Crystalwatcher
(Verified GM)
- Location
- Limbo
Post it in the thread.
Crystalwatcher's Magical Girl Quest!
- Thread starter Crystalwatcher
- Start date
- Original
Did you ever want to see exactly what happened to Hope before it fell to the Legions Of Hell(tm)? Wish to see the Defender of Humanity give it their all before they inevitably fail? Have you ever wanted to die a gruesome and painful death fleeing from the Forces of Darkness(tm)?
THEN HAVE WE GOT THE ROLEPLAY FOR YOU! Featuring highlights such as:
- Goddess Red, before going Coo-Coo for Coco Puffs!
- Goddess Grey, before being stuck like a roast pig and resurrected by the previous after they Jumped Off The Slippery Slope(tm)!
- Both of the Unified Dark and Light going at it like starving wolves fighting over a scrap if meat!
- Humanity's first and only super-gate!
- Goddess Gold being Goddess Gold!
- Horrific murder nearly everywhere you look!
- Non-emo Goddess White!
- And much, much more!
Join The Fall of Hope: Hellfire Run today!
* warning: chances of your soul literally igniting starts at 85%. Enter at your own risk.
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It might not take much of her mental attention, but she'd have to stop holding up the barrier to stab her. And seeing as "the space is too small for either Red Rose or your sister to bring enough power to bear against either barrier without killing Insight", what makes you think there's enough space for her to do it anyway, or that Insight wouldn't be killed by it?
And it's just one example. Here's another: she gets a clone down by the barriers, then sends the White River over the wall and kills Insight. And another: she picks up dirt/pulverizes stone and blinds us with a dust cloud, then goes for Soul Rend while we can't see her other body. And another: she sends one body back in the building and asks for help from whoever's inside or grabs another piece of Brandcraft or picks up a grenade and throws it over the barrier/wall to kill Insight or otherwise gets something to help her win.
Point is, a little creativity goes a long way, and she has a wealth of experience to draw inspiration from. You should, just as a general policy, plan for your enemy being smarter than you, better informed, and having any supplies they reasonably could. Any time you assume that they will do something other than the optimal counter to your strategy, you should have a specific reason. If you don't have good reasons to think something is impossible, assume they can do it. Being unable to think of a way to do it is not a good reason.
The context for this discussion was what happens when White Soul gets bored of failing to kill us and goes for something other than Soul Rend.
(1) First suggestion of using the Conceptual Language as a weapon. Suggestions of using it on White Soul. It being brought up during this voting period.
(2) My point exactly. Your claim was that the Conceptual Language would help prevent her from dodging. It doesn't, because her dodge is something completely different; she'd do exactly the same thing if we remained silent.
(3) I doubt it's dulled that much (at most, it just scales as a fraction of our Health), and pain is not necessarily related to damage amounts. Though the only time we've been hurt since getting Segarite Core was when Solar Radiance brought us from 915% to 81.5%, so there's no completely conclusive evidence on that part. Also, remember Sixth Heaven who stunned us despite dealing no damage.
(4) Red Rose describes the effects as "literally rot from the inside out" and "not a nice way to go". And seeing as it turns our own magic against us, being made of magic might actually be worse than if we still had a fleshy body. And no, we aren't used to pain. I think the only serious pain we've had to deal with was from the Spawn of Mayhem, when we got impaled by a Hell Beast, and Solar Radiance, plus a bit when training (Red Rose is not a gentle teacher)—and it was specifically noted in the first update that we aren't used to pain.
(5) Red Rose thought that grenades might get her. Her ability to get out of the way is a known quantity, which is easily accounted for with AoE. Uber's already covered this. The Starshine plan has some flaws, but this is not one of them.
(6) Why do you keep saying "morph"? The word is (usually) an abbreviation of "metamorphose", and the root is a Greek word meaning "shape". Not a problem, it's just a really weird word to use for her clone-teleport.
The current version of Don't Mess With Divinity said:
What happened to this?
