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Dragon Ball: After the End

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[X] Provide said single reason (write-in what).
-[X] Because she blames Lord Vegeta's actions for what she did. As a Patriarch, he might want to know what she is talking about and her versión of the events before deciding and whether she is talking out of anger or trying to shift the blame.
 
[]Use Instant Transmission to surprise attack him and knock him out.
-[]"Lady Vegeta, please continue."

Kinda want to do this.
 
Andres110 said:
Most of what you're saying I agree with, but not this. It's saying "Your grandson getting sealed is your fault because Dandeer is blaming her husband for sealing her son." It doesn't make sense.
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No, it doesn't say that. At no point do I say it is Yanmar's fault.

Bakkasama said:
-[X] Because she blames Lord Vegeta's actions for what she did. As a Patriarch, he might want to know what she is talking about and her versión of the events before deciding and whether she is talking out of anger or trying to shift the blame.
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He asks why she shouldn't be vaporised right now for implying it is his fault. I answer that she says Vegeta broke Jaffur, that he is a Patriarch (which means his duty is to reign in the excesses of the Lord). Sincé he didn't know what Vegeta was doing, he didn't act so he might want to actually know what is going on this time as he already should. Which he can't if he vaporizes her. Only, worded politely.
 
[X] Provide said single reason (write-in what).
-[X] Because she blames Lord Vegeta's actions for what she did. As a Patriarch, he might want to know what she is talking about and her versión of the events before deciding and whether she is talking out of anger or trying to shift the blame.

I like this one, because it feels like it still tries to calm things down but also gives at least a framework of reasoning for why "BURNINATE NOW" is not the best course.
 
[X] Provide said single reason (write-in what).
-[X] Because she blames Lord Vegeta's actions for what she did. As a Patriarch, he might want to know what she is talking about and her versión of the events before deciding and whether she is talking out of anger or trying to shift the blame.
 
[X] Provide said single reason (write-in what).
-[X] Because she blames Lord Vegeta's actions for what she did. As a Patriarch, he might want to know what she is talking about and her version of the events before deciding and whether she is talking out of anger or trying to shift the blame.
 
Andres110 said:
@PoptartProdigy

If Galick Gun is for single targets and Final Flash is for multiple targets, why did Vegeta use the Final Flash instead of the Galick Gun against Cell?

How do the Final Kamehameha and Big Bang Kamehameha compare with each other and the Super Kamehameha/Galick Gun?

Of the Final Kamehameha and the Big Bang Kamehameha, which would be the easiest to invent?
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He wanted to totally overwhelm Cell in the most spectacular way possible, in an attack that fired off all of its energy at once. The aim was to utterly vaporize Cell. The Final Flash is better for that. It's hardly worthless against single targets, after all.

I'm uncertain of what distinction exists between the various iterations of [adjective] Kamehameha beyond, "this videogame's mechanics require me to design multiple iterations of this iconic technique." At the moment they all just use the Kamehameha skill.

The Big Bang Kamehameha is superior to either attack in its name, but given how it was invented and never recorded, inventing it again would be a complete shot in the dark. Nobody has succeeded, although then again it's not a popular topic of research.

The Galick Gun is almost identical to the Kamehameha mechanically. However, it can fire a bit quicker and with slightly more precision, but benefits slightly less from extended charging. Nothing huge in any category, but it adds up to the Galick Gun being better suited to the Vegeta Style's focus on ranged attacks as a primary technique rather than the Goku Style's use of them as finishers only.
 
[X] Provide said single reason (write-in what).
-[X] Because she blames Lord Vegeta's actions for what she did. As a Patriarch, he might want to know what she is talking about and her versión of the events before deciding and whether she is talking out of anger or trying to shift the blame.
 
Well, right, getting out some ideas (probably shouldn't vote for them, just want there to be more options).

[] Provide said single reason (write-in what).
-[] Because we're not going to let him murder somebody, and he's not even supposed to be here, so if he tries anything or threatens anyone again we're going to throw him out.

..This is probably a bad idea as it will make Yammar an enemy, but I do think we can actually throw him out. He's more experienced than we are, but he might be rusty as well, and I think it would actually boost our standing in the eyes of the Faith and also our relationship with Dandeer.

[] Provide said single reason (write-in what).
-[] Because we'd like to talk to him alone for a moment before he does anything rash.
--[] If he agrees, grab him and use Instant Transmission to go somewhere private.
-[] Tell him that if he wants Jaffur to be unsealed, killing Dandeer isn't a good idea.
--[] If Dandeer's dead, Jaffur's not going to be happy once he gets unsealed. Either he's going to hate you for killing his mother or he's going to hate you for taking his revenge away from him.
--[] Dandeer's the only person who knows exactly how the seal is supposed to work, so unless he's had a sorcerer figure out how the seal works, unsealing him might not be possible or have unforeseen side effects.
--[] If Apra hasn't told him already, tell him our actual role in the Sealing.
--[] If it turns out he wasn't actually threatening to kill Dandeer and it was just a political play, apologize.
-[] If he doesn't agree to talk to us alone, tell him we're not letting anyone be murdered in here, but he's free to take part in the discussion if the Faith allows it.

