent also has Acrobatics (common, cost 1, draw 4 discard 1), Concentrate (uncommon, cost 0, discard 2, gain 2 energy), Reflex (uncommon, if discarded, draw a card), and Tactician (rare, if discarded, gain 1 energy).

Neutral: Flash of Steel and Finesse are 0 cost cards that draw a card and can be used to gain infinite damage and block if you have two of one of them respectively, or both if you have one each. Dual Wield and Nightmare can be used as before, though Dual Wield only works on Flash of Steel.

While Ironclad has fewer options they're more commonly available and Ironclad has an easier time deck-thinning during combat as well.
 
Discard deck isn't that hard to assemble and gamble is so strong that every discard card is automaticaly decent, especially if you have upgrade it.
It's possible that I am biased due to how many more viable decks there are for Silent than Ironclad, where you just take every clash, some exhaust, dual/double and then just proceed to steamroll the opposition.
 
Discard deck isn't that hard to assemble and gamble is so strong that every discard card is automaticaly decent, especially if you have upgrade it.
It's possible that I am biased due to how many more viable decks there are for Silent than Ironclad, where you just take every clash, some exhaust, dual/double and then just proceed to steamroll the opposition.
Oops I missed Gamble and yeah that'd be excellent for infinity combos. That said Ironclad seems to have a decent array of options, though some are more situational or reliable than others.

Strength Deck: There are ton of different cards that enable Strength (some of them repeatedly) and that benefit hugely from Strength (AoE, multi-hit, Heavy Blade, Reaper)

Anger Deck: Aas noted before, done in conjunction with card draw, benefits heavily from Firebreathing and Dual Wield as well, the most synergy with Strength boosting.

Pure Defense Deck: Barricade, Body Slam, and Juggernaut are all win conditions that on their own that let you win with 0 other attack cards except Barricade where you need 1.

Single Big Attack Deck: Rampage, Searing Blow, Bludgeon all work, albeit probably not as safe as Pure Defense. Want small deck once again.

Infinite Combo Deck: 2*Dropkick, Dual Wield+Dropkick, Dual Wield+Flash of Steel, with deck-thinning or exhausting or card draw to get you where you need to be.

I've beaten Ironclad with Anger already and have a save where I've gotten to the third area with an excellent Strength deck, this despite the Steam discussion boards tending to argue that the Pure Defense deck archetype is best.
 
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Yeah, but when I play the Ironclad it feels that getting good cards and right relics is harder than on Silent. Although, to be fair, I tend to avoid 2+ elite paths, unless I already have a strong deck.
I sort of want to try Anger+Clash+Flex+Ceasing Top(?) infinite deck. But it's just so unlikely to happen!
 
I still feel like I take too many cards. Since your basic cards are crappy and you probably won't be able to get rid of them all, adding new cards initially increases the likelihood of drawing good cards. However past a certain point, adding a good card isn't worth it as it decreases your chance of drawing a win condition or a great card, or you are adding in superfluous attacks and buffs which you don't really need which can leave you more likely to get a hand with no blocks at an inconvenient time.

Since I'm still fairly new (this is my 7th run, and two of my runs were aborted early on because reasons) I'm usually still open to taking cards to experiment and see which produce best results. Like I took Limit Break, but in truth I probably shouldn't, I already have Spot Weakness, Flex, on track to have 4 base Strength at the start of the encounter from Relics, etc etc, I already really have enough to make use of my Whirlwind and Heavy Blade.

Game has zaku slime. Took me seeing it a few times, but I just noticed spike slimes are totally smooshy zakus. Can't help but see that as a point in the game's favor.

Other than that, later level stuff reminds me pretty strongly of nerdook's monster slayers (well, the newer one). Probably unsurprising considering the nature of the general design, but spire seems to pretty strongly encourage lots of cards being played in any one turn and MS was fairly fond of nudging you in that direction, too, from what I recall.

... not that that's a criticism, particularly considering spire doesn't seem to make it as easy to rig effectively or entirely infinite looping decks, mind. It's pretty fun, if somewhat absurd, when that kind of thing really takes off.
Not necessarily. One of the +1 energy/turn Boss Relics has "can only play 6 cards" as a penalty and for decks which usually stick with the base hand of 5 cards, that's one of the most harmless penalties out there. One of my successful runs was with that and my next run if successful uses it too. There are enemies which punish you for attacking or killing them, for playing certain cards, which block you from playing certain types of cards, etc etc, which can also hamstring a deck planning on lots of small cheap cards that draw or give energy.

Also if you are playing an infinite combo deck and the Time Eater (one of the three possible final bosses) shows up you are going to have a Bad Time. For people who haven't played, Time Eater has the unique property that every 12 actions the player takes, the Time Eater gets tired of you screwing around and takes a free turn AND permanently upgrades his DPS... oh and one of his actions is "restore HP to 50% of max HP".
 
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Oh aye, there's stuff like that six limit dongle. The nerdook thing I mentioned has similar mechanics, ways to interrupt something on a long enough streak. Still seems a lot like there's a lot more encouraging maximum spam than otherwise, ehehe. More than a couple relics that trigger on card use/shuffle/etc.

In other news, actually played for first time instead of watching vids. Can't say I had much of a plan, but it was definitely a heck of a thing. Won on the first go, plenty of strength silliness -- inflames + dual wield sorts of nonsense, fifty damage strikes when the last card was played, guaranteed first round demon form, etc., etc. Basically rolled every single curse granting event or relic I encountered, ehehe, which among other things meant I had over 120 max hp by the end, without even seeing feed, thanks to that +max hp when cursed relic.