I think I'm about done discussing this; not much to say without repeating myself. I'll summarize:
1. The primary plan asks Nepgear to taunt White Soul, and then charge her. Both of these are likely to signal our intentions.
2. White Soul is aware that she is vulnerable after casting Soul Rend, and knows that we have ranged firepower. She will not cast it unless her other body is safe.
3. It takes too long. Every second we spend not killing her is a second she can think of creative ways to kill us, to get by us and kill our allies, or otherwise do something we don't like. Also, our allies are busy trying not to be crushed to death and Revel In Darkness is weakening us, so the faster we win this the better.
4. By waiting for Soul Rend, we give her the initiative.
5. The primary plan relies on us being able to find and target White Soul immediately after being hit with Soul Rend. I expect us to be too distracted by pain for at least a few seconds.
6. The Conceptual Language part contributes nothing unless it happens to either kill her or knock her out, and will harm our allies if we aren't far enough away.
—6.1 We don't know how far away is far enough. The other end of the courtyard, i.e. ~70 meters, will suffice, but we can't be sure of anything closer.
—6.2 Going away from the barrier exposes our back more than it already is.
—6.3 Getting far enough away both reveals some of our intentions, and makes it harder for us to prevent White Soul from going around us. It also may push her back into the building, which is bad for us because we want to leave it alone.
7. The current version causes just as much collateral damage as other plans.
8. If she does use Soul Rend but we fail to kill her, we're in bad shape.
9. Anastasia getting hit by Soul Rend will give Sega a heart attack.
2. White Soul is aware that she is vulnerable after casting Soul Rend, and knows that we have ranged firepower. She will not cast it unless her other body is safe.
3. It takes too long. Every second we spend not killing her is a second she can think of creative ways to kill us, to get by us and kill our allies, or otherwise do something we don't like. Also, our allies are busy trying not to be crushed to death and Revel In Darkness is weakening us, so the faster we win this the better.
4. By waiting for Soul Rend, we give her the initiative.
5. The primary plan relies on us being able to find and target White Soul immediately after being hit with Soul Rend. I expect us to be too distracted by pain for at least a few seconds.
6. The Conceptual Language part contributes nothing unless it happens to either kill her or knock her out, and will harm our allies if we aren't far enough away.
—6.1 We don't know how far away is far enough. The other end of the courtyard, i.e. ~70 meters, will suffice, but we can't be sure of anything closer.
—6.2 Going away from the barrier exposes our back more than it already is.
—6.3 Getting far enough away both reveals some of our intentions, and makes it harder for us to prevent White Soul from going around us. It also may push her back into the building, which is bad for us because we want to leave it alone.
7. The current version causes just as much collateral damage as other plans.
8. If she does use Soul Rend but we fail to kill her, we're in bad shape.
9. Anastasia getting hit by Soul Rend will give Sega a heart attack.
- Location
- Earth
...and to each of those, there is a simple solution. First of all, the barrier has no openings or the three on the inside would have already found them. Heck, if it was just walls, they could have jumped out of it; no bringing anything inside without bringing herself inside.
Nepgear is immune to status effects such as Dazzle and Blind.
We were told that this is a Boss Rush, so no one but the Boss will fight; she might bring in some mooks, but we can paste them with little more than a thought.
I could write out my own problems with other plans... but we were there already, no need to repeat myself. In the end, what plan gets chosen will depend on what the most people think works.
I think that the plan I made has the best chances of actually getting a good hit on White Soul; we only need one anyway. So I will stay with it. It might be slower, it might have risks... but so has any plan proposed so far.
I was convinced otherwise, even though some people assume this as not possible.
diesel366
To infect the stars with devastation
- Location
- Australia
*blink* okay, i haven't been able to keep track of plans and what not due to other things, but is using conceptual language actually the winning vote? The thing we have no idea the range for is completely unpredictable and unknown?
There haven't really been many votes or much consolidation. Using conceptual language is currently in the lead by one vote, over my Rain of Light plan, with it's whopping five votes.