I think Yammar might be angry enough to actually kill Dandeer, but if he isn't and this is just a political move, this might make him a bit annoyed.
 
Bommelom said:
[] Provide said single reason (write-in what).
-[] Because we'd like to talk to him alone for a moment before he does anything rash.
--[] If he agrees, grab him and use Instant Transmission to go somewhere private.
-[] Tell him that if he wants Jaffur to be unsealed, killing Dandeer isn't a good idea.
--[] If Dandeer's dead, Jaffur's not going to be happy once he gets unsealed. Either he's going to hate you for killing his mother or he's going to hate you for taking his revenge away from him.
--[] Dandeer's the only person who knows exactly how the seal is supposed to work, so unless he's had a sorcerer figure out how the seal works, unsealing him might not be possible or have unforeseen side effects.
--[] If Apra hasn't told him already, tell him our actual role in the Sealing.
--[] If it turns out he wasn't actually threatening to kill Dandeer and it was just a political play, apologize.
-[] If he doesn't agree to talk to us alone, tell him we're not letting anyone be murdered in here, but he's free to take part in the discussion if the Faith allows it.
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His ki feels angry. Unless you think that he can somehow fake emotions with it, he is likely to grow angrier. He has no reason to go talk with us alone either and for all he knows we would IT him straight to our father to stop him from killing Dandeer.

Arguing that he shouldn't kill her based on the sealing doesn't feel right either. For one, given what we know about him (that he feels he MUST be obeyed and tolerates no defiance and he has pride as a prince) I doubt that "Jaffur will be angry with you" would sway him that much. For two, Dandeer doesn't want to break the seal and she is not likely to help doing so, which means that he would need another sorcerer to do it anyways (and I asume there must be a way to protect oneself from mind delve and Berra would not see Dandeer imprisoned for the tie it would take to find a capable sorcerer that can do the technique). For three, save for our role in the sealing, we would be telling him things that he has had a year to think about.

You know, it just hit me how unlikely it must seem for him that he would be able to unseal his grandson. For all that we had a 5% chance of being born able to learn magic, the stigma against sorcery is so big that clan Vegeta only has 2 sorcerers, one of which is Dandeer and the other is from House Senzu, which rebelled and went into hiding. While it might be posible that they contacted him (the wife of the House's head is his daughter after all) they still rebelled and that is not cool for the Vegetans. The rest of the sorcerers are from clan Goku, whose head helped in the sealing and even if we and grandma are against the sealing, if he gets in a fight with dad as Gokun's we love our family and are likely to side with Berra.
 
[X] Provide said single reason (write-in what).
-[X] Because she blames Lord Vegeta's actions for what she did. As a Patriarch, he might want to know what she is talking about and her versión of the events before deciding and whether she is talking out of anger or trying to shift the blame.

Andres110 said:
If Galick Gun is for single targets and Final Flash is for multiple targets, why did Vegeta use the Final Flash instead of the Galick Gun against Cell?
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Personally, I'd assume it has to do with Cell's regeneration- pretty sure he'd already regenerated in front of Vegeta, and 'can pierce your heart' isn't good enough if you just promptly grow a new one.

Meanwhile, annihilating everything in a general area- including every part of his body- should be good enough.
 
Lailoken said:
Does nobody remember grandma's mention of "our plan" and her taking with Vegeta? We don't have to intervene at every opportunity.
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We remember. But we promised to mediate, and so we must intervene.

Honestly, both Kakara and Apra need to coordinate better. And Apra and Vegeta need a lecturing for this stunt.

Also, we've spent 73 pages and 41 days talking, debating, arguing and voting on Council related matters. It'll be nice to finally get to other stuff in this quest. :/
 
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Fuck it. let us speak truth to power.


[X] Provide said single reason (write-in what).
-[x] "Because you failed in your duty as Patriarch to reign in Vegeta. Your son nearly killed your grandson, and you were nowhere to be found. You broke your son, and didn't do anything to prevent him from breaking your grandson in turn. My Father is still alive only because Jaffur wasn't broken yet, but your negligence played no part in that."
 
Bakkasama said:
No, it doesn't say that. At no point do I say it is Yanmar's fault.

