- Pronouns
- He
[X] Consulting with your family on what to do next.
[X] Seeing if Mariana has any leads.
[X] Seeing if Mariana has any leads.
Si Deus Nobiscum: A Polish-Lithuanian Scion Quest
- Thread starter Rolman
- Start date
- Mature Historic
- Location
- United States
[X] Consulting with your family on what to do next.
- Location
- USA
[X] Seeing if Mariana has any leads.
MC-kun is frankly a political incompetent, martyred through his leg though he may be. Essentially promising the rulership of a second Voivodeship is no small act of loose lips. Mariana is frankly the one who seems to actually meaningfully grasp the political situation and who can be trusted essentially to act with unconditional support of us. At this juncture we are more useful as her political implement than the other way around as a war hero, and we seem to be entering a crucial stage of maneuvering right before blocs are beginning to solidify their opinions. If there is any crack in the block of Stephan Bathory to find, she would be the one to have found it and we ought to provide her the means to exploit it.
MC-kun is frankly a political incompetent, martyred through his leg though he may be. Essentially promising the rulership of a second Voivodeship is no small act of loose lips. Mariana is frankly the one who seems to actually meaningfully grasp the political situation and who can be trusted essentially to act with unconditional support of us. At this juncture we are more useful as her political implement than the other way around as a war hero, and we seem to be entering a crucial stage of maneuvering right before blocs are beginning to solidify their opinions. If there is any crack in the block of Stephan Bathory to find, she would be the one to have found it and we ought to provide her the means to exploit it.
[X] Seeing if Mariana has any leads.
Sertorius
Rebellious Legate
- Location
- Roma Invicta
By the way, a Sejm Marshal (Speaker) was not an office for life, one of the very few exceptions to the rule.
He was elected at the beginning of each and every Sejm by the deputies. Without choosing one proceedings could not continue, therefore it was a very important thing. Mikołaj Sienicki was a lowly Sub-Chamberlain of Chełm (a local office, the highest ranking one in the County, just above the Starosta, had judicial power - his court handled delimitation of land between nobles in his jurisdiction), however he was an excellent jurist and master orator, which earned him great respect of his peers. He was a deputy at 22 out of 25 Sejms between 1550 and 1583 and was chosen as Marshal of the Sejm an astounding 9 times (a record he holds to this day). A member of the radical Polish Brethren (broke off from the Calvinists, commonly called Arians due to denying the existence of the Holy Trinity, very pacifistic), a sworn enemy of the Catholic clergy and a Reformist to the core.
incompatibilitas were a series of laws, that prevented an individual noble from holding certain public offices at the same time, so that he could not accumulate too much power.
The current ones are:
- The Starosta cannot hold any other County office (urząd ziemski) since 1422
- A noble cannot hold more than one County office
- The Starosta cannot be a Voivode since 1454
- A Chancellor cannot be a Starosta, a Voivode, a Castellan or a Bishop of an important diocese (Gniezno, Cracow, Warmia, Płock, Kujawy)
- The Starosta cannot be a Voivode or a Castellan since 1538 (almost the same as the one from 1454, meaning it wasn't respected enough)
- A noble can hold only a single office of a Town Starosta, never more since 1562–1563
I would like to add, that while the Swordbearer of the Crown was a Royal Court office and technically had good prestige behind it, the man didn't do anything besides carrying a sword for the King (a symbol of his military power) during certain important ceremonies, like the coronation or his funeral.
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Theaxofwar
Definitely not a Bunny Cat in disguise.
- Location
- Standing right behind you
[X] Consulting with your family on what to do next.
As much as I'd love to have another scene with Mariana, I do think it's worth consulting with our father.
As much as I'd love to have another scene with Mariana, I do think it's worth consulting with our father.
Asherterix
Out Exploring
- Location
- Approx. 15,396,300,000 miles away
- Pronouns
- He/They
[X] Consulting with your family on what to do next.
XXXV. October 24-25, 1575. Warszawa, Polish Crownlands.
- Location
- United States
You decide that, well, Father knows best. And he's been doing just as much snooping about as you have – if anything, people may have been more open with the old man, on account of his heroic past and powerful present. Important as you may be within the Habsburg faction, you are still a third son, not even twenty-five, and with only three years of experience in the homeland under your belt. That meeting with the four lords made you feel it.
