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Brockton's Celestial Forge (Worm/Jumpchain)

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The Froggy Ninja said:
Hm… the real question is, can Mantra be turned into something and then turned back, so as to horribly abuse his resource perks. Mandala Arrays, size shifting weapons or an External Mantra Interface indicate yes, which has exciting implications.
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So I had a chat with the original author of the Asuras Wrath Jump (where the perks in the CF were taken from) over at the BCF Discord (Join us, become us)

He specified that no, mantra cannot be multiplied by resource/construction perks because of how mantra works as an expression of the sentience/emotions of a being.

Also a lot of people are sleeping on mantras power it seems. Here's the power levels according to the original doc :

Mantra Feats
● Level 1: (10 sources of mantra). Having access to Level 1 Mantra enables Peak Human Feats
● Level 2: (100-1,000 sources, like a small shrine or temple). Level 2 Mantra allows superhuman feats
like doublejumping, airdashing, superstrength and the like.
● Level 3: (1,001-10,000 sources). At this level, feats of passive regeneration are possible of even
magitech cyborg bodies, as well as further enhancing your already superhuman traits. Mantra begins to overflow into other parts of your magically expanded soul, appearing as resplendent halos and so on.
● Level 4: (10,001-100,000 sources). You can function as a OnePerson Army fighting fleets of ships or stranger things on equal footing!
● Level 5: (1,000,000+ sources). With this much Mantra, you could be a oneperson interplanetary conquest engine. You can travel from Earth to the moon by jumping, or parry mountains.
● Level 6: (Single Planetary Population) You are drawing the power of a planetary population, ranging anywhere from three billion to seven billion souls. You require extensive infrastructure, but are capable of feats that could reshape landmasses.
There is a limit to how much mantra a single world can provide no matter how many people live upon or around that place, a world's worth of mantra is still just one world.
● Level 7: (3+ planetary populations).
Such is the amount of mantra available to you that you could power a super weapon that can burn a planet's crust to magma. Assuming you have the mantra technology backing, you could also take on impossibly huge forms, able to hold planets in your hands. It is impossible to arrange this much Mantra or infrastructure without significant effort however. If you lack a Mantra Reactor, using this much power is dangerous!
● Level 8: (7+ planetary populations). This requires someone acting as a Mantra Foci to really direct all that prayer toward a specific target. However, feats at this level include pseudolightspeed interplanetary travel and planetbusting actions. Granted if you're using this much Mantra, someone is probably throwing moons at you.
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Hauntred said:
So I had a chat with the original author of the Asuras Wrath Jump (where the perks in the CF were taken from) over at the BCF Discord (Join us, become us)

He specified that no, mantra cannot be multiplied by resource/construction perks because of how mantra works as an expression of the sentience/emotions of a being.

Also a lot of people are sleeping on mantras power it seems. Here's the power levels according to the original doc :
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Yeah, but resource perks have already multiplied human soul as a resource. What's human emotion compared to that?
 
Fouredged Sword said:
Yeah, but resource perks have already multiplied human soul as a resource. What's human emotion compared to that?
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Fair enough, he could multiply souls whose every purpose is to worship him, no problem and be able to achieve until mantra level 5 assuming he can withstand that level of mantra. (Let's be real - Joe wouldn't do that)

The author also said that technically speaking joe originally would've only been able to channel upto level 1 since he only has a single asuras wrath perk and no max mantra boosting perks (cyborg Hindu godbody gives +2 max).
BUT since joe has insane durability, he should be able to channel more than that. In the end he said that he can't comment on it and it's totally upto lord to decide on what level the max mantra should be.
 
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Hauntred said:
So I had a chat with the original author of the Asuras Wrath Jump (where the perks in the CF were taken from) over at the BCF Discord (Join us, become us)

He specified that no, mantra cannot be multiplied by resource/construction perks because of how mantra works as an expression of the sentience/emotions of a being.

Also a lot of people are sleeping on mantras power it seems. Here's the power levels according to the original doc :
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Not so much sleeping on it as being aware of the fact that Joe absolutely isn't going to create emotion bearing life for the purpose of worshiping him. He'll maybe bump up a rank if Cyborg Hindu Godbody comes with Mantra Affinity so the skulls can refine their prayers and he can siphon off people feeling whatever his affinity is. It doesn't matter what the theoretical heights are if there's no reasonable way he's going to reach them.
 
