Prologue
So I've recently started watching a Fate Stay Night playthrough after putting of the VN for a while, since I couldn't play the version my friend had on my Mac laptop. I got into fate by way of the UBW anime, then watched F/Zero, then Apocrypha, and then proceeded to read a lot of fanfics for the last few years.
I've also been lurking around the Beast's Lair message boards for a month or so now, and I'm reading the discussion messages for GB's works and the one for 'From Fake Dreams'. While I agree on all of the criticisms for GB's work, and some of those for ThirdFang, I still feel as if the community their and sometimes Fate fans in general hold canon in an exceedingly high regard. While I do not know ho often (if at all) Nasu contradicts himself or trolls the audience, I am choosing to believing this as rumour unless stated otherwise.
Still, I have noticed a lot of small problems with the series, which definitely undermine the whole elitist 'canon is king' thing a lot of Fate fans have going on. There are a lot of oversights and retcons in the story, and while treating its world-building with more importance than other fandoms is fine, the unnecessarily antagonistic stance of the fandom is something that rubs me the wrong way.
This is why while I might not call Nasu a troll, I still do not put more stock in his words than any other author. Nasu has stated that Archer is on the lower end of the power spectrum in the Nasuverse, and while that's true as a whole, people take that to mean Archer can mostly only play defensively and his versatility only halls against select opponents like Gilgamesh. With a bit of thought that's definitely not true, and part of that is listed below. (It's too complicated a topic to explore right now, so this while have to suffice)
Shirou says he can only beat Gilgamesh within his Reality Marble, which is absolute bullshit. If Gil can trump 99.9% of Servants without Ea, so can Shirou. His RM does what the Gate of Babylon does, only with a little less power but a higher firing range and unlimited ammunition. We also don't know how using or breaking Phantasms changes inside his Reality Marble, other than Tracing Excalibur Image outside of the Moon is a death sentence, so it's a reasonable belief that with a bit of planing, Archer can trump the other Servants. It's only NPs that specifically counter RMs or stuff like Counter Gaurdian Assassin EMIYA's Origin Bullets that he has to fear.
Anyways, the aim of this is to note my general thoughts on fate and see how well the VN holds up to the standards it's fans seem to use.
Prologue (playthrough parts 1-5)
Inconsistencies in F/SN
⁃ Archer kills Berserker 6 times despite not using UBW or NLBW. It's possible that he used caliburn, but I haven't reached that point to see if he had the magical energy required
⁃ Rin messes up the summoning very badly despite being a genius, she only does it one hour early, still messes up her summoning circle,and Archer's memory, and he appears in another room.
⁃ How the hell did he fix up her room so good? (Budget constraints)
⁃ Kirei to Rin. Rin's parents should have thought that the next grail war would be 60 years later, she would have comfortably been an adult by then, and Korea could likely have died. Even if Kirei is playing Rin for a fool, she should know this.
⁃ Also, why the hell did she not get Gil's catalyst? Even if she still would've summoned Archer (questionable since the ritual would/should have used the specified catalyst)
⁃ Magi can sense other magi. Rin says that 'he' (Shinji) is not a Master because of insufficient magical energy. This implies that Sakura has no magical energy at all, and Sakura was given to the Matous precisely so she could learn mage craft.
⁃ Another implication is that the Crest Worms are eating up all of her magical energy all the time, which is fatal (I think, it's not said in game yet, but I'm pretty sure I read it on Beast's Lair somewhere)
⁃ Since Shirou doesn't have any magical energy (inactive atrophied circuits) unless he cannibalises his nerves, that would either mean that Saber is receiving pitiful amounts of mana and has truly ridiculous Independent Action skill, unless Shirou is cannibalising his nerves constantly, and is doing so for more than one to make sure she survives after using mana to fight.
⁃ Kuzuki recalling papers because of a misspelling? Implausible but possible. Something that will certainly get him in trouble if he does it often. Even doing it once is bad. But the real kicker is that this mad lad cancelled a midterm exam because of MISPELLING. What the hell? That's the kind of shit that will get you fired quickly.