Vote Tally : Original - Crystalwatcher's Magical Girl Quest! | Page 646 | Sufficient Velocity [Posts: 16146-16350]
##### NetTally 1.9.9
[X] Plan Don't Mess With Divinity
-[X] Get some distance between yourself and the barrier, then taunt White Soul into using Soul Rend against you
--[X] If that takes more than four turns, go ahead and blast her with Starshine; make sure to concentrate fire all around both of her bodies so she can not morph away
-[X] The moment she does, charge at her and call out [PEACE] in the Conceptual Language from as close as possible to stop her from reacting, then cast Starshine on her
-[X] If she gets out of that, cast again or use Core Purge, or whatever is most likely to hit her
No. of Votes: 5
[X] Plan Rain of Light
-[X] Try and keep the distance between you and both of White Soul's bodies as small as possible.
-[X] Once you are as close as you think you'll get cast Starshine at both of White Soul's bodies. You've already used it against dozens and hundreds of targets so hitting just two, and the area around them to avoid clone teleport shenanigans, can't be too hard.
No. of Votes: 4
[X] Plan Fire Everything
-[X] Fire Starshine at White Soul, trying to fill the air with so many projectiles White Soul can't dodge even with body-deletion.
-[X] If she gets within 50 meters of you, activate Core Purge.
-[X] Continue using your spells until White Soul is dead.
No. of Votes: 2
[X] Plan Big Booms
-[X] Start blasting with Purifier Beam at your own feet and sweeping towards White Soul. Aim for as much AOE as you can as long as you avoid engulfing the barrier.
-[X] If White Soul backs away and gives a lull try to hit the barrier to weaken it, aim away from where Insight is located.
-[X] If White Soul moves to the barrier curse and fly far enough away that she can't reach you quickly.
No. of Votes: 1
[X] Plan Someday This Will Work
-[X] Tell Sega to go through the wall or the ceiling.
-[X] Fly about halfway down the hall and activate Core Purge along the way. Make sure to watch both bodies.
-[X] If she avoids it by going through a wall, carve a hole and follow. If she goes into the central structure, follow at max speed. Stay in the middle of passages/rooms in order to prevent her from using corners. Return quickly in case she's circling around to go for the others.
No. of Votes: 1
[X] Plan Bluescreen
-[X] Talk her down
-[X] mention that the seal makes sure Red Rose's first Priority will be to Godess Red and not to her.
-[X] that you have been friends to Red Rose, while she only caused her pain
-[X] that you have freed the old guard from Godess Red
-[X] if that fails, proceed with some other plan
No. of Votes: 1
-[X] The moment she does, charge at her and call out [PEACE] in the Conceptual Language from as close as possible to stop her from reacting, then hit her with the Panzer Blade as often as possible
-[X] If she is out of your direct range in that moment or gets away from you, cast Celestial Severance or Starshine, whichever is more likely to hit her
No. of Votes: 1
——————————————————————————————————————————————
Task: EXP
[X][EXP] Plan Emergency
-[X] Level Starshine to 17 (150+160=310)
No. of Votes: 10
Total No. of Voters: 15
- Location
- Voidbetweenstars
We were told that if were at the other end of the hallway no one on our side will die from speaking with the conceptual language.
ReaperofInterest
Herald of Disaster
[X] Plan Rain of Light
-[X] Try and keep the distance between you and both of White Soul's bodies as small as possible.
-[X] Once you are as close as you think you'll get cast Starshine at both of White Soul's bodies. You've already used it against dozens and hundreds of targets so hitting just two, and the area around them to avoid clone teleport shenanigans, can't be too hard.
There is no way that using the Conceptual Language as a weapon can end well, in my opinion.
-[X] Try and keep the distance between you and both of White Soul's bodies as small as possible.
-[X] Once you are as close as you think you'll get cast Starshine at both of White Soul's bodies. You've already used it against dozens and hundreds of targets so hitting just two, and the area around them to avoid clone teleport shenanigans, can't be too hard.
There is no way that using the Conceptual Language as a weapon can end well, in my opinion.
- Location
- United States, EST
- Pronouns
- He/Him
[X] Plan Rain of Light
- Pronouns
- He/Him
That doesn't mean they will be in any shape to continue the mission, however. We should not be using an untested weapon that splats allies here.
[X] Plan Rain of Light
(1) Missing the point. These are just examples. If you're coming up with individual reasons they won't work, you're doing it wrong. The point is that she has options and is competent enough to take advantage of them. The point is that we cannot anticipate everything she might do. The point is that giving her time to plan, to be creative, to try things, is a bad idea.
(2) Not guaranteed. It's been about twenty seconds. Sega is too busy panicking, Red Rose is busy preventing them from getting squished—which both pins her in place and takes some of her attention, and prevents her from acting to get them out—and Insight is both keeping out of their way and too weak to do much to escape. And the White River is a liquid, so it can get through smaller openings than people—like, for example, the trees overhanging the path, which anyone trying to jump out would get stuck in.
(3) That's Goddess Gold. Solid Core is immune to damage over time effects, mental pollution and mind control. Speaking of which—@crystalwatcher, why did ICORE block Dazzle? It's not on the list of things we're protected from.
(4) Any status effect immunity is completely irrelevant, because I was suggesting that she be blinded by a dust cloud, i.e. a physical barrier blocking her vision. Depending on the available materials, it could be impossible to see more than a couple of feet.
(5) That (a) addresses only one of my scenarios, and possibly the least worrisome one at that, (b) relies on crystalwatcher being more committed to the "boss rush" idea than having White Soul be competent, and (c) is meta reasoning, which I prefer to avoid when possible. Of course, I don't expect her to fetch another MG, both for the reason you gave and because I think it would go against her personality. But it is a possibility, and I was only throwing out illustrative examples, not making predictions.
(6) Because it bears repeating: the specific examples I gave are irrelevant; what's relevant is that there are lots of things White Soul can try. If you have to come up with individual solutions then that shows that you don't have a comprehensive solution, which makes it likely that there is something you don't have a solution for.
Not assuming, it's just that that was the major advantage of your plan. Looking again, I see I missed the implication that you decided the collateral damage was worth it. My bad.
…aagh. I don't think we'll get any good new ideas, so
[X] Plan Rain of Light
[X][EXP] Plan Emergency
-[X] Level Starshine to 17 (150+160=310)
It's the best plan currently running. I would really like an explicit backup plan, though. My suggestion is Core Purge to get some breathing room, then try to free our allies.
And to head off the simplest failure mode, because we did look away for a second: @crystalwatcher, we can see both bodies, right? There's no possibility that she's talking with one while the other is being sneaky?
Crystalwatcher
(Verified GM)
- Location
- Limbo
The Dazzle (False) that White Soul tried to use on you was functionally throwing liquid into your eyes. That ran up against your inherent barrier, which protected them.
So, soft mechanics happened and you did the Superman thing.
Personally I think people have been too eager to try and use Core Purge this arc. I mean I get that it's the only weapon Nepgear has that has IFF and so can take down Control Seals without killing the MG but both the name, inspired by the idea of a reactor purge, and fact it carries a penalty to both Health and Base Resilience tell me it's not something that should be thrown around so often.
Doubly so in this case since we know Core Purge has other effects:
Now we've never actually used Purifier Beam, or any of our spells, while Core Purge is active however given that the Purifier Beam is a release valve:
I'd expect damage to drop massive, possibly even to the point of it not functioning at all, since actually exposing the core like Core Purge does is going to drastically drop the pressure.
Hm. Not being able to use the Purifier Beam either directly or for casting spells would certainly result in a change in Nepgear's combat style. She'd have to rely on her Panzer Blade, which we know from Fatal Gear 1 works fine with Core Purge active, for combat. Melee combat + Core Purge does seem to make sense.
[X] Plan Rain of Light
[X][EXP] Plan Emergency
[X][EXP] Plan Emergency
- Location
- Voidbetweenstars
This is the final boss, of this mission.
ReaperofInterest
Herald of Disaster
The final confirmed boss. There's been hints that there's a secret boss waiting for us after this.