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Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest

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huhYeahGoodPoint said:
Nothing against your purported dialogue - it's really good.
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Thx fam.

huhYeahGoodPoint said:
The problem is that our team just isn't, without us. Bold words, I know.
But consider this: For all that we go to Mari and Keiko literally any time we have a plan, the rest of the team kind of counts on us for it. Add on Minami taking nominal command, Kagome losing his apprentice (or joining us, which would deprive our squad of jonin), Akane either breaking off to "protect" us or being constantly worried over it, and our team kind of falls to pieces.
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Well, at least Noburi would be fine. :p

I do see your point though. On the other hand, by putting the village's needs before our team's personal desires to stay together we would help increase Jiraiya's political position a small amount. I don't actually recall the last time we let them take full operational command though. This would be the first time we would have Hazou split from the team for a long period of time; I'm kinda curious to see how that would work in practice.

huhYeahGoodPoint said:
Also, that sealing and hacking group is not going to be safe without protection on the tier that only S-Rankers provide, which, guess which Village they need to defend?
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Ideally, we would be close enough to Leaf that a response team could be there within minutes, yet far enough away that if something goes wrong with the sealing-creation process we don't blow up Leaf. I don't believe rational actors in Leaf would have the most secure sealing department inside of their city, but I also believe they would have contingencies in place to protect such a vital installation as well, especially if they know that there is a real chance the facility could be vital to the upcoming war effort (we did design Skywalkers out of a common seal after all).

If someone targets Hazou specifically while he is in the R&D facility though, he will be much safer than if he is on the road. If they still manage to kill him there anyway, well we were fucked from the start, imo.
 
Enjou said:
Maybe I'm being overly pessimistic, but this really does seem like a situation where asking isn't really a good option.
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eaglejarl said:
"Good. Any questions?" He paused while the team looked back and forth uncertainly.
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I'm sorry for repeating the same quote from earlier, but that's literally the last line of the chapter.

What else could he have said to convince you to ask him a few questions before we leave on a 2+ week mission? He didn't specify what type of questions they had to be or anything like that... I believe that as long as we don't have a laundry list of questions for him we should be fine.

Minutia about research questions should be avoided due to time constraints, but questions about the mission and whether or not Hazou (or anyone else for that matter) should go on said mission should be acceptable.
 
Dictator4Hire said:
Well, at least Noburi would be fine. :p

I do see your point though. On the other hand, by putting the village's needs before our team's personal desires to stay together we would help increase Jiraiya's political position a small amount. I don't actually recall the last time we let them take full operational command though. This would be the first time we would have Hazou split from the team for a long period of time; I'm kinda curious to see how that would work in practice.

Ideally, we would be close enough to Leaf that a response team could be there within minutes, yet far enough away that if something goes wrong with the sealing-creation process we don't blow up Leaf. I don't believe rational actors in Leaf would have the most secure sealing department inside of their city, but I also believe they would have contingencies in place to protect such a vital installation as well, especially if they know that there is a real chance the facility could be vital to the upcoming war effort (we did design Skywalkers out of a common seal after all).

If someone targets Hazou specifically while he is in the R&D facility though, he will be much safer than if he is on the road. If they still manage to kill him there anyway, well we were fucked from the start, imo.
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Ahem. I think I might have alluded to too much and not explained enough.

Our non-Hazou team dynamics go to hell, with Noburi (who has been established to be number two after Hazou) and Minami jockeying over true control. This means they cannot accomplish the mission they are given, or even worse, turns Keiko against either of the two because Keiko wants the team to work together and neither of them are. With nearly the entire group cored out, that entire mission is a writeoff.

The other thing about a massive coordinated effort by the best sealmasters and technique hackers is that it's really hard to hide. Sounds obvious, but any ideas we come up with while on mission, until we actually start making craters in mountainsides, is nearly undetectable. Basically, the search space that our enemies have for us if we're on mission is somewhere within a few day's travel of Leaf, maybe further maybe not, while joining the big massive effort to make S-Rank jutsu and seals is going to be painting an obvious target for our enemies to attack.

