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RHUNRIKKI STROLLAR (Warhammer Fantasy Golden Age Dwarf Runelord Quest)

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I'm not going to weigh in on the logic of either side's arguments, but I will ask that everyone read over what they write and really consider if the words they used are polite and won't be inflammatory intentionally or not. You cant account for people's tolerances perfectly but at least try to say your piece without saying things that can be easily construed as overly dismissive of the other side of the argument, thank you.

Please endeavour to be cordial. :^)
 
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Karugus said:
It feels weird to say, but even assuming Malekith is going to try and seize the throne here, he might not even want to risk involving the Dwarfs unless he's desperate for a Hail Mary.
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The canon War of Vengeance was a Hail Mary on Malekith's part, one made several decades after he and his followers had been driven off of Ulthuan. It was more successful than he ever expected, but it was a Hail Mary nonetheless.
 
VexMasterTyrant said:
But I wouldn't bet on singular Brana to take on a Dragon in single combat, but their most skilled and powerful members might be able to take on Dragons with the help of a couple of specialized Dragon-Killing squads. Also, Elvish Legolas Expies would be pretty deadly for the Branas as well, given how they are quite vulnerable in the air when fighting against skilled Elves that specialize in ranged combat or long range magical attacks.
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No one honestly expects Brana to go 1v1 with Dragons, but they would be far more numerous than Dragons, tbh.

I guess it would be difficult for Elgi to get to same closeness as Dawi, given that we live directly underneath their Ancestor God, so can influence the whole thing with quest actions.

And if they do, all the better. As they would be another point of failure in Malekith's plan, and another avenue for diplomacy and peace, all said. Finally, remember that it wasn't War of Vengeance that broke Karaz Ankor, but the Time of Woes, where Brana would, everyone has already seen, play a much more important role by the virtue of sharing our mountains.

And ranged combatants are always a problem... But that doesn't mean they can't fight back at all. After all, the operative word is Range, and if nothing works, then just high altitude bombing runs themselves would work wonders in getting Elgi colonies to the knee.


Jack vile Ripper said:
Dhar-using Brana? Genuine question, plausible or no?
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If the Brana get all eight winds, then prolly the KoTS can get Dhar, or even True Dhar going?

I think Brana can access one wind, like humans, according to what we have read, so accumulating dhar like humans would prolly be difficult.
 
FortTell said:
I think I can get a couple more bits done. Full caps are words that I missed and they have been inserted from the first answer

a tiwazir otrek ongaz rik a kraka drak
/HERE RESTS Otrek, first king of Kraka Drak,

zan a grimnir
/blood of Grimnir,

bazirundi drungi adamant drakk
/rune-somebodies? defeats(noun) The Adamant Wyrm,

drakendrengi un drakenogridrengi
/slayer of dragons and dragon ogres,

dum a kholek zonguzeni
/DOOM of Khoek Suneater

langk ek adrit nu ek tiwazir
/long he did deeds, now he RESTS,

katalhuikazen
/thus arriving (to)

khazaz bin duraz
/HOME in stone

gazul bar baraz gazul gand baraz
/A BOND TO Gazul's GATE, Gazul HELP THEM FIND THE GATE

Wanrag sar or angoten
/where might I be marching (in the future)?
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Getting closer. 😊

bazirundi's first 'i' should be an 'a'
drungi is correct, but not correctly translated to english. Look at the signifier at the end.
adrit is correct, but not correctly translated to english. It's a word that comes from rik.

Three words left that need to be deciphered.

And of course the answer to the question.

Wanrag sar or angotten?
 
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Dutch said:
Three words left that need to be deciphered.

And of course the answer to the question.

Wanrag sar or angotten?
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Here is the second attempt then

- so "adrit" should be "ruled" then, making the line "long did he rule, now he rests"
- "baz" is the toughest part, found only in an unofficial source as "below/beneath", and "rundi" is part of the words "hammerer" and "thunderer", so together they make "below-warrior"="warrior of the deeps"?
- If the "i" at the end of "drungi" is not a plural signifier, but a "in general" signifier, then the word may translate as "defeat/conquer/vanquish-ing in general"

a tiwazir otrek ongaz rik a kraka drak
/HERE RESTS Otrek, first king of Kraka Drak,

zan a grimnir
/blood of Grimnir,

bazarundi drungi adamant drakk
/warrior of the deeps, the conquering Adamant Wyrm,

drakendrengi un drakenogridrengi
/slayer of dragons and dragon ogres,

dum a kholek zonguzeni
/DOOM of Khoek Suneater

langk ek adrit nu ek tiwazir
/long did he rule, now he RESTS,

katalhuikazen
/thus arriving (to)

khazaz bin duraz
/HOME in stone

gazul bar baraz gazul gand baraz
/A BOND TO Gazul's GATE, Gazul HELP THEM FIND THE GATE

Wanrag sar or angoten
/where might I be marching (in the future)?

