Remove ads

RHUNRIKKI STROLLAR (Warhammer Fantasy Golden Age Dwarf Runelord Quest)

Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
Reader mode
A friendly reminder to new questers to read the Informational threadmarks and FAQ specifically before asking a question. Links below:

Frequently Asked Questions
Here is the Detailed Rune List
Discord.

On Thread Etiquette:
I'm not going to weigh in on the logic of either side's arguments, but I will ask that everyone read over what they write and really consider if the words they used are polite and won't be inflammatory intentionally or not. You cant account for people's tolerances perfectly but at least try to say your piece without saying things that can be easily construed as overly dismissive of the other side of the argument, thank you.

Please endeavour to be cordial. :^)
 
Last edited:
Dark as Silver said:
If their gear is at risk of damaging it was shoddily made. Unless the rune of MBreaking was involved, in which case what you have their isn't a rune of sparring, its a rune of being indestructible.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Hence why I talk about virtual sparring. And things like MBreaking would need to be trained with and against, and are a very valid combat option that.

And any non-adamant gear can break or be damaged in combat, that's just part of how it works. Generally weapons and armour are designed to do so, as be taking small amounts of damage they dissipate energy and avoid catastrophic damage to the item or the person using it.
 
Last edited:
01paradox01 said:
You seem certain of that, but I think you're just jumping to the worst case scenario. As @BronzeTongue said, Snorri loses nothing by at least talking to Vragni in a private discussion, so why not attempt to do so? Writing it off without trying it speaks of a lack of due diligence in my mind. If nothing comes of it, so be it! But it's a failure on Snorri's end to not see this through properly and in the best way possible.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I guess Snorri loses nothing if he tries at it privately...hopefully. I'm genuinely worried that Vragni will take anything Snorri tries as an insult and then get riled up into making the situation worse.

Like, this omake might only be semi-canon, but it's still a canon enough look into Vragni's mind. Snorri is wicked, someone who must be stopped for the good of the runesmithing community. Vragni relaxing his stance even a smidgen wouldn't be a mark of reasonable disagreement between two peers in the community, it would be making allowances for evil to attack the roots of his culture and religion instead of making a righteous stand against it. It would be closing his eyes to the injustice of constantly spitting on Thungni's name. It would be shameful.

He is fighting tooth and nail, even having gone against some of his own beliefs to partially centralize the runesmithing community in his area in response to Snorri's own, all in order to save the north from what would lead to the destruction of his religion as he understands it--and he believes this to be all at the hands of one particular dwarf. Again, as Snorri is said dwarf, how does he even try to approach someone who thinks like that?
 
Last edited:
Ambit said:
I guess Snorri loses nothing if he tries at it privately...hopefully. I'm genuinely worried that Vragni will take anything Snorri tries as an insult and then get riled up into making the situation worse.

Like, this omake might only be semi-canon, but it's still a canon enough look into Vragni's mind. Snorri is wicked, someone who must be stopped for the good of the runesmithing community. Vragni relaxing his stance even a smidgen wouldn't be a mark of reasonable disagreement between two peers in the community, it would be making allowances for evil to attack the roots of his culture and religion instead of making a righteous stand against it. It would be closing his eyes to the injustice of constantly spitting on Thungni's name. It would be shameful.

He is fighting tooth and nail, even having gone against some of his own beliefs to partially centralize the runesmithing community in his area in response to Snorri's own, all in order to save the north from what would lead to the destruction of his religion as he understands it--and he believes this to be all at the hands of one particular dwarf. Again, as Snorri is said dwarf, how does he even try to approach someone who thinks like that?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

By approaching them in the first place. I think a discussion would do both of them a lot of good, because as far as I know, Vragni and Snorri have NEVER had a heart to heart conversation about the whole situation. The best way of un-demonizing someone is to interact and talk with them. The opposite is also true, demonzing someone is extremely easy when you don't come into contact with them often, if at all. Sure, it might fail, but as far as the omake is concerned, Vragni does hold a good deal of respect for Snorri as a runesmith. I think Snorri could leverage that respect to have the honest conversation needed to make it work.
 
I feel that the best way to manage the feud with Vragni, unfortunately, is to keep on succeeding so that he doesn't push for more open conflict for fear he'd lose.

That means maximising Snorri's personal standing and doing what we can to increase the number of Snorrist Runelords and prominent Master Runesmiths.