⁃ Someone on BL said that Archer's swords break with each thrust of Lnacer's spear, but what's actually happening is that the the swords fly from his grip. He 'looses' the swords but they don't break.
⁃ It's said that Archer looses a sword for each of Lancer's 100 thrusts, yet, he says he's only disarmed Archer 27 times.
⁃ How the hell do Rin and Archer not her the sounds of battle from within Shirou's house? Lancer ans Saber really go at it, and they should be able to hear it from the street, especially if Shirou can hear Lancer and Archer's battle from the Kyoudou club. Hell, Lancer even screams about his Gay Bulge.
⁃ Minor nitpick, but Rin says she's been storing up for the wind spell for seventeen years. This is most likely an exaggeration, so you can safely ignore this.
⁃ As someone pointed out in the comments, the hundred year time span for the last Heroic Spirit ascension doesn't really work, because we see an astronaut Servant by the name of Armstrong in the Moon Cell Wars and Last Encore.
General criticisms/thoughts
⁃ there's a lot of repetition in the Visual Novel, and I'm sure that's going to get annoying fast. It's obviously meant to make sure that beginners understand the basics of the system, but even judging it by that standard is annoying.
⁃ I'm not sure if it's a problem with the translation, but the writing can come of as stilted or awkward. Even when I was reading the SAO books a few years, the writing was weirding and archaic but it didn't come off as awkward. However, it could just be that I'm unused to the format.
⁃ The let's player says that the action scene is written very well for a VN, but I can't really comment on that since this is my first experience with the medium.
⁃ It still has the anime cliches that are prevalent in dome store anime today, something that wasn't as present in the UBW anime, which I very much appreciated. It's still the beginning of the story, though, and it's most likely toned down severely as we go along.
⁃ So, I read that Saber is referred to as a girl so many times because the romance was a major focus in this route, and to make the twist of her identity really hit home. Nasu was said to have been a little sexist, but it's something he's still working on. However, lines like 'Kuzuki should not have made a girl carry the a stack of papers' )paraphrasing here) really do not help his case.
P.S. I need help with making an account on BL. The registration page asks you for the site's name, and I've tried all the combination of Beast's Lair and the site's url that I know, and I keep saying it's the wrong answer. I can't even contact the modis because doing that also require that I answer the same security question! Halp.
I've also been lurking around the Beast's Lair message boards for a month or so now, and I'm reading the discussion messages for GB's works and the one for 'From Fake Dreams'. While I agree on all of the criticisms for GB's work, and some of those for ThirdFang, I still feel as if the community their and sometimes Fate fans in general hold canon in an exceedingly high regard. While I do not know ho often (if at all) Nasu contradicts himself or trolls the audience, I am choosing to believing this as rumour unless stated otherwise.
Still, I have noticed a lot of small problems with the series, which definitely undermine the whole elitist 'canon is king' thing a lot of Fate fans have going on. There are a lot of oversights and retcons in the story, and while treating its world-building with more importance than other fandoms is fine, the unnecessarily antagonistic stance of the fandom is something that rubs me the wrong way.
This is why while I might not call Nasu a troll, I still do not put more stock in his words than any other author. Nasu has stated that Archer is on the lower end of the power spectrum in the Nasuverse, and while that's true as a whole, people take that to mean Archer can mostly only play defensively and his versatility only halls against select opponents like Gilgamesh. With a bit of thought that's definitely not true, and part of that is listed below. (It's too complicated a topic to explore right now, so this while have to suffice)
Shirou says he can only beat Gilgamesh within his Reality Marble, which is absolute bullshit. If Gil can trump 99.9% of Servants without Ea, so can Shirou. His RM does what the Gate of Babylon does, only with a little less power but a higher firing range and unlimited ammunition. We also don't know how using or breaking Phantasms changes inside his Reality Marble, other than Tracing Excalibur Image outside of the Moon is a death sentence, so it's a reasonable belief that with a bit of planing, Archer can trump the other Servants. It's only NPs that specifically counter RMs or stuff like Counter Gaurdian Assassin EMIYA's Origin Bullets that he has to fear.
Anyways, the aim of this is to note my general thoughts on fate and see how well the VN holds up to the standards it's fans seem to use.