Due to the choice of some very specific words describing Otrek's destination I believe Otrek is headed for the mouth of the Reik, a place known today as the Wasteland, but which is mentioned to have been a beautiful land at the time before the War of the Beard.
 
FortTell said:
Here is the second attempt then

- so "adrit" should be "ruled" then, making the line "long did he rule, now he rests"
- "baz" is the toughest part, found only in an unofficial source as "below/beneath", and "rundi" is part of the words "hammerer" and "thunderer", so together they make "below-warrior"="warrior of the deeps"?
- If the "i" at the end of "drungi" is not a plural signifier, but a "in general" signifier, then the word may translate as "defeat/conquer/vanquish-ing in general"

a tiwazir otrek ongaz rik a kraka drak
/HERE RESTS Otrek, first king of Kraka Drak,

zan a grimnir
/blood of Grimnir,

bazarundi drungi adamant drakk
/warrior of the deeps, the conquering Adamant Wyrm,

drakendrengi un drakenogridrengi
/slayer of dragons and dragon ogres,

dum a kholek zonguzeni
/DOOM of Khoek Suneater

langk ek adrit nu ek tiwazir
/long did he rule, now he RESTS,

katalhuikazen
/thus arriving (to)

khazaz bin duraz
/HOME in stone

gazul bar baraz gazul gand baraz
/A BOND TO Gazul's GATE, Gazul HELP THEM FIND THE GATE

Wanrag sar or angoten
/where might I be marching (in the future)?

Due to the choice of some very specific words describing Otrek's destination I believe Otrek is headed for the mouth of the Reik, a place known today as the Wasteland, but which is mentioned to have been a beautiful land at the time before the War of the Beard.
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Comments
Adrit is correct as is drungi. Rule and conquerer.
Turns out I fucked up on the first word. Should be Barazundi instead of Bazarundi. Oops, my apologies.

While thematic and though he probably could, Otrek does not head towards the Wasteland.
 
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I think it would be really boring, if everything went perfectly for us in regards to the Elves. Chaos' Canon behavior borders on gross incompetence and is barely more than a boogeyman, even when almost none of the order factions truly work together.

I for one would enjoy something more interesting. Of course, if the factions of Chaos were capable of bringing even a semblance of order (hah!) and organization into their midst, then they would actually be a threat. But that goes against their nature.

The problem lies in the fact, that Chaos factions have only a very limited number of ways to gain strength and most of that is short term in nature. (I. E.: bigger demons, converting factions, etc.) Most of these things are purely martial in nature and provide no economic, social, administrative, diplomatic or technological benefits. This ultimately leads to the point, where a Quest faction will simply outpace Chaos on all levels and forces the QM to give Chaos ever escalating units or boni in the only real area that seems to matter: Martial prowess.

I know that we won't see Tzeentch taking over the administration of countries and destroying them from within (Now there is an idea...) or, dark gods forbid, actually work together, but giving Chaos more depth and the chance to progress as well would be great to create more conflict. Especially, if we end up as eternal friends of the Elves and have no serious enemy left.
 
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Hey when are fimir gonna show up? weren't they just beginning their "golden age" durning this time before humans showed up and chaos gods abandoned them, (in total war there's a sizeable population of them haunting the frozen bogs and swamps of Norsca, of course it doesn't say whether that canon with GW so take it as you will )
 
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Woltaire said:
Hey when are fimir gonna show up? weren't they just beginning their "golden age" durning this time before humans showed up and chaos gods abandoned them
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It was my understanding that the Fimir were on the planet before the Old Ones showed up. The thing is, all signs point to them living in the regions around Marienburg and on the isle of Albion. Which are both quite far away from any dwarf Holds, much less the Holds of the Norse Dwarfs.
 
Sir_Travelsalot said:
It was my understanding that the Fimir were on the planet before the Old Ones showed up. The thing is, all signs point to them living in the regions around Marienburg and on the isle of Albion. Which are both quite far away from any dwarf Holds, much less the Holds of the Norse Dwarfs.
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added in part about norsca in previous post with an astricas asterisk to it , according to warhammer fantasy it say this Long before the rise of Man, possibly while the High Elves ruled the Old World,[4a]​ the Fimir worshipped the Chaos Gods, and for a time enjoyed their favour. the elves partly ruled in old world durning the dwarf golden age
Edit: fimir also moved into Marienburg after war of vengeance
 
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Mr. Idiot said:
Seriously guys, why plan for the war when you really should try to stop the war from happening at all?
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I wouldn't say anyone's really planning for the war. We simply know that the Karaz Ankor was at its zenith right before the War of Vengeance, so we're comparing the state of the KA now to then to try and evaluate how much long-term change we've brought about by our actions.

