On Thread Etiquette:
I'm not going to weigh in on the logic of either side's arguments, but I will ask that everyone read over what they write and really consider if the words they used are polite and won't be inflammatory intentionally or not. You cant account for people's tolerances perfectly but at least try to say your piece without saying things that can be easily construed as overly dismissive of the other side of the argument, thank you.
Pfft, beardling, just write a script that links to the tabs of all the relevant segments of the quest, which you keep up at all times, and refreshes them every 20 minutes!
While we're at it, what sort of Runes would we put on the pickaxe that the Cult of Grungni wants? Would they be weapon runes?
Like, MGrungni, Brotherhood, and luck? It is definitely a long ways off before we even chose whether to do it, but I'm not really sure what we would do with it anyways.
Rilskrundak - Ore Hewer - MSmiting, Cleaving(Or Striking also considering Stone/Iron) Fortune Sadly we don't have Fortune so either Striking for "let the pick find the weak faults in the rock" or stone/iron for the relationship with Cleaving and Smiting "Let this pick strike hard enough to cleave the hardest rock"
Mining is both something that you do in mountains and the most dwarfy activity however since Snorri isn't a smith I like this less.
Since we have unlocked the Fate research since then that would be my preference for the third Rune. As it probably links to the Rune of Eternity somehow.
Ah, sorry, just deleted that post due to wanting to re-elaborate on it.
We don't have Weapon!Mgrungni; only the regular Grungni.
Personally, I'd think something like Grungni (because it's for His Cult), Stone (due to its connection to Dawi and what the Cult of Grungni does), and a third Rune that's morale based, such as Stoicism or Determination, or a more mundane, combat-ish one like Cleaving (which IIRC was first placed on pickaxes).
aye, its kind of...well...lets just say the modifiers got through the roof, the QM was experimenting with a new system and he found he didn't like it, so retcon tzeentch was fucking the time-loop that warhammer fantasy is in so that our vampire-dragon-god actually existed! (Well...not died so many fucking diffrent deaths or been made into irrelevancy by the narration). By sheer virtue of omakes we managed to get ausuryan to suceed his roll to get the rest of the elven pantheon (not the dark elves one) out of their funks and getting shit into gear cause they now have a chance to survive the end-times.
not to mention theres going to be a 5th chaos god...and the four are busying REALLY trying to kill each other.
Oh yeah, and we got a khornate chaos-tide incomming soon enough.
otherwise, were doing just fucking fine...especially after the war with old bretonnia...that was a fucking trip.
As for news?
(We have 7 fucking badass knights in our service, 6 of them are equivelent of chaos champions/lords...the last is our version of the fucking everchosen! Nat 100's are fucking scary in recruitment.)
so yeah, right now were just in the middle of getting bretonnia to NOT be a laughing stock of the old world, and were suceedingly marvellously...so far at least. Also we might end up hitting late industrial-era to WW1 tech levels along with Magi-tech...
and finally...we have every fucking dragon in malleus besides chaos dragons and warp-fire dragon (MAYBE...i got...plans...for that one, as well as the QM themselves) and Black Dragons (for now...).
Also as a final note: Aleksander Von Carstien/Dracul is a god of Knowledge...which helps explains how were bullshit.
It's a bit of a shame we're making a talisman that will become a heirloom for the Kings of Kraka Drak that will basically permanently fill that slot and lock us out from them having an item that makes them better at being a King, rather than being a champion.
Alas, it's an opportunity lost to explore non combat runes in greater depth.
It's a bit of a shame we're making a talisman that will become a heirloom for the Kings of Kraka Drak that will basically permanently fill that slot and lock us out from them having an item that makes them better at being a King, rather than being a champion.
Alas, it's an opportunity lost to explore non combat runes in greater depth.
It's not like they walk around in full war regalia at all times. If we make a crown with MKingship on it they can wear that out of battle and switch to the other items when they need to get personally stuck in.
It's not like they walk around in full war regalia at all times. If we make a crown with MKingship on it they can wear that out of battle and switch to the other items when they need to get personally stuck in.
It's not like they walk around in full war regalia at all times. If we make a crown with MKingship on it they can wear that out of battle and switch to the other items when they need to get personally stuck in.
I suspect that they may actually. I don't think that having a large array of different items and picking the most appropriate one for the circumstances is in character for dwarves. If Snorri the Gift Giver, Runelord of Kraka Drakk, makes you a talisman, then it may be seen as pretty ungrateful to come back and ask him to make you another one later and not be satisfied with what you have.
It's a bit of a shame we're making a talisman that will become a heirloom for the Kings of Kraka Drak that will basically permanently fill that slot and lock us out from them having an item that makes them better at being a King, rather than being a champion.