Nevertheless, when you see Father again the following morning, you give him the mainly-good news: Lord Tarnowski and Prince Wiśniowiecki stand prepared to vote for the Archduke, Tyskiewicz's deference likely nets his vote for Austria when the time comes, while Hetman Sieniawski votes (rather impartially, at least) for the Transylvanian.
"You've done well, son," says Father, eyes darting between your face and your leg. "You are still healing well?"
You adjust your grip on your crutches. "So say the physicians," you tell him, "I'm gaining weight again and the fever hasn't returned for well over a week."
He sighs and cracks his knuckles; there's a trace of relief on his stony face. "Good. That is very good. We were all very worried," he says. He's been kinder since your amputation. You wonder if your brush with death made him realize that you're more than just an extension of the family to him. You certainly hope that's the case. He was so friendly to you when you were a boy, but these days? Well, you ought to listen to him. "I have a question for you, son."
"Anything, Father."
"Ladies." He cocks his head. "What are your thoughts on them?"
"Well…" You exhale, searching for words, thinking of Mariana, who you reckon to be the finest her race has to offer. "They are strange creatures," you decide to say. "Glorious in their purity yet oh-so-foolish at times. Eve's stain is written all across them, and many are Jezebels. But those who are not? As good as any man."
"Rumor has it Princess Mariana is a formidable lady indeed," he says, cracking a little smile – an uncommon expression for him. "And has done good work for the cause, spreading favorable rumors, convincing her fellows. As much as the family would have benefited from your marriage to Princess Ostrogska – well, your brothers are bachelors still." He waves away the thought. "Nevermind that. I agree with your assessment. The strong ones are wolves among meek little sheep."
You nod. "They are the most dangerous ones. But if you can make yourself the master of one…" Heh, or is Mariana the one holding the leash? Ugh, I'm such a half-man at times!
"Do you remember anything of your mother?" he asks.
A spike shoots through you. You shake your head. "Only her face."
"She was a fiery one," he says. "And I was awful to her." You've never seen his face so expressive, so open! "I was too young and proud to appreciate the charms – and benefits – of that powerful, mannish sort of lady, the kind that can stand with her back straight and look her lord in the eye. We fought nearly every day." Yes, so go the stories that Marszowski told me. Hair-pulling and thrown chairs, servants cowering in their service corridors for fear of encountering either of them.
"I see, Father," you say, retaining formality, even as the patriarch shows his heart. You're unsure what to do when he gets like this; when does he ever?
"The Infanta Anna is of a similar sort. Quiet, though. Her spinster life is not an act, but her silence is a tool," he says. "Although she is a ward of the realm and rightly under the control of good men, impartial men – well, you know how a woman can get her word out, make an announcement of her own despite law and, perhaps, nature."
"Indeed…"
"She has promised herself neither to Prince Batory nor the Archduke. Burned by the Walezy fiasco, I suppose, when he slow-walked marrying her." Another smile! "Rumor also has it that you've met her before, and had a personal audience."
"I did," you say. "And it was on the topic of her marriage to one of the Emperor's sons – she refused flatly."
"How long ago was that?"
You hum. "Perhaps a year ago? Yes, last fall," you say.
"Well, things have changed mightily, haven't they?" replies Father. "Batory's become the official opposition to the Archduke, who has now been chosen specifically from the ranks of his clan. In short, she's got proper suitors now."
"Right," you say, deciding to guess his next move. "So we ought to make contact with her, then? Have her declare for someone?"
"Precisely," says Father. "Though she ultimately has no say in the matter, naturally. Still, it's a message that can't be ignored."
"So, we ought to make contact?"
"That's right," he says. "And I figured that, given your familiarity, you would be up to the task. But, if you believe your talents are better used here than at Kraków, you reckon, we can forego that, speak to her via emissary." Father shifts in his chair. "I trust you to make a good decision, son. Besides, you've met her, not I."
You try to hide your shock. Everyone's been so different since your amputation, as if you instantly aged to a veteran of thirty-five or forty. You're no longer some half-French little lad with a backwater castellancy and a good speech under his belt: you're trusted, listened to and, as it may seem, even forgiven by Father for your unilateral expedition to Vienna. Perhaps it's aided by the Archduke's waxing chances, but it's best not to think about it right now.
