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Paths of Civilization

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BungieONI said:
*leaps at the chance*

Hurray!

Social tech sounds interesting. What do you think of the Bath House we may come up with? AN said it will actually cost (and thus refund Mysticism), because of our shamans patrolling it. What do you think the benefits will be?

Steel we can get to in a second.
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Good decrease in diease and sickness spread, more stress on water supply and maybe water treatment. But the grey and black water can be used to water the city gardens, if we can get real plumbing.

More involvement for our priests and shamans to mingle with regular folks will be very good.
 
BungieONI said:
*leaps at the chance*

Hurray!

Social tech sounds interesting. What do you think of the Bath House we may come up with? AN said it will actually cost (and thus refund Mysticism), because of our shamans patrolling it. What do you think the benefits will be?

Steel we can get to in a second.
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A bath house would probably act as a way to acclimate foreigners to our culture, since it would be a place for groups of people to meet up and relax at.
It would also encourage sanitation more so than our society already does, what with people getting cleaned on a semi consistent basis.

I imagine that big enough bath houses will also encourage True City formation in a similar way that aqueducts do, and will probably require aqueducts to be built in most locations.

Not sure if it would be a regular action or an extended project though.
 
I probably won't vote to declare war against the Highlans Kingdom if we do invite them to the games, unless AN confirms that there are negligible negative consequences for doing so.

That aside I'm defininetly looking forward to our new policy.
 
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keenscythe said:
Can never spare the King's action or setting the province to trade, unfortunately.
Building the Northern Trade post should help somewhat. I would also like to build one near the Eastern Sea Peoples if we could spare the slot there as we don't know much about them.
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That much is true, perhaps we will get a turn of trade policy sometime. :V Don't bet on it however, we are on a mega project spree and maybe a war spree.

I'm supportive of northern trade post if we can get another mercenary company.
 
BungieONI said:
Probably the best way to start is trade policy. Get us interacting with other people through regular trade, like @VoidZero said.
That would set it on a background simmer.

Directed king missions would push it more for us to develop the idea of sticking a semi permanent mission places.
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Also trading posts. Who knows what civs are up in poland, etc. for us to talk to?
 
ctulhuslp said:
Current voters would have never chosen actions which had resulted in Circle. I mean, it was action with no mechanical benefits other than being generous, who of current people in thread would've voted for it?

Current Ymaryn are literally not the same People who had chosen to help others at any cost, and that's that.
I could probably write negaverse omake with the current voters deciding what to do in that update, but it would be too salty.
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Excuse me? I not only voted to get that value, I have been the single most vocal champion of "always more refugees" in the entire bloody thread!
 
To put this in a slightly calmer way @DocMatoi , most of the thread believes the Highland Kingdom has blown all their chances to be peaceful neighbors, and want to neutralize their warmaking ability(which in context for this era, means vassalising/conquering them). this means most of us want to exclude the HK from the games as to avoid awkward implications of warring on them after they attend. As for inviting the Thunder Horse, I can't speak for the others but my vote includes them because they're a headache logistically to attack(remember their core territories are a lot further away, despite knocking over the Thunder Speakers), and trying to conduct a two front war is always a bad idea. Since the HK is the easier target, I'm pretty sure the TH get another chance for now.

Also, most of us don't buy the games as a way to peacefully annex them/convince them we're not a threat, due to the geopolitical situation the HK are in. Remember they are essentially stuck having to expand through us at this point, which means they HAVE to eventually take another swing at us eventually if they don't want to simply be marginalized into irrelevance by us eventually.
 
NewAgeOfPower said:
We're not attacking them for 'Imperialistic land grabs'; further territorial expansion is of dubious profitability due to Administrative strain.

We're not attacking them because they looked at us funny.

We're destroying them because they pushed us to the edge of utter disaster not once, but twice, in addition to stealing the Secret of Iron. I was willing to forgive them once, but it's a clear pattern. Unlike with the Nomads, we can permanently end this threat. It is a net positive for our civilization to make temporary sacrifices for future benefits.

Highlander Kingdom Delenda Est.
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The last time we set out to destroy anyone, it twisted our society irrevocably. I do not want that to happen again.
EDIT: Also, ironic accidental racism. 'Hurrdurr lowlander warlike lowlander scum Ymaryn superior'.
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re: the lowlanders, its history and word of AN: What did all the peaceful lowlanders do? They came to us! Because of the Land Of Opportunity trait-line! They decided "no i do not want to go to war today" and headed for our hills!
ctulhuslp said:
I mean...people who vote for going full war studiously ignore that CA had given us options to devour their villages peacefully before and nobody fucking voted for it. And Games are CA-linked. And we get a CA upgrade.
And we got Hat-lands through CA annexation spiral.
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Something to note: inviting everyone will likely synergize with the CA upgrade, making it even better (possibly)
 
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Wiadi said:
Considering the benefits that value has brought in the long run, I think the point was to give an example to the more...results-driven...modern thread of why seemingly "inefficient" options could be worth taking.
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It's called 'local optimization' - valuing immediate results over more global picture.
Globally, not attacking and instead peacefully assimilating would give us more internal stability because there is less anger and stife going around; plus traditions of peace and not giving a precedent of violence for achieving power being acceptable.
Locally, conquest will result in shorter border and HK losing ability to cut off not!Anatolia from us.

