Noumero
Omit Needless Words
Yep, make them angry. Would motivate them to attack us, maybe impair their ability to make good strategic decisions.
Yes, it offers no tactical advantages and we're still going to lose, but at least it will be hilarious.
Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest
- Thread starter eaglejarl
- Start date
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- Tags
- naruto rationalist romance armageddon is looking better and better damn you kishimoto explosions everywhere explosives solve everyone if in doubt surrender to the mercy of zabuza it seemed like a good idea at the time looks like a really bad case of being a jōnin my god. where does the lore end? precommitting is the winning plan screaming in kagome screw the rules i have explosives something bad might still happen sometimes you gotta sociopath stabby zabby subsection c of paragraph 9 should include we can weaponize this so hard open voting
Yes, it offers no tactical advantages and we're still going to lose, but at least it will be hilarious.
- Location
- Under a Rock
Nope. Thirty years ago would have been great, but today there are landmines scattered about the planting area. They will be gone in two days. How badly do you want that tree?
Yes, the landmines are only there because we didn't plant the tree (I'm losing control of this metaphor), but they are still there, and they will go away if we wait two days.
Tua
鸡肉面条汤
- Location
- شوربة الدجاج المعكرونة
It's just for the trolling factor, I imagine. Taunt them some more into attacking us.
Being fabulous is just a nice bonus.
Emstar
The Shining One
- Location
- Trapped in an extradimensional rift.
- Pronouns
- She/They
I actually highly doubt this. This won't be as quick/clean as earlier, but I think we have sufficient firepower to win given:
1) Aspect Maluses on their side
2) Aspect Bonuses on our side (the usual +tags from defenses)
3) Strategy we implement
Pretty much the only people I see as super duper threatening in this one, are all cloud ninja. If we implement the Pre-Commit strategy in the plan, we have ~half of their forces coming in an underground tunnel where we will have Panashe , one or two mooks loaded up with our seals, and maybe Pankurashun ready to smash their faces in, with some help from Paneru's defenses.
The underground tunneler squad and accompanying ninja are pretty fucked IMO.
The land assault has to deal with Pandamonium throwing seal-laden logs at them as well as Keiko's ranged weapons (and possibly Hazou's melee in short and targeted bursts.)
If they manage to make it through our ~2 layers of outside defenses and get to the facility itself then it devolves into a brawl that is likely in our favor numbers wise (I can't imagine they won't suffer decent casualties up until this point.)
I'm cool with doing this to their Kunai. Bright pink kunai should still be pretty visible even at night.
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Tua
鸡肉面条汤
- Location
- شوربة الدجاج المعكرونة
@faflec: To be sure, drop a line that we deposit all word halves in the summoning realm so we don't lose them should we get knocked out.
And to preempt the obvious: no, I do not expect proctors to demand to see our word halves during the event (and even if they try, Keiko can intimidate and Hazo can play the Kage card again).
Basically even if we lose round 2, the word halves alone might be able to push us back into the running so we cannot afford to lose them at any cost.
The worst possible outcome (short of death/injury anyway) is losing R2 *and* losing all our word halves.
And to preempt the obvious: no, I do not expect proctors to demand to see our word halves during the event (and even if they try, Keiko can intimidate and Hazo can play the Kage card again).
Basically even if we lose round 2, the word halves alone might be able to push us back into the running so we cannot afford to lose them at any cost.
The worst possible outcome (short of death/injury anyway) is losing R2 *and* losing all our word halves.
Emstar
The Shining One
- Location
- Trapped in an extradimensional rift.
- Pronouns
- She/They
Why not just throw in all the ones except for our own?
This precludes any proctor shenanigans entirely but gives us our advantage on the word halves.
Tua
鸡肉面条汤
- Location
- شوربة الدجاج المعكرونة
Because losing your own halves is likely worse than losing those of other contestants so there is probably some conversion ratio where your own half is worth X of others.
Either way, do you honestly expect that proctors will a) be around close enough to ask us during battle, b) actually decide asking for them is a good idea and c) that Hazo/Keiko can't outsocial them when they have done so every single time before?
- Location
- NY
Can we do both of these? The equipment is still good, but it's blindingly obvious that we had the opportunity to tamper with it and chose only to troll them...or so it appears.