Prologue (playthrough parts 1-5)
Inconsistencies in F/SN
⁃ Archer kills Berserker 6 times despite not using UBW or NLBW. It's possible that he used caliburn, but I haven't reached that point to see if he had the magical energy required
⁃ Rin messes up the summoning very badly despite being a genius, she only does it one hour early, still messes up her summoning circle,and Archer's memory, and he appears in another room.
⁃ How the hell did he fix up her room so good? (Budget constraints)
⁃ Kirei to Rin. Rin's parents should have thought that the next grail war would be 60 years later, she would have comfortably been an adult by then, and Korea could likely have died. Even if Kirei is playing Rin for a fool, she should know this.

⁃ Also, why the hell did she not get Gil's catalyst? Even if she still would've summoned Archer (questionable since the ritual would/should have used the specified catalyst)
⁃ Magi can sense other magi. Rin says that 'he' (Shinji) is not a Master because of insufficient magical energy. This implies that Sakura has no magical energy at all, and Sakura was given to the Matous precisely so she could learn mage craft.
⁃ Another implication is that the Crest Worms are eating up all of her magical energy all the time, which is fatal (I think, it's not said in game yet, but I'm pretty sure I read it on Beast's Lair somewhere)
⁃ Since Shirou doesn't have any magical energy (inactive atrophied circuits) unless he cannibalises his nerves, that would either mean that Saber is receiving pitiful amounts of mana and has truly ridiculous Independent Action skill, unless Shirou is cannibalising his nerves constantly, and is doing so for more than one to make sure she survives after using mana to fight.
⁃ Kuzuki recalling papers because of a misspelling? Implausible but possible. Something that will certainly get him in trouble if he does it often. Even doing it once is bad. But the real kicker is that this mad lad cancelled a midterm exam because of MISPELLING. What the hell? That's the kind of shit that will get you fired quickly.
⁃ Someone on BL said that Archer's swords break with each thrust of Lnacer's spear, but what's actually happening is that the the swords fly from his grip. He 'looses' the swords but they don't break.
⁃ It's said that Archer looses a sword for each of Lancer's 100 thrusts, yet, he says he's only disarmed Archer 27 times.
⁃ How the hell do Rin and Archer not her the sounds of battle from within Shirou's house? Lancer ans Saber really go at it, and they should be able to hear it from the street, especially if Shirou can hear Lancer and Archer's battle from the Kyoudou club. Hell, Lancer even screams about his Gay Bulge.
⁃ Minor nitpick, but Rin says she's been storing up for the wind spell for seventeen years. This is most likely an exaggeration, so you can safely ignore this.
⁃ As someone pointed out in the comments, the hundred year time span for the last Heroic Spirit ascension doesn't really work, because we see an astronaut Servant by the name of Armstrong in the Moon Cell Wars and Last Encore.
General criticisms/thoughts
⁃ there's a lot of repetition in the Visual Novel, and I'm sure that's going to get annoying fast. It's obviously meant to make sure that beginners understand the basics of the system, but even judging it by that standard is annoying.
⁃ I'm not sure if it's a problem with the translation, but the writing can come of as stilted or awkward. Even when I was reading the SAO books a few years, the writing was weirding and archaic but it didn't come off as awkward. However, it could just be that I'm unused to the format.
⁃ The let's player says that the action scene is written very well for a VN, but I can't really comment on that since this is my first experience with the medium.
⁃ It still has the anime cliches that are prevalent in dome store anime today, something that wasn't as present in the UBW anime, which I very much appreciated. It's still the beginning of the story, though, and it's most likely toned down severely as we go along.
⁃ So, I read that Saber is referred to as a girl so many times because the romance was a major focus in this route, and to make the twist of her identity really hit home. Nasu was said to have been a little sexist, but it's something he's still working on. However, lines like 'Kuzuki should not have made a girl carry the a stack of papers' )paraphrasing here) really do not help his case.
P.S. I need help with making an account on BL. The registration page asks you for the site's name, and I've tried all the combination of Beast's Lair and the site's url that I know, and I keep saying it's the wrong answer. I can't even contact the modis because doing that also require that I answer the same security question! Halp.
Last edited:
