Force constructs are not spatially locked. I see no reason to attempt them over Earth Domes or 5SB.
Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest
- Thread starter eaglejarl
- Start date
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- Tags
- naruto rationalist romance armageddon is looking better and better damn you kishimoto explosions everywhere explosives solve everyone if in doubt surrender to the mercy of zabuza it seemed like a good idea at the time looks like a really bad case of being a jōnin my god. where does the lore end? precommitting is the winning plan screaming in kagome screw the rules i have explosives something bad might still happen sometimes you gotta sociopath stabby zabby subsection c of paragraph 9 should include we can weaponize this so hard
- Location
- The Maple Syrup Mountains
That's fair, though in Leaf-assisted scenarios I think it becomes really significant to secure this combo. As-is, Icarus is probably worse for our side than for the Akatsuki, since half of the Akatsuki have flight of their own and none of Leaf's essies can say the same. With these skywalkers, it turns from "ground half of Akatsuki and all of Leaf" to just "ground half of Akatsuki", a decisive and unambiguous advantage as the flightless Akatsuki members are left unable to meaningfully engage with Leaf ninja except on Leaf's terms.
Yeah it might not be useful for fighting Akatsuki, it'll still be helpful for defending Leaf from other AMITY members attacking. That's alright, not every rune has to be used on the assault.
- Location
- United States
Wait, how high are we planning on taking our PS? I thought we hit the cap below 30.
We do not
EDIT: The plan is to take it to 32, as is in the plan you quoted.
- Location
- United States
@eaglejarl @Velorien @Paperclipped
Doyalist Question: Has Haru having a triggerable, weak jōnin aura that he uses in spars been retconned?
I ran across this blast from the past while looking for prep day links and had to share.
It's not often you see something so obviously correct it brings a tear to your eye.
[X] lore update
Emstar
The Shining One
- Location
- Trapped in an extradimensional rift.
- Pronouns
- She/They
Given the spoons deficit and general vibes on how busy the QMs are, I think doing the research we already intend to do on runes that have already been mechanically ironed out by the QMs instead of voting to add more paperwork to the backlog is a pretty solid idea.
[X] Action Plan: The Long Haul
[X] Action Plan: The Long Haul
- Location
- The Maple Syrup Mountains
Yeah, it's kinda ironic how after campaigning so hard for her own agency to be respected, Kei has become the Team Uplift member with the most problems about ignoring other people's agency. The Mio situation stands out as another major example, arguably even worse since while it was obvious that Hazou would choose to share runes with Tenten it's much less obvious that he would accept Kei's preferred solution to the Mio drama.
What was it that she would say about Hazou? That he thinks of the people around them as pieces to be moved around and doesn't bother to ask what they think before making decisions for them? Something along those lines. The next time it happens we should be ready to have a serious conversation about it.
- Location
- Can’t say. I know my momentum.
Man, I was so excited to read this! I loved CftG.
Whaat? @faflec?
I lol'ed at this.
Hey, now them's fighting words!
Uh oh. @faflec, what did you do?
Oh wow.
[jk] CftG interlude set in those 10 years
Why are you and @Velorien so good at writing extradimentional monstrosities?
Ouch. Also, I only realised at this point that Josh is literally Jashin. @faflec is a Jashinist confirmed.
I'm glad to see CftG again. Thanks @eaglejarl.
- Location
- USA
- Pronouns
- He/Him
You are most welcome. Thanks for the lovely reaction post.
- Location
- USA
- Pronouns
- He/Him
I haven't been tracking the calendar, but that sounds about right. We'll get back to you.
Cariyaga
Handsome Gentleperson
- Location
- United States
Correction: Leaf has Condors.
Having said that, I do largely agree with you.
[X] Lore Update
Hold! Hold until the results are in!
We should follow kagome's advice and do test-runs of our base before we commit to sleeping/working on the ground.
This seems like a pretty bad list/priority of Runes.
If we spend 2 months and research nearly a dozen runes, we should end up with a the option to pull the trigger, return to leaf, and throw down with Akatsuki.
Most of these individual projects are very cool, but together, they don't look much like the MVP list of what we would need to oppose Akatsuki and seize the rift.
Like, why are pokespacers and air leadeners a stratigic priority? Why are we persueing both Storm runes and Force Domes? What are we planning to do about Konan? How are we going to get the rift scar off-site so it doesn't become the centre of World War 5?
I think an MVP list looks something like:
Force Domes
Iron Earth
Kagome's Tears
Rift-Moving Runes
And important but not strictly critical:
[a counter for Konan]
[a counter for Amaterasu]
Remote Explosive Rune
[improved Remote Explosive Runes, or other non-WMD first-strike rune to assault the rift site]
Then come "nice to haves":
Storm Rune
Ninja Radar
...[others]
Why these lists?
MVP:
The minimum we need is the ability to get the rift back to Leaf(or other secure location), and defend Leaf from the remaining Akatsuki+up to 3 villages worth of armies. Force Domes and Iron Earth get us 90% of the way there, but don't stop Itachi from teleporting in WMD-Essies(Deidara and Konan) to exterminate Leaf. Adding in Kagome's Tears and/or a Konan countermeasure gets us to 99% there.