That's a very long game though, and would require things like regularly teaching more apprentices and setting an example that other senior Snorrists should take apprentices, although there are other things that might help such as further research into the Mind of Things chain. Although even our improved MRoBrotherhood doesn't make people learn runecraft itself faster, it may make apprentices learn the precursor skills such as precise chisel-work faster.

Thule said:
i think we should get Karstah into the Brotherhood of Dron for the work she did into the Greater Dragonblood Smelter
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

I'm not sure, but they may only accept Runelords as members.
 
Last edited:
soulcake said:
More that he went after/mostly succeeded with just the Snorrists. Trade's a trade after all, and the Drazh Runesmith made no provisions against sharing.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Ah then if everyone involved is happy thats fine. We lose a bit in relative advantage, but part of the ideal is that we get more and better works from exchange than hoarding.

Probably want to take up apprentices again sometime soon though, this sort of balance can easilt tip wrongly if only the younger runesmiths bother with apprentices. Gotta be a good example.
 
veekie said:
Ah then if everyone involved is happy thats fine. We lose a bit in relative advantage, but part of the ideal is that we get more and better works from exchange than hoarding.

Probably want to take up apprentices again sometime soon though, this sort of balance can easilt tip wrongly if only the younger runesmiths bother with apprentices. Gotta be a good example.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

When we've finished with the dragon-rearing is probably a good time.
 
Ambit said:
I guess Snorri loses nothing if he tries at it privately...hopefully. I'm genuinely worried that Vragni will take anything Snorri tries as an insult and then get riled up into making the situation worse.

Like, this omake might only be semi-canon, but it's still a canon enough look into Vragni's mind. Snorri is wicked, someone who must be stopped for the good of the runesmithing community. Vragni relaxing his stance even a smidgen wouldn't be a mark of reasonable disagreement between two peers in the community, it would be making allowances for evil to attack the roots of his culture and religion instead of making a righteous stand against it. It would be closing his eyes to the injustice of constantly spitting on Thungni's name. It would be shameful.

He is fighting tooth and nail, even having gone against some of his own beliefs to partially centralize the runesmithing community in his area in response to Snorri's own, all in order to save the north from what would lead to the destruction of his religion as he understands it--and he believes this to be all at the hands of one particular dwarf. Again, as Snorri is said dwarf, how does he even try to approach someone who thinks like that?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

If Vragni really hated Snorri that much, he'd have already declared a Grudge. The fact that he hasn't means almost by definition that he thinks there's something worthy of respect about his fellow Runelord.
 
Ambit said:
The problem is that, from what little I've seen of Vragni, he wants that to happen. He wants things to get extremely clannish and just short of a full-on grudge or cold war. He wants to stop people from going to our school, and has been applying (or at least allowing) heavy social pressure to do so at least in his home hold.

There isn't a way for any bridges to be built in any form. His starting position leaves no room for that.

He might be an elder dwarf, but he's an elder dwarf priest of Thungni who literally believes Snorri has overturned everything about their shared religion to the point of heresy. How do you go from there? The only time Snorri has ever approached cooperation with Vragni is when they were facing down enemies of dwarvenkind. Outside of that....absolutely nothing.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
No I disagree with the framing of the first paragraph.
He thinks Snorri's way will inevitably lead to a schism and its also borderline heresy and a power grab to control the regions runesmiths. You can internally justify a lot in order to prevent that. He isn't doing this because he wants runesmiths to be clannish, he just doesn't see any other way to limit Snorri's influence.
Alratan said:
Hence why I talk about virtual sparring. And things like MBreaking would need to be trained with and against, and are a very valid combat option that.

And any non-adamant gear can break or be damaged in combat, that's just part of how it works. Generally weapons and armour are designed to do so, as be taking small amounts of damage they dissipate energy and avoid catastrophic damage to the item or the person using it.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
What do you mean by virtual sparring? Because I suspect we'd have an easier time trying to create a rune that literally downloads memories than something that can create a 100% safe virtual space which can replicate any possible magical effect.
As for things breaking or being damaged. Yes but keep in mind how bonkers dwarven constructions are. Its not uncommon for dwarves to die before their armour gives out, pretty sure explicitly was given as the cause of death of one of the runelords in the grand incursion.
 
Ambit said:
The problem is that, from what little I've seen of Vragni, he wants that to happen. He wants things to get extremely clannish and just short of a full-on grudge or cold war. He wants to stop people from going to our school, and has been applying (or at least allowing) heavy social pressure to do so at least in his home hold.