High point was definitely in a single fight, though. Just one of those life link trios, went in pretty damaged (sub 40 or 50 or so). Unintentionally juggled them a bit while stacking up strength, ended up clearing the fight hitting all three at once with a more than their max hp damage reaping. 92 hp heal, ehehe. Went in near dead, came out full health. It was pretty sexy.
 
... okay, I have to ask. I'm not the only one getting pirates of dark water flashbacks every time I encounter byrds, right? It's not just me, those things really are what amounts to armless monkey birds, and the constant suspicion I'm about to trip over a minga melon relic is well founded?
 
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Seem like I'm pretty terrible at this game.

Feels bad man. :o
Don't worry, I'm super terrible too.

I read acc not combos and stuff here but actually trying to implement it seems impossible for me (aside from one time I just lucked into a poison build).
Currently I've won around 36% of my runs. I could probably win higher if I always went for the 'optimal' strategies and didn't take any risks but then the game wouldn't be any fun.

Silent: I got Girya and Vajra and Accuracy so my Shivs do shittons of damage. I can totally handle those Elites.

Spoiler Alert: She couldn't handle them.
 
Currently I've won around 36% of my runs. I could probably win higher if I always went for the 'optimal' strategies and didn't take any risks but then the game wouldn't be any fun.

Silent: I got Girya and Vajra and Accuracy so my Shivs do shittons of damage. I can totally handle those Elites.

Spoiler Alert: She couldn't handle them.

7 hours(more like 3 without idling), 11 deaths, 0 victories. qq
 
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Not necessarily. One of the +1 energy/turn Boss Relics has "can only play 6 cards" as a penalty and for decks which usually stick with the base hand of 5 cards, that's one of the most harmless penalties out there.
Just got my first win with an exhaust-heavy Ironhide with that relic.

Wasn't harmless, I got choked a few times, but it didn't matter too much - and with a few different card pickups, it might never have mattered.

On the subject of exhaust, though - is Dark Embrace + Headbutt bugged? Headbutt kept sticking the card back into my hand rather than the top of the deck, which is very annoying when I'm trying to get my Feed and Dual Wield together.

(Getting some 60+ armor each turn because there's Repulsors in a fight with with the only cost being occasionally hitting the hand-size cap? Pretty hilarious. Made for some very large Fiend Fires, too.

Maybe not quite as funny as the 2x Limit Break+ run, though, for all that that one died shamefully.)
 
The third character is out in the Beta now, which is open to everyone, just right click on the game icon in the steam interface and select under properties.

The main schtick of the robot wizard known as Defect is the Orbs, of which:

1: He by default has 3 Orb Slots, but can via cards be increased to as many as 10. You Channel to fill Slots with Orbs. If all Slots are filled, then the oldest Orb is Evoked. Instead of Strength or Dexterity, Defect has Focus, which increases the output of Orbs (upgrading Channeling cards will improve them in areas other than Orb output). Orbs stay out until Evoked.

2: Orbs have a passive effect that triggers at end of turn before enemies can act, and a stronger active effect that happens when Evoked. You begin the game with Dualcast (which Evokes the oldest Orb and gives the Evoke effect twice) and there are other cards which also let you Evoke the oldest or even all orbs and like Dualcast let you do so without having to fill all slots first.

3: There are 4 Orbs, with Active, [Passive], and (Focus) effects listed as follows:
Lightning: Deal 8 (+1) damage to random enemy [Deal 3 (+1) damage]
Dark: Deal 6 Damage to random enemy [Increase Evoke by 6 (+1) damage]
Frost: Block 2 (+1) [Block 5 (+1)]
Plasma: Gain 2 Energy [Start Turn with +1 Energy]

4: Defect has a Relic that gives him 1 Lightning Orb at the start of combat, 4 Strikes, 4 Defenses, a Zap: 1(0) Energy to Channel 1 Lightning, and Dual Cast: 2(1) Energy to Evoke the oldest Orb twice instead of once. This gives him excellent upgrade targets and the fewest Strikes/Defenses of any class. His class-specific Relic gives him a Plasma Orb at start of combat.

Other things to note about Defect:

1: It is to Powers what Ironclad is to Attacks and Silent to Skills, having the most Powers even outside of Orb effects being pseudo-powers, including a Dual-X for Powers, and unlike the other characters has two Common Powers, of which Capacitor: 1 Energy for +1 (+2) Orb Slots, means that you can readily secure more Slots. Overall I suspect that this is the REAL reason why Awakened One's Curiosity got nerfed… with the nerf its still economical for Defect to fill up on Powers giving Orb Slots and Focus.

2: Defect has some of the most powerful energy gaining options in the game and not just thanks to the Plasma Orb… so to avoid infinite combos being trivially easy, he has limited draw options. They either exhaust after use, get triggered under limited conditions "when playing powers" or "if you've played 3 or fewer cards this turn", have liabilities like "put a burn in discard pile" or involve manipulating the deck or discard pile instead of outright drawing cards. Plasma Orbs are also the hardest to consistently get.

3: I still don't know everything. I've seen 46 of his cards and need more time to draw conclusions about card strengths, weaknesses, and combos.
 
Managed to beat a run with the defect for the first time. Had to fight the awakened one as my final boss, but thankfully my deck was actually very low on powers only running a single one, That being Prime(+) (The one that draws you a card every time you channel an orb). I had a lot of cards focused on gaining lighting and frost orbs (mainly frost) along with a fission and blizzard. at the end of the awakened fight, my blizzards were doing 108 damage each.

Defect seems fun to play, but he most definitely seems to be in need of fine tuning, A good portion of the cards I run into seem useless or in need of a very specialized deck to be good.
 
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