Alas, it's an opportunity lost to explore non combat runes in greater depth.
Presumably, they can change gears.
If we made a crown, it probably wouldn't be the kind you'd wear as part a helmet (horned helms seem to be in vogue).
Otrek doesnt go around wearing a flaming mantle, carrying Trollslayer and wearing adamant plate.
E:we're making a belt... Doesn't really stop them from wearing a rune crown
Presumably, they can change gears.
If we made a crown, it probably wouldn't be the kind you'd wear as part a helmet (horned helms seem to be in vogue).
Otrek doesnt go around wearing a flaming mantle, carrying Trollslayer and wearing adamant plate.
We've just sent a strong message that they shouldn't change gears, that what we, Living Ancestor of Krakka Drakk, think being a king is about is about being better at going out* and killing things. Actions speak a lot louder than words, and we've made it very clear with what we've actually done what we think. And if it doesn't line up with what we said in a one on one conversation with one person, then I think it's clear which one will have the dominant impression.
* The Master Rune of Wandering may not be a conceptual thing, but the interpretation of giving a prince something called that does have symbolic value. It's not a message about staying at home and making sure your kingdom prospers, it's about going out and hitting things really hard.
We've just sent a strong message that they shouldn't change gears, that what we, Living Ancestor of Krakka Drakk, think being a king is about is about being better at going out and killing things. Actions speak a lot louder than words, and we've made it very clear with what we've actually done what we think. And if it doesn't line up with what we said in a one on one conversation with one person, then it's clear which one will have the dominant impression.
Or they'll accept that there are multiple facets to being a king. Plus you're acting like we can't just make something of our volition, all we have to do if we want to give them a leadership talisman is make it and give it to them.
Or they'll accept that there are multiple facets to being a king. Plus you're acting like we can't just make something of our volition, all we have to do if we want to give them a leadership talisman is make it and give it to them.
Productivity like No Other: Every 2 request actions add 1 free action's worth of progress. If 3 request actions, instead add 2 free actions.
That appears to suggest we need to be asked to make something by someone else to get the benefit of our trait, we can't just create it out of nowhere. That probably makes it much less likely we'll every choose to come up with something of our own volition.
There are multiple facets to being a King. We have only ever made items that recognise there being one facet. That rather suggests that we think that facet is the predominant one.
We've just sent a strong message that they shouldn't change gears, that what we, Living Ancestor of Krakka Drakk, think being a king is about is about being better at going out* and killing things.
I think you are putting words inside king whatsisname's mouth. The request didn't mention the meaning of kingship lessons.
They asked for something and left it to our discretion what it would be.
We are making a piece of wargear.
Wearing it outside the theater of war is like going to your grandma's wearing tactical gear.
The same goes for a crown. It's ceremonial
I think you are putting words inside king whatsisname's mouth. The request didn't mention the meaning of kingship lessons.
They asked for something and left it to our discretion what it would be.
We are making a piece of wargear.
Wearing it outside the theater of war is like going to your grandma's wearing tactical gear.
The same goes for a crown. It's ceremonial
He didn't ask us to make a piece of wargear. He asked us to make a wedding gift that could be part of the royal panoply of Krakka Drakk. THe fact that you interpret that to mean wargear only is part of the problem.
And of course he didn't refer to any kingly lessons. He wouldn't know that Gimli asked us about this. We had an opportunity to reinforce the message we gave then. Instead we chose to undermine it.
That appears to suggest we need to be asked to make something by someone else to get the benefit of our trait, we can't just create it out of nowhere. That probably makes it much less likely we'll every choose to come up with something of our own volition.
Productivity like No Other: Every 2 request actions add 1 free action's worth of progress. If 3 request actions, instead add 2 free actions.
That appears to suggest we need to be asked to make something by someone else to get the benefit of our trait, we can't just create it out of nowhere. That probably makes it much less likely we'll every choose to come up with something of our own volition.
There are multiple facets to being a King. We have only ever made items that recognise there being one facet. That rather suggests that we think that facet is the predominant one.
Request actions are just what Soulcake calls production actions, just looking at turn 35 the admant smelter; matrons banner and all the gronti actions are listed as requests despite no one requesting them.
The reason we've only made items that recognise one facet of being a king is because that one facet is the thing that runes are really good at. If you ask an electrician to work on your house you don't take away the message that plumbing is unimportant to them and only electrics matter. You are looking at this with too much of an ooc perspective, knowing that the rune of kingship will one day exist. The characters in the story don't know that so they aren't going to assume that Snorri deliberately didn't make it.
