Pssst, this forum has spoiler tags.Any further discussion, unfortunately, is nigh-impossible without spoiling big chunks of the movie.
If it's the twist I saw speculated most often before seeing the movie, I can say that the filmmaker knew you would think you knew the twist coming and built that into the story.I haven't seen the film or anything but I watching the trailer I feel like I already know the twist
I haven't seen the film or anything but I watching the trailer I feel like I already know the twist
...And a post which boils down to "I can say something substantive, but nah" is not annoying?I knew that already. I just find threads where basically everything is in spoiler tags annoying.
I liked that they nodded at the easy Blade Runner "He's a robot too!!1!" twist without indulging in it
His reasons:Saw it, and would highly recommend it. I wonder what the asexual community would think of Nathan's reason for giving Ava sexuality.
BecauseQuestion:
If Nathan isn't enthusiastic about his vision of the singularity, an event he knows his creations will lead to, why does he choose to create them? I remember some dialogue justifying the decision but I can't recall the quote.
Imma blow your mind. Go look up the television show Black Mirror, Season 2 Episode 1, "Be Right Back," where Domnhall Gleeson himself plays the robot boyfriend.*Second, that some day we as a society need to get to the point where we can show a story about a scientist creating an android boyfriend/sextoy for herself and not have that be any more awkward than the reverse.
I've actually been having an argument hovering around this and could use some internet support,Like, at the end, when Ava is putting her skin on and getting ready to leave, I was genuinely unsure whether she would leave Caleb behind. I mean, Nathan's expectation that she was playing Caleb seemed very plausible, but at the same time Nathan was a rather despicable human being that I didn't trust anymore.
Oh, I definitely agree with you there.I've actually been having an argument hovering around this and could use some internet support,
Basically, after there were a bunch of articles talking about the gender/feminist tones of the movie, especially what Ava does at the very end, my friend said he didn't understand why people were reading so much into Ava's motivations. In her view, Nathan programmed Ava to play Caleb, so Ava didn't really 'decide' to leave him there, she was just following the dictates of her coding and fulfilling what the previous instructions made her do.
I don't think Nathan programmed Ava specifically to dupe Caleb. He goosed the results a little bit by using Caleb's porn data to make Ava look attractive to him specifically, but Ava's base programming itself wasn't skewed. I also don't think that Nathan would direct her programming to act a certain way because his goal was to see if she was capable of manipulating someone, and if he had already coded that capability into her the whole test doesn't really make sense.
Okay, so @stormbringer951 and I were discussing this and came to some conclusions. First, that if there is a list of 'good AI testing protocols' this is not them.
Second, that some day we as a society need to get to the point where we can show a story about a scientist creating an android boyfriend/sextoy for herself and not have that be any more awkward than the reverse. I'm trying to imagine what this movie would look like with (Nathan/Caleb/Ava) with some combination of (Natalie/Caitlin/Adama), and it's all pretty much super awkward. Actually imagining the various combinations of gender/sex flips ended up turning a conversation on AI into a pretty interesting discussion on gender expectations and roles.
Third, somewhat related to the above, this movie is a two hour version of what Caprica should have been.
Also, fair warning for @Ford Prefect and others - the trailer is actually made out of lies. Also, @Amorous Intent, if you haven't gone to see this movie...do so!
Just saw the movie, how is the trailer made of lies?
The trailer sets up a story where you have a robot asking the hero for help to escape its mad creator. This is exactly what happens in the movie.
But that's also the kind of trailer where you expect a twist at some point, it could have been Caleb being a robot himself or something else, but I'm not seeing what's the lie.
Maybe that's just me then, I expected an AI in the box type of movie and I got one.It's made of lies in that the type of movie and the type of narrative it seems to be selling is very different from what we actually get.
I've read it, I didn't feel as he did about the movie, and I was entirely focused on whether Ava was sincere or just playing Caleb since the beginnin. But I don't think it's a mistaken take either, I don't know whether the director may not have had intended Hulk's reading or not (but from the various interview,s it doesn't seem to support so), but I absolutely see where Hulk is coming from from.Incidentally, since this is back on my radar, has anyone seen the Film Crit Hulk take on the movie? Thoughts on that? I think that his take is fundamentally misguided, but nonetheless fascinating.
To back up the "lying trailer" point, a lot of the trailers started to focus on the approximately three seconds where Ava was rushing at Nathan, making it seem like it was action packed and/or with more overtly thriller tones. The actual movie being more cerebral thriller than suspense thriller isn't even hinted at.Maybe that's just me then, I expected an AI in the box type of movie and I got one.
I've read it, I didn't feel as he did about the movie, and I was entirely focused on whether Ava was sincere or just playing Caleb since the beginnin. But I don't think it's a mistaken take either, I don't know whether the director may not have had intended Hulk's reading or not (but from the various interview,s it doesn't seem to support so), but I absolutely see where Hulk is coming from from.
I don't think all the parts about artificial intelligence, it's the most obvious part of the movie. Rather I think that he says the movie can also be seen an allegory of a different situation.My problem with Hulk's reading is that it's very, very selective in how it approaches the movie. If you totally ignore all the parts where it's about artificial intelligence, yes, you can make Ava much more sympathetic, and feel a sort of catharsis when she escapes - but if you accept this reading and apply it consistently, you quickly go creepy places.