That's a great long-term concern, but long term can wait for the next two days for there to be a long term in which this specific character flaw is a releant problem.
Emstar
The Shining One
- Location
- Trapped in an extradimensional rift.
- Pronouns
- She/They
Yeah so if we have everyone else's we still win out here.
I expect that the proctors will try to fuck us over at any turn. This is not a Diabolus ex Machina or something, they consistently have tried to do us dirty this way.
As such, I want to prioritize defending against proctor bullshit in this regard, since I see losing the Round 2 fight first of all as unlikely (conditioning on our massive amount of strategizing and the pile of relative aspect bonuses we should be getting on our rolls) and second of all if we lose Round 2 we are likely fucked anyway, but winning Round 2 and using the word halves may catapult us to be just beneath ISC in the rankings (or it may boot Team Kurenai out of the running).
tl;dr If we lose Round 2 in any way, I think we're fucked anyway. If we win, then the word halves thing is in our favor regardless.
Now:Putting them in the 7th path over the rest day just reduces everyones ability to steal 'em back and gives them more incentive to come to the party in Round 2 IMO. So this is still good to do.
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Jello_Raptor
(Confirmed Jelly)
- Location
- Left of Center
Partly that, and they'll have to spend the rest day scraping the paint off and sharpening their tools.
It keeps them tired and grouchy at little cost to ourselves while making super team red more likely to form.
Also bright colors will be easier to see at night, pink is both bright and relatively rare in our environment. If pangolin have glow in the dark paint, then we should use that.
Also embarrassment and anger hurts group cohesion and makes it more likely that they act impulsively.
Also, we should see if we can mix a bunch of pangolin pepper powder into the paint, so that the very process of scraping it off and sharpening is annoying. (It would release mild pepper irritants into the air.)
Basically I want to keep stacking annoyances till our enemies are too grouchy to think properly.
Full modified plan component:
- Get bright or glow-in-the-dark paint from pangolin, mix in ground pangolin pepper dust.
- Take common/unadorned weapons from enemies, blunt them a bit (hit them with a rock or something), then dip them in pepper paint.
- Return all modified weapons to original owners.
- Add the occasional extra weapon (also sabotaged similarly) and random babby seal(s?) into their loadouts.
Hazou can offer to (for free) pick the extra seals out of any sets that people bring us. He will just identify the seals that were added, as well as their function, before returning all the seals, including those that we added to their stock. Hazou will also get a chance to see all the seals during both the addition process and the return process.
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Emstar
The Shining One
- Location
- Trapped in an extradimensional rift.
- Pronouns
- She/They
@faflec I am in support of the above conditional on this can be worded to reflect the intent given above.
The problem is we can use word halves as leverage to:
1) Get people to show up to the Round 2 Showdown
2) Get our teammates in Round 2 to go along with our plans (we will return this if you dont backstab us for petty grievances from last Round, thank you kindly).
So I see burning all of them but ours and our allies as a net loss if we do this too soon.
This is not taking into account that possession of these could be worth positive points. In that case, burning these is strictly a problem.
There really is no difference between storing extra word halves in the 7th path and burning them either way: They are rendered 100% inaccessible by anyone not Keiko (of course other summoners could assault the Pangolins and take them... but lets be reasonable here.
)
Tua
鸡肉面条汤
- Location
- شوربة الدجاج المعكرونة
I realize that but the probability of them actually doing so mid-combat are pretty slim even if we adjust for them being biased against us. There is also the fact that we caught the eye of the Kages with how we ended round 1 and Jiraiya's bet will likely ensure they will be watching us.
That said, how about this: We store everyone's world halves besides ours in the 7th Path. Then we ask Jiraiya during the party if we should do this with ours and follow his advice. Chances are he will say something along the lines of "They can't risk being that obviously biased without me being able to overturn their decision to penalize you." etc but that should satisfy both sides of the argument?
Also, I don't think losing R2 means we lose if we have all the word halves left. I mentioned it in a previous post, but Ren has a huge incentive to get us into the tournament so there is likely some wiggle room for her to increase/decrease the amount of points word halves are worth for us to make it in.