But is this bad for future team dynamics? Absolutely - our team right now is way too dependent on each other for everything. But this is a crisis, and we really cannot afford to trial-by-fire here.
 
So I'm tired as hell and want to go to bed. If you have ideas on improving my talks with Jiraiya/Mari that aren't about the whole seals/no seals debate, please do so quickly.

Better safe than sorry.
 
Enjou said:
Maybe I'm being overly pessimistic, but this really does seem like a situation where asking isn't really a good option.
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I think you would be a 100% correct to not ask for any gear if we where dealing with the third. But Jirayia literally adopted us. He might have wanted to gift us stuff when we became a clan but with the shit hitting the fan he forgot. We are family now and I think we should use that to our advantage. (Also Hazou is totally Jiryayia's favorite)
 
faflec said:
So I'm tired as hell and want to go to bed. If you have ideas on improving my talks with Jiraiya/Mari that aren't about the whole seals/no seals debate, please do so quickly.

Better safe than sorry.
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faflec said:
Give a hug if appropriate.
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I don't think this is wise / is underspecified:

Vecht said:
While I agree with the sentiment, this is mechanically awkward. Jiraiya is presumably still sitting behind the desk, and there are a number of guards around. How do we do this, exactly? Seems to just be begging for a really awkward scene that doesn't net us any points with anyone.
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Better to remove it imo rather than leave it in as is.

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faflec said:
Talk to Mari.
  • Make sure she knows we still love her. Give her a hug.
  • What else?
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Thank her for everything she's done with us? I'm not sure what else TBH.
 
Oneiros43 said:
Yes I know. Screaming in Kagome. But Jirayia has always apperciated jokes and humor. In a time of super stress when everyone is going to be super respectful he might appreciate someone treating him as the same person
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But not a direct subordinate getting a mission.

Let Mari-sensei do the jokes, she's better at it than us and is smart enough to use it.
 
huhYeahGoodPoint said:
Our non-Hazou team dynamics go to hell, with Noburi (who has been established to be number two after Hazou) and Minami jockeying over true control. This means they cannot accomplish the mission they are given, or even worse, turns Keiko against either of the two because Keiko wants the team to work together and neither of them are. With nearly the entire group cored out, that entire mission is a writeoff.
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I would see Minami stepping into Mari's role somewhat awkwardly at first, but eventually succeeding. As for the other team relationships Kagome would be the worst off without Hazou or Mari to handle him, but Akane will be there and she is emotionally intelligent enough to manage the team's emotional needs sufficiently for the duration of the mission.

It's hard to tell for certain though, which is partially why I want to separate Hazou from the team now while they are on a relatively safe mission. The team has a ton of operational freedom to complete the mission and speed is more important than secrecy so Kagome can finally feel safe with his arsenal of explosives. All-in-all, this isn't the worst mission to test this out on and in this war against Akatsuki situation we are beggars, not choosers for trying new team formations out.

huhYeahGoodPoint said:
The other thing about a massive coordinated effort by the best sealmasters and technique hackers is that it's really hard to hide. Sounds obvious, but any ideas we come up with while on mission, until we actually start making craters in mountainsides, is nearly undetectable. Basically, the search space that our enemies have for us if we're on mission is somewhere within a few day's travel of Leaf, maybe further maybe not, while joining the big massive effort to make S-Rank jutsu and seals is going to be painting an obvious target for our enemies to attack.
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Leaf has to have some way to protect their best and brightest as they try to make S-rank techniques or they would have been compromised and leaked already. Hidden Villages have every incentive to keep their original and strongest techniques secret until they use them in the field. All we have to do is follow Leaf OPSEC to the letter and trust them to do their jobs well enough for us to get our work done. OPSEC should come before recruiting every available sealmaster and other specialists too.

huhYeahGoodPoint said:
But is this bad for future team dynamics? Absolutely - our team right now is way too dependent on each other for everything. But this is a crisis, and we really cannot afford to trial-by-fire here.
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I don't think we will get a better chance and if we get put in another situation where the team gets cut off from Hazou's plan-making abilities they need to be able to adapt ASAP. I have a feeling this crisis is only going to get worse before it gets better; might as well rip the band aid off now, imo.
 