Different priorities.
 
DocMatoi said:
With the thread now open, I'm just gonna make a small effortpost and pray that @Academia Nut hasn't already locked the vote. AN, please, if you were going to lock the vote, give me some time. I want people to think on this.
We NEED to invite the Highlanders, guys. The spirit of the games is one that CANNOT be ignored. in Ancient Greece, the right to attend the Olympics was considered sacred - to make combat on somebody going to the olympics was sacrilege.
This in the state of near constant war that the greek citystates lived in. The Greeks were able to compete with their neighbors, and still see them as human instead of a faceless implacable enemy.
We NEED the chance for our people to remember that all our neighbors are human, though they may be our enemies. To exclude them would be against both the very nature of games as tools to bring people together, and against the ways of the Ymaryn.
Please. Help prevent future racism and othering today. Vote to invite the Highlanders. we just need a few votes to safeguard the sanctity of the Games' spirit.
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Ahh, it'll be fine; as long as there isn't a nation that calls itself the Highland Kingdom after our war, every one of our neighbors will have been invited!
 
Man people keep getting the thread locked for reasons.

BungieONI said:
*leaps at the chance*

Hurray!

Social tech sounds interesting. What do you think of the Bath House we may come up with? AN said it will actually cost (and thus refund Mysticism), because of our shamans patrolling it. What do you think the benefits will be?

Steel we can get to in a second.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Bath Houses might be cool. They also fit our city planning and how people should be clean. Do we get a bonus if we show AN a detailed plan on how to build one using in quest tech? There is an old quest I know that had something like that. I can easily go and get the plan.
 
WeaponX1023 said:
Man people keep getting the thread locked for reasons.


Bath Houses might be cool. They also fit our city planning and how people should be clean. Do we get a bonus if we show AN a detailed plan on how to build one using in quest tech? There is an old quest I know that had something like that. I can easily go and get the plan.
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This is good, AN likes information like this. No idea if we get bonus from it however.
 
ctulhuslp said:
-snip-
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Mechanically speaking, the costs of Peace and War are difficult to quantify. Obviously, we should set the value of the Survival of The People at infinity, and because we (the players) will get pretty pissed if the game ends prematurely, perhaps should set the value of the Civilization of The People's existence at infinity as well.
ctulhuslp said:
We are not purely good guys.
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No, but I'm fairly certain the Author outright stated we are the most morally superior civilization around.
 
SpeckofStardust said:
When did 'we' set out to destroy anyone, voting the nomad in was done to make out 'north' happy with us because the thread is not good at the whole thinking about narratively what will happen when we make a choice.
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pblur said:
The Xohyr? How has it warped our society?
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Fey Mood, and the militarization of our society that followed. AN has said if we want to demilitarize, we need to take peacey options. well heres a peacey option. Lets invite the highlanders and not destroy them.
 
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DocMatoi said:
Fuck that shit. Wars of aggression are stupid, especially with our turtle build. If it was actually "realpolitik" we would wait for them to attack us again so we can have both the moral high ground and a war advantage, thanks to defensive war.

What has become of the generous Ymaryn? Are we to become the lowlanders, destroying everyone we can who looks at us funny?
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Well the HK currently has a spy network within our kingdom which they used to create riots to distract from their kidnapping of one of our blacksmiths as our people killed each other in the streets and apparently they have been conducting even more operations that we don't know about, they've attacked us twice when our back was turned and we only defeated them via luck, and the HK kingdom has no choice but to attack us in order to grow.

For the HK making peace with us means the slow eventually strangulation of their civilization as they are boxed in on all sides. Any treaties between us would be at best temporary fictions because the HK would conintue to operate its spy network until the moment they hear about us being at war with someone else.

So no the Ymaryn haven't become some violent civilization that attacks everyone, that's silly. We're attacking the civilization that will always attack us as soon as they learn our forces are concentrated on some other task, that causes chaos and destruction via secret acts in our border, and whose only hope of surviving into the future is to take our land.

You can't trust someone when they have everything to gain from you death and everything to lose if you continue to live.
 
NewAgeOfPower said:
Mechanically speaking, the costs of Peace and War are difficult to quantify. Obviously, we should set the value of the Survival of The People at infinity, and because we (the players) will get pretty pissed if the game ends prematurely, perhaps should set the value of the Civilization of The People's existence at infinity as well.
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Actually, even if our civilization is destroyed, AN has said we just play a successor state, so that's a non-issue.
 
ctulhuslp said:
Wrong event. You are likely thinking of diplomarriage event, I am talking about refugee trigger during one of the comets.
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The only times we could have taken land from the Highlanders was
1. our whole 'our soldiers decided to take land be -stab is low
The land was not in the lowlands
2. Take settlements when the comet came was for land in the lowlands.
 
Come get your campaign hats!

(J) I support destroying the civilization of HK

(J) I support conquering the mountain range between HK and Hatvalley

(J) I support conquering HK and turn them into Vassal

(J) I support no war

(J) VoidZero can't be trusted

(J) Thunder Horse first
 
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