E: In an ideal world, we would know in advance how much the word halves are worth before we turn them in after the 5th event. That way we could redistribute them to knock out other teams or push allied teams up into the tournament slots.
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Emstar
The Shining One
- Location
- Trapped in an extradimensional rift.
- Pronouns
- She/They
I just don't think the relative safety is worth it IMO.
Ren can't play too hard for or against us. If the difference is small, then she can boost us up a bit. But if we lose round 2, the difference won't be small. See where I'm coming from?
Edit: But if you want to , go ahead with the Jiraiya thing. I don't really think its super beneficial but I won't stand in your way on this if you can convince everyone else (and faflec) that it is.
- Location
- Under a Rock
I was looking back and noticed something cool. Noburi got a 78 in the substitution spam combat. He only needed two tags. That implies that not only could he have taken out their whole team, but also their Jonin Sensei if they had been there. Probably not in one punch, but still. Maybe we should let him out to play more often.
Tua
鸡肉面条汤
- Location
- شوربة الدجاج المعكرونة
That wasn't the impression I got after reading @Adept_Woodwright's posts. But I am also not expecting us to lose completely, that is without taking some of them with us so their teams also take injury penalties and such. But eh, aside from making sure our word halves are safe and creating a good defensive plan, this isn't something we can influence further.
Jello_Raptor
(Confirmed Jelly)
- Location
- Left of Center
We can talk when the political future of the world isn't on the line.
@MMKII : I edited my plan to be a bit more evil. Please go take a look and see if you still approve.
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- Location
- NY
We have absolutely zero clue how much the word halves are worth, right? They could be worth jack-all, they could be worth 500 points per word half, or they could be worth something in between these extremes.
To my understanding, we have the vast majority of word halves that have not already been handed in due to the rampage, right? Because I don't think our placing in the First Event itself is important, as much as our margin of victory over the other top 16 contenders. In other words, if we're one of two teams neck and neck for last place in the top 16, and the other team bombed out of the First Event while we smashed it, that's a sufficient margin for Ren to tip the scales for us if she chooses. If the other team was, say, a respectable third place, and we don't have an overwhelming margin of victory with word halves...
Emstar
The Shining One
- Location
- Trapped in an extradimensional rift.
- Pronouns
- She/They
@Jello_Raptor Sure. This it?
I think the Pangolin Pepper addition to the paint is too much added complexity for too little gain.
We're already gonna perfume it. I dont see what the pepper does when mixed with the paint (paint is thick, it probably just makes it more sludgey instead of being an irritant when you scrape it off or something.)
I was gonna argue against babby seals but doing this to make them distrustful of their seal loadout is okay to me, I guess.
I think the Pangolin Pepper addition to the paint is too much added complexity for too little gain.
We're already gonna perfume it. I dont see what the pepper does when mixed with the paint (paint is thick, it probably just makes it more sludgey instead of being an irritant when you scrape it off or something.)
I was gonna argue against babby seals but doing this to make them distrustful of their seal loadout is okay to me, I guess.
Tua
鸡肉面条汤
- Location
- شوربة الدجاج المعكرونة
Indeed, we don't know for sure and can only speculate based on the other events and Ren's motivations
Agreed. That seems unnecessary. Having Hazo offer to inspect their gear after the fact also doesn't seem to offer much; we should already know their loadout from when we painted their gear, no?
Noumero
Omit Needless Words
On the other hand,
- We have no advantage of surprise.
- We have no surplus of chakra.
- 100*6+100+190+500 = 1390 CP, I expect, as opposed to enemy's minimal ~4000 CP.
- Our enemy is aware of our capabilities, and prepares specifically for us.
- Our enemy is three times larger.
- Our enemy benefits from all bloodlines simultaneously, including such strength multipliers as the three Wakahisa, the Tama, Nara, and Mori bloodlines.
All of this without accounting for the possibility that the enemy finds a combination of abilities/bloodlines as broken as Byakugan + Lighting Pillar. (Say, these crab faux-summoners1 + a Wakahisa + 20 chakra batteries = zerg rush.)
All of this without accounting for the possibility that Shikamaru screws up and the enemy actually develops a non-suicidal assault strategy.
From my perspective, this doesn't look good at all.
1. The Kani Clan:
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