Current Mari section:
  • Talk to Mari.
    • Make sure she knows we still love her.
    • Give her a hug.
    • Thank her for everything.
    • Promise her we'll come back.
    • Tell her to make friends and be happy.
    • What else?
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I'm half a mind to remove the "say we're sorry for Jiraiya's loss" section because it has literally nothing and nobody is helping.
 
faflec said:
Current Mari section:

I'm half a mind to remove the "say we're sorry for Jiraiya's loss" section because it has literally nothing and nobody is helping.
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Let Jirayia know that he is part of the team and team uplift is willing to go pretty damn far for each other

Edit: either treat him as The Hokage and give him our complete respect or treat him like our adoptive father. Don't try to split the diffirence
 
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faflec said:
Say that you're sorry for his loss, in Hazou-speak.
  • HELP
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"I can't know exactly what you're going through right now, but I do know how painful it is to lose family. And although it can never replace those we've lost... we do have each other now. You've said several times that you would go to great lengths to destroy anyone who so much as threatens your clan. Well, I'm sure I speak for all of us, when I say we'll go pretty damn far for you, too."
 
Vecht said:
"I can't know exactly what you're going through right now, but I do know how painful it is to lose family. And although it can never replace those we've lost... we do have each other now. You've said several times that you would go to great lengths to destroy anyone who so much as threatens your clan. Well, I'm sure I speak for all of us, when I say we'll go pretty damn far for you, too."
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I don't wanna write it in all quotes...but I don't hate this. Apart from the ending, I've already said why. What about (changes in orange):
  • Say that you're sorry for his loss, in Hazou-speak. Things Hazou could try to voice:
    • We can't know exactly what Jiraiya's going through, but we know how painful it is to lose family.
    • It might not make up for what he's lost but we're a clan now.
    • He's already said, and show, how much he'd do for us.
    • We as well want to do a lot for him.
 
faflec said:
I don't wanna write it in all quotes...but I don't hate this. Apart from the ending, I've already said why. What about (changes in orange):
  • Say that you're sorry for his loss, in Hazou-speak. Things Hazou could try to voice:
    • We can't know exactly what Jiraiya's going through, but we know how painful it is to lose family.
    • It might not make up for what he's lost but we're a clan now.
    • He's already said, and show, how much he'd do for us.
    • We as well want to do a lot for him.
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Nah including the pretty damn far is the most important part.
 
Lailoken said:
Shear strength is irrelevant. You've been specifying "white hot" iron. That's not only past any alloy's melting point, it's way past pure iron's boiling point. The closest you're going to get is light-orange.

Again, use carbon. It can get hot enough to have a peak in the visible spectrum, has almost perfect emissivity, will add its own enormous combustion energy to the output, is soft enough to be minced extremely fine and fast, and the product is a gas. You can even adjust the same seal to be an explosive or a flashbang by just changing the dispersal area or charge load.

Short of breaking out candoluminescence there isn't going to be a more energy efficient approach, and even then it won't be as mass efficient.
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This is a better idea than iron.

Though I think pyrophoresis might have you beat on energy efficiency :p simply because we don't have to preheat anything.
 
faflec said:
It might not make up for what he's lost
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This must say "we", not "he". Hazou has shown sentiments of resenting Jiraiya taking over as the father-figure in his life, not necessarily aimed at Jiraiya, just that he already has a father. This puts that out into the open and gives some measure of closure. It is a small act of vulnerability that is necessary for this to have any meaning at all.

faflec said:
We as well want to do a lot for him.
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Yes, it has to be those exact words "pretty damn far." It will have dulled effect otherwise. This is narratively perfect and brings the whole thing full circle. It also creates a humorous undertone and Jiraiya will appreciate that. He has even teased us about it before. Again, a small act of vulnerability.

This will have significantly less meaning if you don't include these elements.

Edit: "He's already said, and show, how much he'd do for us." My suggestion here is again to be more direct, not to soften the words. He described in detail the gruesome things he would do to anyone who even threatened his clan (his words). That needs to be included for effect and for contrast.

Like, I get that you don't want to offend Jiraiya. But this just doesn't cut it, and as it's written might as well not be there at all.
 
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