He asks why she shouldn't be vaporised right now for implying it is his fault.
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My apologies, I thought we were answering the question of "How is it my fault?" for some reason (the reason probably has to do with it being 12AM when I said that.)

Bakkasama said:
For all that we had a 5% chance of being born able to learn magic, the stigma against sorcery is so big that clan Vegeta only has 2 sorcerers, one of which is Dandeer and the other is from House Senzu, which rebelled and went into hiding.
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I think it was that Clan Vegeta only had 2 master sorcerers, not 2 sorcerers max.

Terrabrand said:
Personally, I'd assume it has to do with Cell's regeneration- pretty sure he'd already regenerated in front of Vegeta, and 'can pierce your heart' isn't good enough if you just promptly grow a new one.

Meanwhile, annihilating everything in a general area- including every part of his body- should be good enough.
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If he had seen him regenerate, he had forgotten that he could based on his reaction to taking out his arm.
 
Andres110 said:
I think it was that Clan Vegeta only had 2 master sorcerers, not 2 sorcerers max.
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Not according to Papata Fren:

PoptartProdigy said:
But nobody, it seems, is more outraged that House Senzu. As you all remember, they've withdrawn from our society in general -- and more worryingly, every attempt to go out and talk to them has failed to find their Hall. Listeners may recall that Head Raditz's brother Dandelor is -- was -- the only Vegeta Sorcerer aside from Lady Vegeta herself, and many are crediting him with this sudden disappearance. None more so than Lady Vegeta, who when questioned on the topic tends to get very offended by Dandelor's defiance. If he can evade even her, though, we certainly can expect great things from him in the future. But before that, we all have to face the increasingly-urgent issue: what do we do about the shortage of Senzu Beans that we now face?
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Seems like House Senzu had it nice. Only Senzu beam farm, guardians of the last remaining spacships, Head is married to the Lord's sister and his brother is one of the two Vegetan Sorcerers.
 
[] Provide said single reason (write-in what).
-[] Because she blames Lord Vegeta's actions for what she did. As a Patriarch, he might want to know what she is talking about and her version of the events before deciding and whether she is talking out of anger or trying to shift the blame.
 
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Bakkasama said:
Seems like House Senzu had it nice. Only Senzu beam farm, guardians of the last remaining spacships, Head is married to the Lord's sister and his brother is one of the two Vegetan Sorcerers.
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They're basically a nicer version of the Lannisters, by virtue of their ancestors having been precisely as colossal a set of bastards as the Lannisters.
 
Bakkasama said:
As a Patriarch, he might want to know what she is talking about and her versión of the events before deciding and whether she is talking out of anger or trying to shift the blame.
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What if he gets confirmation that she is in fact blaming him for what she did to her son and it wasn't just a poorly-worded lashing out? We're saying that he might be wrong about thinking she's actually blaming him, not that he shouldn't kill her if she is.

@PoptartProdigy

Will practising Jaffur Style increase our Ki Control limit? Will inventing a style that has Ki Sense as an involved technique do the same for Ki Sense?

If a style has Ki Manipulation [Basic Attacks] as an involved technique, is that a way to limit break Ki Manipulation since that's the only skill associated with them? Are there any skills that are associated with Ki Talents so we can limit break that?

I'd like to put 3 of my cookies into power level if we end up fighting Yammar. Can I expect the cookies to be unexpended if we end up not fighting him?
 
Andres110 said:
What if he gets confirmation that she is in fact blaming him for what she did to her son and it wasn't just a poorly-worded lashing out? We're saying that he might be wrong about thinking she's actually blaming him, not that he shouldn't kill her if she is.

@PoptartProdigy

Will practising Jaffur Style increase our Ki Control limit? Will inventing a style that has Ki Sense as an involved technique do the same for Ki Sense?

If a style has Ki Manipulation [Basic Attacks] as an involved technique, is that a way to limit break Ki Manipulation since that's the only skill associated with them? Are there any skills that are associated with Ki Talents so we can limit break that?

I'd like to put 3 of my cookies into power level if we end up fighting Yammar. Can I expect the cookies to be unexpended if we end up not fighting him?
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It would increase that, yes, as would Ki Sense.

It would be significantly harder than any other technique given that it's a super-skill, but yes, in theory. Ki Talents is derived solely from its component parts.

Be aware that I'm going to nerf that shortly, but sure. That closes all other cookie donations for the upcoming update, as a general notice. If no fight happens, they'll remain available.
 
Andres110 said:
Wait, wasn't it a max of 3 cookies per roll, not per update? Surely the communication roll is different from the combat roll?
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o_O ...well, if you all want to drop four or more cookies on a single update, I guess I'll reopen that. Given that I've been pretty open about the fact that they'll be changing soon, I figured you all would want to be more conservative with them.
 
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