The Froggy Ninja said:
Not so much sleeping on it as being aware of the fact that Joe absolutely isn't going to create emotion bearing life for the purpose of worshiping him. He'll maybe bump up a rank if Cyborg Hindu Godbody comes with Mantra Affinity so the skulls can refine their prayers and he can siphon off people feeling whatever his affinity is. It doesn't matter what the theoretical heights are if there's no reasonable way he's going to reach them.
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That's true……until an endbringer fight and if lord allows joe to pull out the big guns to stomp on an EB.

If he does that then…..let's just say that mantra gen wouldn't be that much of an issue.

Also there were whole discussions on the discord about what would happen if cauldron knew what mantra was capable of. Since they could easily feed joe worlds worth of mantra.

But in the end this is all theory crafting and mantra is just a nice supplement currently. Rather than absolutely game breaking.
 
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"It was his plan all along!", "It's only what he wants us to think. He surely has some more nefarious plans hidden within it." or "What you think he meant that he only wanted to sleep when he called Weld that day? Hah, don't be naive! Any moment now will he do his devastating deed."
 
Emagstar said:
It would require a truly frightening degree of competence on the part of the PRT to figure out that worship and not 'weird tinker juice' is powering some of Apeiron's actions. I think he's safe.
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Probably, I'm just referring to the fact that Joe has a habit of gaining powers that retroactively justify certain theories, like him getting stronger by grandstanding.

Also, I'm just imagining Joe taking down an Endbringer, and the next day calling Weld physically sick to tell him he's taking the day off to deal with all the worship.
 
Emagstar said:
It would require a truly frightening degree of competence on the part of the PRT to figure out that worship and not 'weird tinker juice' is powering some of Apeiron's actions. I think he's safe.
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They already have theories on him not being a pure thinker.
If he pulls out something weird, he would just be a showman tinker,thinker,Trump

His style thinker power.
His tinkered objects are art.
Trump he can effect powers to a limited extent, and he seems to be getting stronger with more coverage,
when he was known only by the undersides he gave super knives , and then had a tp for dramatic exits.
Then everything escalated and he just shot up in ability.
Affecting powers is his slowest progression as if it's not really his specialty but close enough.
Like the powers are a beautification thing(everyone loves hot actors, and skilled ones).
Weld gets hotter and gets more control.
 
So after rereading the chapter a few (dozen) more times, one question I have for everyone here and for @LordRoustabout is the table and seating positions for the leaders now that the summit is underway? I know this is a truly pedantic question, but I'm the type that really likes to visualize this stuff in my mind, and I can't help but think of who is sitting where and next to whom could really affect how the summit goes. For instance, if Saint or Trickster is sitting next to Joe, mainly Saint, that will really test his ability to uphold the truce, especially if they get lippy. I also love the idea of Skidmark sitting next to Kaiser and needling him throughout the entire meeting. Then again, this could be another countless thing where I am simply overthinking things and who sits where matters not a jot, but the imagination must be fed!

TitanFrost said:
I don't think Victor was stealing skills. His power just doesn't haven't an off switch, so even when he isn't skill stealing his mind tentacles are already waiting in your brain.
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Cunuroi said:
You know, I've sort of been vaguely aware of the Victor speculation so it's not a surprise to see it come up but I was surprised how much of an event it turned out to be.
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Part of the reason I think the thing with Victor turned into such an event is that people were unaware of just how wide and persistent of an effect his power really is. The assumption might have been he can steal skills only he wants to, focuses solely on you, and several other factors. That the reality turned out to be something else entirely that affected everyone in a room and only required simple eye contact for Victor to really start stealing would be definitely be viewed as a violation of the truce and would certainly change future interactions with both him and the E88. On that note, I would love to see either an interlude or POV after Somer's is over from either Rune or Damsel not only reacting to how the summit went, but also how Victor might have been affecting people on their own team.
 
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Emagstar said:
It would require a truly frightening degree of competence on the part of the PRT to figure out that worship and not 'weird tinker juice' is powering some of Apeiron's actions. I think he's safe.
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Considering that people are scrambling to ascribe some sort of limit to Apeiron?

I am pretty sure the gets power from adoration/awe/worships is probably in some PRT garbage bin by now where it was discarded.
 
Question, if the mantra limit is is fiat backed to "no matter how many they are in the planet, a planet only counts as one planet", how does that affect something like multiple alternate earths? Do they count as different planets or since they are all atill earth does it count as only one?

PinkShadowReader said:
"It was his plan all along!", "It's only what he wants us to think. He surely has some more nefarious plans hidden within it." or "What you think he meant that he only wanted to sleep when he called Weld that day? Hah, don't be naive! Any moment now will he do his devastating deed."
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At this point in time I would think they just say "responce to Apeiron number 4" and save the words :D
 
On killing Endbringers:

1) The core problem theory seems to be fanon. Scion killed one in canon without any problems from the exploding core. Yes, you can argue that Scion's beams prevented the problem, but that's not in the text, so it's at best a guess.

2) "Killing one releases new Endbringers specifically designed to avoid the weakness the other one had" is technically fanon too. In canon, characters hint at it, but it's not actually stated to be true.

Also, the idea is a little questionable; Behemoth was killed by Scion, and it's probably not possible to avoid that "weakness". You might argue that Bohu used time and Phir Se's attack used time, but they're only vaguely similar despite being both based on time, and Phir Se's attack made no contribution to the Endbringer's defeat anyway.

3) Technically even the number 20 is fanon. There were 20 Endbringer-like things in Eden's interlude, but it's unclear whether the Endbringers already exist and are stored away (so we're at exactly 20) or are made up on the fly.
 
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Mesaphrom said:
Question, if the mantra limit is is fiat backed to "no matter how many they are in the planet, a planet only counts as one planet", how does that affect something like multiple alternate earths? Do they count as different planets or since they are all atill earth does it count as only one?
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They count as different planets I'm pretty sure. They're still separate from each other. Like Earth Bet and Earth Aleph are two separate planets, not just one.
 
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Mantra Overwhelming (The Shallow)
  • Apocrypha
    • Had this mental image and just had to write this :p
    Mantra Overwhelming
    "Apeiron. Leader of the Celestial Forge."

    Then there was a guitar riff, and I could feel Imposing Declaration of Title strike the air around me. Things went even further as energy flooded into my soul, shining out as multiple arms formed of stars holding hammers behind me, Celestial Forge-themed halos, in effect. I had just been made aware of this energy after all. It was Mantra. And Mantra worked off of Souls. And me and my duplicates shared a Soul. Fuck. I should have considered that.

    Everyone seemed shocked as the afternotes of the riff faded from the air, as did the halos.

    Damnit, now I was going to be pressed for using my style powers against everyone else.


    Jeane rushed into the office with shock as the end of Accord's moans reverberated in the air. He smiled, a totally normal totally calm smile, if it seemed a bit dopey.

    "...You just missed it Jeane... That was perfection..." He sighed, a content sigh twinged with regret as he turned away from the screen that had a stream of Somer's Rock coming from a mole wearing a portable camera "...I should have gone in person..."


    "Look, the Divine Arcane Craft did boost it, but the calculations aren't adding up. Where did all the extra Mantra come from?"

    "I've already accounted for any level of mantra coming from the broader population or the Case53s. Where else could it be coming from?! We have to double check the effectiveness of the boosting system! Daedalus's student is not always consistent!"


    [Course Correction] had no way to describe what it had just experienced. [King Of Arms] Host was doing fascinating things, though the shard itself didn't want to hand over any [Data], no matter what [Course Correction] offered. It's opinion closely matched that of it's host, their emotions practically in sync. Still, neither it or it's host knew what to call that sublime feeling rushing through the both of them. It shared this feeling with all other Shards of the hosts in [Data: Location: "Somer's Rock"]. They were currently all in communication, discussing ways of gaining the [DATA] [King Of Arms] refused to divulge. [Course Correction] was at a weakness, it's host not having experienced the effect from ground 0, but from what little actual [Data] was being shared, it seemed that there wasn't a big difference in effect if any. No matter what though, it would figure out what the hell [King Of Arms] was doing this Cycle.
     
  • Apocrypha
    • The Shallow said:
    Jeane rushed into the office with shock as the end of Accord's moans reverberated in the air. He smiled, a totally normal totally calm smile, if it seemed a bit dopey.

    "...You just missed it Jeane... That was perfection..." He sighed, a content sigh twinged with regret as he turned away from the screen that had a stream of Somer's Rock coming from a mole wearing a portable camera "...I should have gone in person..."
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    Sharing the livestream openly online would be a good source for an unexpected amount of worship.
     
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