Or at least, that's been my understanding, I'm not a krutting mind reader. :V
 
Mr. Idiot said:
Seriously guys, why plan for the war when you really should try to stop the war from happening at all?
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Why plan for ever being ill if you should try to stop it? Why save money for a rainy day when you should try to stop it? Why ever buy insurance for your car if you should try to stop it? You should hope for the best and plan for the worst not hope for the best and sit there.

Besides preventing the War of the Beard is explicitly called out as one of the things that is almost impossible to change but not quite impossible.
 
Hope we don't get any Dhar using Brana when they go insane it would cause quite a rift in Dawi - Brana relations.
 
Really there are several points where the war of vengence can be averted.

First woukd be stopping Malekith from ever going to the north and finding the literally cursed iron circlet. Second would be someone that can recognise it as a dark artifact seeing malekith with it before he leaves. Third would be finding out about the elven civil war. Fourth would be managing to actually capture the perpetrators of the attacks and figuring out their corruption. Fifth would be just plain preventing an ambassador from being sent.

And that's all assuming that things go canon up to the point malekith arrives in the old world, which we have no guarentee of.

(While Gw fucked up the end time badly, Malekith having been the rightful phoenix king at the time actually could make sense if done differently - he was going to be burnt to ash and then revived from the ash, to purify him of the corruption of the Iron Circlet.)

So yeah, the war of vengence isn't quite as set in stone as it may seem, at first. Because rhe ripples are making ripples at this point. We can't stop the slann from pulling a stupid, or the rise of the skaven. But the war of venegence has many movig parts that led to it, and we just need to jam a stick in any of the spokes.
 
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SaltyWaffles said:
We should be doing everything we possibly can to avert that war, because it will make a bigger difference than just about anything else we do. And if we can hold dwarf-elf relations in the positive until the human tribes migrate into the Reik Basin and Kislev, then we have the chance to forge a very powerful alliance indeed.
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With no War of the Beard the Reik basin will still be occupied by the elves who lived there before the War and the dwarven surface settlements that were destroyed in the Time of Woe. As the place will have owners, they're unlikely to want Stone and Bronze Age nomadic hunter gatherers and pastoralists moving through their fields.

The history of human migrations will also probably be completely different. Many of the tribes that became Sigmar's confederation originally lived east of the World's Edge Mountains. They apparently moved west because Slann induced climate change caused migrations of steel wielding greenskins from their homelands in the east of the Darklands.

Now, it was escaping greenskins slaves that taught their free brethren to work metal, which gave them an insurmountable advantage over the human tribes. Those slaves were taught by their chaos dwarf masters. Now, the greenskins may be able to teach themselves metal working at some point, but it's liable to be a lot slower and harder than being inadvertently uplifted, even if they can.

This means that even if the greenskins do migrate, the humans whose lands they move into are likely to be able to do a better job of twisting, meaning that even if they lose it will take longer and they may well have different cultures by that point.

Another very relevant consideration is that the dwarves have remained in contact with their northern and particularly eastern kin. That means that it's very possible that rather than sustained warfare being the result of greenskins tribes migrating west, it could occur much earlier as a result of waves of dwarven colonists pushing east. If an elven alliance still happens, entire swarms of butterflies could result, as the full might of two empires could bare down on the greenskin homelands in the Dark Lands and do such tremendous damage to them that the situation is completely different by the time the Slann's little oops, and the greenskins are in a much weaker position and actually lose to the humans.

Lots of things could change, we have thousands of years...
 
Byzantine said:
So yeah, the war of vengence isn't quite as set in stone as it may seem, at first. Because rhe ripples are making ripples at this point. We can't stop the slann from pulling a stupid, or the rise of the skaven. But the war of venegence has many movig parts that led to it, and we just need to jam a stick in any of the spokes.
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We can't stop the Slann from pulling a stupid but there are things we can do to mitigate the damage. I think Valaya actually gave us the path to one of the key components: the rune of repair. Obviously it needs to repair more than superficial damage, but that's just a bit of time and elbow grease. The other thing is a rune (or rune pair) that keeps the damage from exceeding what the rune of repair can fix. And then you stick this combo on every load bearing wall and support you can.
 