He didn't ask us to make a piece of wargear. He asked us to make a wedding gift that could be part of the royal panoply of Krakka Drakk. THe fact that you interpret that to mean wargear only is part of the problem.
And of course he didn't refer to any kingly lessons. He wouldn't know that Gimli asked us about this. We had an opportunity to reinforce the message we gave then. Instead we chose to undermine it.
I interpret it as wargear because the runes on it are war runes.
Its purpose is to make the wearer better at fighting, therefore i expect it to be used like wargear, not just an accessory (even though it can be one).
Also, i think the one talisman limit is something mechanical to prevent powergaming, rather than any hard limit.
Iirc Snorri wore multiple talismans of fire protection while making adamant the first few times.
Hello, I've recently joined the quest - and now I've been re-reading it. I have few questions - mostly clarification. And apologies it was explained before.
So first question - Blizzardwing description of Runelords, contrasted with Barak Azamar:
"Hmm, curious. The average Dwarf is like Granite. The winds touch them, but unlike other beings, they suffuse them slowly and with great difficulty. The Runesmiths...your kind are Quartz, metal, and stone in equal measure. It is-" here Blizzardwing looks up sharply with a squawk.
That made me curious - what would Blizzardwing see when Snorri is wearing Barak Azamar? Is this channeling of forces of natural world merely part of Barak Azamar being unique? Or is it something deeper?
Apologies for a bit of rambling below - but idea is compelling.
Dawi, people of stone, cannot wield winds of magic without surrendering their souls. It goes against their very nature. They are of Stone, born from the world, and of it. Contrasted to that, Winds originates from outside of the World. Winds are in their deeper essence unnatural and anathema to dwarfen nature.
But Snori was able to connect to and channel forces of the world. They did not corrupt, they did not damage. Living stone was what dwarves were form from, part of their nature. It was more return to what birthed dawi. And as we've seen in Dum debacle, Snorri wielded that power with natural ease. Each blow, each explosion of golden fire was carefull measured and controlled.
This made me think: it is possible for Dawi to become a 'mage' channeling the Earth rather than Winds and shaping it by will, skill and knowledge?
Connection is there - the stone Dawi were born from. Energy is there, at least with help of Runes. Will is there. In spades, really. So why would it not be possible?
That could be the point where Snorri really becomes regarded as Ancestor - if he was able to pull it off. Being ancestor means creating something outside of established structures of Dwarfen society. Something that forces the cultural change. Thugni did it with discovery of Runes, other had their own contributions, and that became pillars that supports Karaz Ankor. Snorri could do something simillar (though obviously lesser in scope) with dawi able to channel Earth forces. Again, assuming it is possible.
Those 'mages', Stone Channellers, would not necessarily need to be runesmiths. What that would need is talisman with 'Earth' rune to create connection. Then, their will to connect to Earth, training and knowledge to use Deep Magic in correct way.
Would that be feasible with enough research? To delve deeper into Deep Magic and create rune that allows this connection? It is about only realistic way I can see for Snorri to make contribution that would fall outside of his remit as runelord.
Second, just something I though I would share: this is the picture that I think about when I read about Valayans:
Not a glory. Not fame. A struggle to ease suffering and help wherever needed. (It's details that makes it so for me. The reasurring hand on shoulder of crippled dwarf. Solemn grief of a priest. And expression of tired saddness on face of healer.)
Third - the 'The Valiant Ancestor Golem' idea, does it have Theme described? I have (I think) a good idea what that theme may be and how could it work. It is open to the discussion / suggestions?
Fourth, just let me say that I love this quest. As much as a story as a quest. It's I think, first time I've read about dwarven society with their culture described in a way that is understandable, not overdone and feeling realistic.
So... no you see the Winds are a metaphor because of a common visualisation of how currents of magic flow.
You don't literally get magic by controlling the mundane wind in this setting.
So asking if a dwarf could become a mage by channelling the 'Earth' is kinda a stupid question because perhaps we can define Earth as whatever the dwarves could shape to make magic happen, making it correct by definition... However said Earth probably doesn't exist? The Deep Earth and Geomancy of the Slann seems to be a large scale ritual casting of more typical (High) wind magics.
Third - the 'The Valiant Ancestor Golem' idea, does it have Theme described? I have (I think) a good idea what that theme may be and how could it work. It is open to the discussion / suggestions?
Many proposals have been thrown around. Feel free to add more ideas to the pot.
Though do note that details regarding it's size ("normal" gronti or Bloodthrister size) or make (from mostly pure gromril with adamant highlights, to mostly adamant with pure gromril highlights). So if size and make is important to your idea, then state it immediately and hopefully we do not fall to circular aguments on them again.
Bah