Important but not critical:
None of Leaf's Essies have a way to kill or disable Konan, so we'll need to invent one. Chakra Shredders, Pulsed Chakra disruptors, Let's Fuck With Sealmasters, ect are all good options.
Itachi getting an autokill on one(or more!) of our Essies would seriously screw our fighting ability. none of our Essies use much fire Jutsu. lets make a giant Rune of Jairaiya's fire-trap seal, or some other countermeasure.
We really need a non-WMD way to assault the rift site. Leaf already has some of these(3 essies, a bunch of summoners, Noburi to refill said Summoners and S-rank Shadow Clone Users, ect), but more is better, and a runic bombardment would be a great opener. the remote explosive runes would also be invaluable once leaf hides in a dome, as they can destroy any armies that try to approach the dome.
Nice to have:
Storm runes will be a pain for any non-tunelers that try to approach Leaf's dome, improveing general defensability.
Ninja Radar will help prevent any witnesses from escapeing the rift site, and let Leaf know if ninja approach(such as tunneling underground to investigate the Iron Earth Barrier. has great synergy as a targeting system for Remote Explosives.
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Cariyaga
Handsome Gentleperson
- Location
- United States
I largely agree, but Ninja Radar was called out by Naruto as a particularly useful one.
Actually, the minimum we'd need to win would be more like:
Rift-moving Runes
EM Nuke Rune(air -> plasma version)
Nuke the rift site, grab the Rift Scar, and run off into the distance. research Necromancy on *our* terms.
If we don't collaborate with Leaf, hopefully no-one will learn the details of EM Runes being a controllable man-made attack. Use ultrahot rune instead of ultracold so the storm looks different from the EM test-fire Akane did.
I'd point out that "everyone in the whole world will hunt us" but that's alrady true. the biggest penalty we'll suffer is that IFF Akatsuki somehow magicaly guesses it's us we might get 100% of the Akatsuki fully dedicated to hunting us down. but with only 4 members left.... it's not that big a differance. And Hidan's the only one who can track us anyways.
And given that Leaf's ally was the only other known victim of a similar-magnitude of attack, it draws attention away from Leaf and Uplift, and to some shadowy unknown 3rd party. it probably *reduces* the heat on us and makes Leaf safer.
Then we fuck off to the far side of Bear, set up serious Time Runes, fight chakra monsters, explore the Pure Lands at our leisure, and roll back up to The EN in a year or two as a party of S-rankers with Jiraiya, Akane, and Minato in tow, and the ability to resurect whoever we want.
Rift-moving Runes
EM Nuke Rune(air -> plasma version)
Nuke the rift site, grab the Rift Scar, and run off into the distance. research Necromancy on *our* terms.
If we don't collaborate with Leaf, hopefully no-one will learn the details of EM Runes being a controllable man-made attack. Use ultrahot rune instead of ultracold so the storm looks different from the EM test-fire Akane did.
I'd point out that "everyone in the whole world will hunt us" but that's alrady true. the biggest penalty we'll suffer is that IFF Akatsuki somehow magicaly guesses it's us we might get 100% of the Akatsuki fully dedicated to hunting us down. but with only 4 members left.... it's not that big a differance. And Hidan's the only one who can track us anyways.
And given that Leaf's ally was the only other known victim of a similar-magnitude of attack, it draws attention away from Leaf and Uplift, and to some shadowy unknown 3rd party. it probably *reduces* the heat on us and makes Leaf safer.
Then we fuck off to the far side of Bear, set up serious Time Runes, fight chakra monsters, explore the Pure Lands at our leisure, and roll back up to The EN in a year or two as a party of S-rankers with Jiraiya, Akane, and Minato in tow, and the ability to resurect whoever we want.
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Slapping a force dome around the area would also prevent eacapeees.
And it would only be a head-start either way, not a what to keep leaf from eventually getting implicated.
but yeah, I'll list under "nice to have"
Cariyaga
Handsome Gentleperson
- Location
- United States
No, I more mean, as a way to keep Leaf safe entirely. If you can see ninja approaching from a mile out, that's a *big* advantage.
oooh, nice synergy with Remote Explosive runes, both for the Rift Assault and defending Leaf. added.
Always a smart way to start a critique if you want change.
This is a pipe dream, it's not going to happen.
Misspellings aside
1) Storm Runes and Force Domes are different things with different use cases, Storm Runes are a quick easy rune that can be completed in less than ~a week, and provide significant defensive utility and an anti-Deidara function. Force Domes are to protect Leaf
2) Air Leadeners are dead easy, another quick rune that gives us options to lock down Akatsuki at the Rift site. Something that could potentially lock them all in place
3) Pokespacers make approaching the Rift and setting up defenses vastly more safe and easy.
Orochimaru, if you insist on going back immediately.
This is still TBD and we have no veterancy whatsoever, if it comes back as less than Hard I'll be very surprised. I'm moving forward without waiting for the remaining prep days to come back.