"Thankfully," Father adds, "she's at her lodgings in Łomża, rather than Kraków, so you should be able to make it there in five days as opposed to ten or so. What say you?"
That means you may miss the beginning of the Election Sejm, depending on how long you're detained, though the proceedings will likely continue through the month and possibly even into December. You say:
[] "It will be done, Father."
Even though he offered you the option to stay, it may be best to follow his orders. Despite your familiarity with the Infanta being vaguely combative, a foot in the door is a foot in the door, and you're unequivocally a representative of the Radziwiłłowie and Habsburg faction alike.
[] "I think I ought to stay here, Father."
Communication by letter or emissary may be the best idea – a light touch, as people will surely notice and therefore talk. Besides that, you don't want to miss out on any developments here at the Sejm.
[] "Perhaps my wife may visit her?"
An unconventional idea, and mildly scandalous for allowing Mariana to travel without you, her legal master. However, she has a clean slate with the Infanta and, uh, well, women like talking to other women, don't they? You're not sure. You could imagine a backfire though: you could be regarded as too cowardly to come yourself.
[] "What if asking her to marry the Archduke makes her declare for Batory instead?"
A little nervous of you, but not unfounded. She's stayed silent, watching and waiting, with an airtight seal around her true thoughts that even the wiliest intriguers can't get to. You're concerned that if she's pushed by one side it'll slide her right into the arms of the opposing one.
Nevertheless, when you see Father again the following morning, you give him the mainly-good news: Lord Tarnowski and Prince Wiśniowiecki stand prepared to vote for the Archduke, Tyskiewicz's deference likely nets his vote for Austria when the time comes, while Hetman Sieniawski votes (rather impartially, at least) for the Transylvanian.
"You've done well, son," says Father, eyes darting between your face and your leg. "You are still healing well?"
You adjust your grip on your crutches. "So say the physicians," you tell him, "I'm gaining weight again and the fever hasn't returned for well over a week."
He sighs and cracks his knuckles; there's a trace of relief on his stony face. "Good. That is very good. We were all very worried," he says. He's been kinder since your amputation. You wonder if your brush with death made him realize that you're more than just an extension of the family to him. You certainly hope that's the case. He was so friendly to you when you were a boy, but these days? Well, you ought to listen to him. "I have a question for you, son."
"Anything, Father."
"Ladies." He cocks his head. "What are your thoughts on them?"
"Well…" You exhale, searching for words, thinking of Mariana, who you reckon to be the finest her race has to offer. "They are strange creatures," you decide to say. "Glorious in their purity yet oh-so-foolish at times. Eve's stain is written all across them, and many are Jezebels. But those who are not? As good as any man."
"Rumor has it Princess Mariana is a formidable lady indeed," he says, cracking a little smile – an uncommon expression for him. "And has done good work for the cause, spreading favorable rumors, convincing her fellows. As much as the family would have benefited from your marriage to Princess Ostrogska – well, your brothers are bachelors still." He waves away the thought. "Nevermind that. I agree with your assessment. The strong ones are wolves among meek little sheep."
You nod. "They are the most dangerous ones. But if you can make yourself the master of one…" Heh, or is Mariana the one holding the leash? Ugh, I'm such a half-man at times!
"Do you remember anything of your mother?" he asks.
A spike shoots through you. You shake your head. "Only her face."
"She was a fiery one," he says. "And I was awful to her." You've never seen his face so expressive, so open! "I was too young and proud to appreciate the charms – and benefits – of that powerful, mannish sort of lady, the kind that can stand with her back straight and look her lord in the eye. We fought nearly every day." Yes, so go the stories that Marszowski told me. Hair-pulling and thrown chairs, servants cowering in their service corridors for fear of encountering either of them.
"I see, Father," you say, retaining formality, even as the patriarch shows his heart. You're unsure what to do when he gets like this; when does he ever?
"The Infanta Anna is of a similar sort. Quiet, though. Her spinster life is not an act, but her silence is a tool," he says. "Although she is a ward of the realm and rightly under the control of good men, impartial men – well, you know how a woman can get her word out, make an announcement of her own despite law and, perhaps, nature."
"Indeed…"
"She has promised herself neither to Prince Batory nor the Archduke. Burned by the Walezy fiasco, I suppose, when he slow-walked marrying her." Another smile! "Rumor also has it that you've met her before, and had a personal audience."