FunkyEntropy said:
We can't stop the Slann from pulling a stupid but there are things we can do to mitigate the damage. I think Valaya actually gave us the path to one of the key components: the rune of repair. Obviously it needs to repair more than superficial damage, but that's just a bit of time and elbow grease. The other thing is a rune (or rune pair) that keeps the damage from exceeding what the rune of repair can fix. And then you stick this combo on every load bearing wall and support you can.
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Didn't the slann basically move a continental plate? I think that's a little beyond what even a Master Rune of Repair could accomplish. If we're going to mitigate it it'll have to be through ensuring the Karaz Ankor can recover.
 
Sir_Travelsalot said:
It was my understanding that the Fimir were on the planet before the Old Ones showed up. The thing is, all signs point to them living in the regions around Marienburg and on the isle of Albion. Which are both quite far away from any dwarf Holds, much less the Holds of the Norse Dwarfs.
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Iirc the fimir was one of the Chaos worshipping races that got shit stomped by the Lizardmen when the Old Ones came to this world.
 
Byzantine said:
First woukd be stopping Malekith from ever going to the north and finding the literally cursed iron circlet. Second would be someone that can recognise it as a dark artifact seeing malekith with it before he leaves. Third would be finding out about the elven civil war. Fourth would be managing to actually capture the perpetrators of the attacks and figuring out their corruption. Fifth would be just plain preventing an ambassador from being sent.
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Not even going into the details, but honestly, none of these are what Snorri can intervene in, at least in a manner that doesn't break the fourth wall quite explicitly. Like the only point where Snorri could have had a chance to interfere is the identification, but there would have been no explicit presence of Chaos on it, or the Elves would also have positively detected it when he first stepped back on Ulthuan.

With no explicit evidence, he wouldn't just go up and ask to examine the circlet, If he met Malekith, would he?

I get he would be real old, and prolly really famous, but simultaneously, he would still ne a runelord and not the High King, or even in Karaz-a-Karak. And even of there was ameeting ot something about the messenger thing, you would remember, Dawi actually sent it to make peace, so it was a *sensible* decision from the perspective of that moment. So why would he oppose that?
 
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Deuterium Dawn said:
Didn't the slann basically move a continental plate? I think that's a little beyond what even a Master Rune of Repair could accomplish. If we're going to mitigate it it'll have to be through ensuring the Karaz Ankor can recover.
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I mean, yeah it's a pretty big hurdle. We need to figure out the runic equivalent of earthquake-proofing our shit so that even when everything gets damaged it doesn't slip past the limit of whatever the rune of repair v12.0 can fix, and that's going to take a lot of work. But I don't think anyone here would suggest that it wouldn't be worth it.
 
What were the extent of damages in the Earthquakes at the Beginning of the Time of Woes? Coz in the later parts, there aren't many descriptions of the Holds themselves being substantially damaged, just the Underway and it's defences which provided the access for the Thaggoraki and the Grobi.
 
OzymandiasAgain said:
Not even going into the details, but honestly, none of these are what Snorri can intervene in, at least in a manner that doesn't break the fourth wall quite explicitly. Like the only point where Snorri could have had a chance to interfere is the identification, but there would have been no explicit presence of Chaos on it, or the Elves would also have positively detected it when he first stepped back on Ulthuan.

With no explicit evidence, he wouldn't just go up and ask to examine the circlet, If he met Malekith, would he?

I get he would be real old, and prolly really famous, but simultaneously, he would still ne a runelord and not the High King, or even in Karaz-a-Karak. And even of there was ameeting ot something about the messenger thing, you would remember, Dawi actually sent it to make peace, so it was a *sensible* decision from the perspective of that moment. So why would he oppose that?
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What Snorri can change is whether there's any need for elven expeditionary armies to be operating in the far north in a few thousand years. If not, then Malekith won't be in position to find the Iron Circlet.

As a note, the Iron Circlet may well not be chaotic. It could just have unfortunate side effects when worn by people that aren't, for example, Slann. Or it could just have shown him visions of quite how dangerous Chaos was that made him really believe that Ulthuan couldn't afford the wrong leader, so any means he embraced to put the right one, I.e. him, on the throne were justified. Given our description of how True Dhar manipulation works, it could simply boost someone's willpower and determination, which isn't an unambiguous blessing if you're wrong about something...

OzymandiasAgain said:
What were the extent of damages in the Earthquakes at the Beginning of the Time of Woes? Coz in the later parts, there aren't many descriptions of the Holds themselves being substantially damaged, just the Underway and it's defences which provided the access for the Thaggoraki and the Grobi.
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Major climate change induced by vulcanism that destroyed the dwarves (and everyone else's) crops and caused their farm animals to sicken and die, resulting in large scale migration all over the place.
 
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