There isn't a way for any bridges to be built in any form. His starting position leaves no room for that.

He might be an elder dwarf, but he's an elder dwarf priest of Thungni who literally believes Snorri has overturned everything about their shared religion to the point of heresy. How do you go from there? The only time Snorri has ever approached cooperation with Vragni is when they were facing down enemies of dwarvenkind. Outside of that....absolutely nothing.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I don't think so, not exactly anyway.

What Vragni wants is to win because he cares about the fate of the guild. He doesn't want to see it destroy any more than Snorri does, and was pragmatic enough to effectively bite the bullet on parts of Snorri's ideas in order to have the influence to help as he sees it.

Being a runelord means being responsible for making sure the guild stays healthy, and issues like the ones we had with the prosthetics are handled cleanly.

I don't think we could convince him we're right via personal appeal, but I do believe he'd see the necessity of keeping things above the belt to avoid destroying the institution he's fighting for.

As long as we only propose things that aren't biased one way or the other I think he'd take it.
 
Karstah fills narrative role of apprentice for now. We have multiple runesmithing revolutions in the pipeline so the earliest I'd advocate for a new apprentice is once we have windsight, solved the consternation, and have akazit. At that point the apprentice would actually have narrative purpose beyond what the existing ones and Karstah already do, namely how runesmiths going forward will be taught about the winds and runes now that they are understood.

Also there just isn't time if we want to windsight and akazit done anytime within the next 5 turns to take an apprentice.
 
Ompa60 said:
On this note, perhaps we should do something to try to mitigate a schism or make it less hostile? Maybe visit his institution and give genuine gruff complements? (It definitely does deserve them even if we disagree somewhat with the ethos behind it)
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Think I recall that there was a WOG that said it
Snorri took a single step in then it's instant Grudge from Vragni's
 
Not gonna lie, I see Snorri's and Vragni's rivalry as one-sided (mostly) because of Snorri's attitude, with him respecting Vragni and not really taking that rivalry that seriously, or at least he is not looking at Vragni's methods in bad way. Meanwhile, Vragni is pretty much spiteful towards Snorri and his methods. I especially got that feeling when one of his apprentices met one of Vragni's and Snorri's one as really confused.
 
Been skimming this conversation so I don't know if anyone's brought it up yet, but Vragni and Snorri have exchanged letters, which is about as private as you can get for dwarves. My statement thus is that private conversation some want happened in some sense - it was an insult fest. Any other conversation face to face is going to be an insult fest. (Point of historical fact, the last time Vragni and Snorri interacted in person during the war was an insult fest, just a subtle one)

I don't think a private conversation would do anything, because the fundamental problem is Snorri's beliefs and actions and those are not going to be changing. I very much doubt this thread is going to backpedal on the things we've been doing or are planning to do.

If our actions and behavior are not going to change, then we have to convince him that the potential future consequences of our actions are not as threatening or as possible as he thinks. And we have no evidence whatsoever for that - not even enough to convince a human. What we're doing could end in disaster and we have no idea if it will or not. It will probably be good, but we don't have any actual hard evidence for it.
 
Last edited:
Basically, we already crossed that bridge and it is almost burning, so we do our thing and will deal with the consequences later, especially if Vragni is one to create a schism because he was too paranoid, it doesn't help that he started teaching his students that Snorri is bad and his way of doing stuff is bad, while Snorri didn't tell his students anything about that rivalry, I think until their students met up, we didn't know about it too.

Like, Vragni could leave it completely private between him and Snorri, but he basically created a rivalry between his and Snorri's students, especially those who became Snorrists and they basically rival Vragni's students mostly because of them adopting Snorri's way of doing things.

Did I write it comprehensibly?
 
soulcake said:
Sextupling a single Smelter's total capacity, and effectively tripling the rate of production for Adamant while minimizing the number of reagents needed? It required Adamant to do it, an expensive amount, but one it could recoup in as short as twenty years under the right conditions
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
@soulcake, now that we have such an insane amount of adamant production, can you give us some voting options next turn about dedicating some of it to our apprentices?

I could see a lot of us electing to build an additional smelter and use its proceeds to give our apprentices an ingot per decade adamant allowance, or maybe voting to give them the reagents to make their own UltraSmelter.

Would it be possible to have some options like that next update?
EDIT: @soulcake repinging as a reminder now that the turn is being rolled/written.
 
Last edited:
Reader mode
You must login or register to reply here.
Remove ads
Back
Top