"I did," you say. "And it was on the topic of her marriage to one of the Emperor's sons – she refused flatly."
"How long ago was that?"
You hum. "Perhaps a year ago? Yes, last fall," you say.
"Well, things have changed mightily, haven't they?" replies Father. "Batory's become the official opposition to the Archduke, who has now been chosen specifically from the ranks of his clan. In short, she's got proper suitors now."
"Right," you say, deciding to guess his next move. "So we ought to make contact with her, then? Have her declare for someone?"
"Precisely," says Father. "Though she ultimately has no say in the matter, naturally. Still, it's a message that can't be ignored."
"So, we ought to make contact?"
"That's right," he says. "And I figured that, given your familiarity, you would be up to the task. But, if you believe your talents are better used here than at Kraków, you reckon, we can forego that, speak to her via emissary." Father shifts in his chair. "I trust you to make a good decision, son. Besides, you've met her, not I."
You try to hide your shock. Everyone's been so different since your amputation, as if you instantly aged to a veteran of thirty-five or forty. You're no longer some half-French little lad with a backwater castellancy and a good speech under his belt: you're trusted, listened to and, as it may seem, even forgiven by Father for your unilateral expedition to Vienna. Perhaps it's aided by the Archduke's waxing chances, but it's best not to think about it right now.
"Thankfully," Father adds, "she's at her lodgings in Łomża, rather than Kraków, so you should be able to make it there in five days as opposed to ten or so. What say you?"
That means you may miss the beginning of the Election Sejm, depending on how long you're detained, though the proceedings will likely continue through the month and possibly even into December. You say:
[] "It will be done, Father."
Even though he offered you the option to stay, it may be best to follow his orders. Despite your familiarity with the Infanta being vaguely combative, a foot in the door is a foot in the door, and you're unequivocally a representative of the Radziwiłłowie and Habsburg faction alike.
[] "I think I ought to stay here, Father."
Communication by letter or emissary may be the best idea – a light touch, as people will surely notice and therefore talk. Besides that, you don't want to miss out on any developments here at the Sejm.
[] "Perhaps my wife may visit her?"
An unconventional idea, and mildly scandalous for allowing Mariana to travel without you, her legal master. However, she has a clean slate with the Infanta and, uh, well, women like talking to other women, don't they? You're not sure. You could imagine a backfire though: you could be regarded as too cowardly to come yourself.
[] "What if asking her to marry the Archduke makes her declare for Batory instead?"
A little nervous of you, but not unfounded. She's stayed silent, watching and waiting, with an airtight seal around her true thoughts that even the wiliest intriguers can't get to. You're concerned that if she's pushed by one side it'll slide her right into the arms of the opposing one.
Small Clarification for a Part XXXV voting choice
- Location
- United States
Ah, I didn't really consider that. Let's say yes, she accompanies, but your audience with the Infanta would be one-on-one
- Location
- United States
Astra Myst
Do you want a wish?
- Location
- Milky Way Galaxy
[X] "Perhaps my wife may visit her?"
Trust the plan (wife)
Trust the plan (wife)
bookwyrm
Doom of Public Libraries
- Location
- Wichita, Kansas
[X] "Perhaps my wife may visit her?"
Yeah honestly it just seems the right call, in that Mariana can at least check in, while also having some plausibly deniability as just women talking about womanly business in case nothing comes of it, so that Anna isn't quite pressured into more actively shaping her silence into a ringing endorsement of Bathory. Plus, even if there is the whiff of cowardice about it and this ends the honeymoon of Stan giving up his leg for his country, that's just falling from a height, not really being lowered down into a pit of negative repute, its something the family can afford to cash out if it has to. Plus- Mariana interlude!
Yeah honestly it just seems the right call, in that Mariana can at least check in, while also having some plausibly deniability as just women talking about womanly business in case nothing comes of it, so that Anna isn't quite pressured into more actively shaping her silence into a ringing endorsement of Bathory. Plus, even if there is the whiff of cowardice about it and this ends the honeymoon of Stan giving up his leg for his country, that's just falling from a height, not really being lowered down into a pit of negative repute, its something the family can afford to cash out if it has to. Plus- Mariana interlude!