We don't have a rift scar to research and Iron is too hot right now for us to go back, we will have to skip researching this or make our own once we research better offensive runes.
Don't have one yet.
Mirror Dragon Runes
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- Location
- The Maple Syrup Mountains
I'm not very sure how to parse the relationship between the lines here. It sounds like the first subpoint is a direct elaboration of the base line, and then the second and third subpoints are caveats on the base line? I'm not super sure. (And also, I'm not 100% sure on what the first subpoint is saying. It sounds like "we might say to research this rune, but then the prep day turns out to be beyond us, so Hazoupilot should automatically stop himself unless we specifically say to overrule SOP about it" but it could be clearer)
It's a bit hard to describe, but I've always felt a little leery about throwing so much FP at research. I'm okay with this policy for our current projects, it fits the needs of our situation, and I do agree with the safety FP as a global rule, but I feel we might in other situations want to preserve excess FP instead of rerolling for progress, or might prefer to shelve projects we don't have FP for even if we could buy more (FP is expensive!)
So, broadly, I think there should be some flexibility in these rules, where we can put them in a different configuration that doesn't auto-buy FP and/or doesn't reroll for progress. We could always just change the SOP when we get there, but I have the feeling it's better to get it right the first time.
These rules seem to contradict each other. If they're meant to be compatible, it's not clear how that is so.
Should there be an objective standard for what constitutes a difficult project here? I could see something like "if it's in the highest research category Hazou has done a project in" or maybe "if Hazou expects it to take more than three cycles of research".
Minor typo.
I feel like we could expand on this a bit. Most notably, there are situations where we would be researching a rune and a seal, but we're okay with shirking a couple prep days from the seal such that it aligns with the rune cycle. These wouldn't be our high-end difficult seals, of course, but IIRC it's a use case we've run into before.
As well, if we ever find ourselves running off-track rune research, it could end up important to infuse that rune the day before our DoB infusion day. I know that was a major source of consternation when I was running calcs for our research while Noburi could only relay chakra to us over 7Path.
And more generally, I think it's probably more QM-friendly to describe how we want to align prep days and minimize cycle length, rather than telling the QMs to "make an effort" to do so. We could also give a relatively simple formula ("align projects to all infuse on the same day") with an explicit caveat that if a research chart is provided alongside a plan that overrides this part of the SOP.
What does "reroll aggressively" mean in the context of the SOP? We already specified thresholds earlier in the SOP about how to respond to projects that we think might fail on -6 or -3, is this meant to invoke one of those clauses?
[X] Sealing SOP: Runemaster
I don't feel like being sarcastic or snippy is called for here. I am sorry if you felt like my critique was a personal attack or otherwise upsetting to you. How would you like me to express this kind of feedback in the future?
In combination with your tone elsewhere, this felt a bit rude and dismissive, and I did not like it.
Also that was... your plan. So I'm confused why you're dismisseing it as an impossible pipe dream.
If my writing errors are annoying you, I am really sorry.
If you care to comment on it, you could better help my English writing by giving me a spelling/grammar correction(ideally in dm), rather than vaugeposting a gripe in the main thread that doesn't point out what was misspelled.
I don't understand why these use cases are different. Force Domes also provide significant defensive utility and are anti-Deidara. When would we want to deploy Storm Runes that Force Domes wouldn't work for?
And even if Storm Runes only take a week research, I'd rather spend that time on something that is both mission-critical and not largely redundant with another Rune We've research.
I doubt this will be tougher than Air Domes, which Essies would just bust through, but maybe it will work as a general debuff. Depends on implementation.
I have a lot of questions about how this will be applied. If it works as an AOE debuff, how will we cast it over the Akatsuki but not the team attacking them? It seems like it would also disable most ranged combat. And how will we get close enough to use it?
But sure, it's fast to research, and it's possible it would be useful. Having it in the research list is not a big deal.
How? The pokespace isn't movable, so it won't help us approach.
If we want to set up multiple runes it will make things easier, but the pokespacer itself will take take to set up. Are you imagining a situation were we will have 6 uninterrupted hours to set up one rune in secrecy, but not 12 hours to set up two runes?
I think relying on this is a very bad idea given the stakes, but I understand you may disagree.
That's very annoying to me, we did the prep day for a reason.
You could at least list "Kagome's Tears(if difficulty is medium or easier)" or something.
But also, why are you pushing for a big research update when the QMs are already backlogged on research? Let them catch up first!
It's not obvious to me that that patch of nowhere in iron is to hot to return to, or that researching rifts is impossible given the chakrascope reading we already have.
And why would researching a rift-maker be gated behind offensive runes? We can research them in parallel, and given that it's the start of a runechain(links of which can't be parallelized), starting it soon is more important for it than for the average rune.
We have done prep days on several Konan counters and are waiting for the results.
Can you explain why you are so set on "moving forward without waiting for the prep days to come back"?
Oh, yeah, those will probably do as Ameterasu Counters. Nice.
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