- Location
- Poland
[X] Plan Talking with Dwarves
The Old World: Dark Age of the Empire
- Thread starter Warkeymon
- Start date
- Fantasy
Night_stalker
Slava Ukraini!
- Pronouns
- He/Him
[X] Plan Talking with Dwarves
- Location
- Centro Italia
[X] Plan Talking with Dwarves
I'm curious, can we start experimenting with steam technology? If this is the time when the Marinburg steamboats were built, wouldn't that mean we can have the technology necessary to make rudimentary steam engines? I'm not asking to make a steam tank right away since that'd be impossible now, but couldn't we make smaller wooden weapons platforms powered by a small engine like the Marinburg steamboats to hold our Ironsides so that they could be safer? Hell, we can just have them be drawn by armored horses as well as long as it's a decently armored mobile pillbox for Ironsides to fire from. Basically, what I'm saying is, can we have war wagons, powered by steam preferably since we can make theoretically make them bigger but I'm fine with horses as well, to hold our Ironsides so that they can fire with invulnerability? I think that'd also raise the recruitment rates since more engineers/specialists would like to come if they could fire their repeaters/other experimental weapons they may bring from a safer firing platform instead of being more vulnerable walking like the rest of the soldiers/rabble.
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[X] Plan Talking with Dwarves
- Pronouns
- Warkeymon
Steam engines haven't been invented yet (by humans, Dwarfs are unwilling to share this technology) though in the original timeline Leonardo of Miragliano invents the steam engine in a few years time.
The Marienburg Land Ship uses a reverse engineered steam engine that Nulner engineers developed based on Leonardo's engine from the Steam Tanks. It isn't invented for another four to five hundred years at this point.
At the moment steam engines require a genius on the level of Leonardo, Dwarfen help, or the reverse engineering of existing engines.
Enclosed, armoured, horse-drawn carriages with gun slots could be built with existing technology but would be a significant departure from the philosophy of any existing Company and would likely require the founding of a new Company based around the use of war wagons.
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- Pronouns
- Ermaras
[X] Plan Talking with Dwarves
How would it be that much of a departure from the existing company doctrine though? They'd just be higher elevated and more armored platforms that Ironside's could shoot from over infantry from the backlines without dying or stopping shooting as soon as something like a dragon or hidden enemies penetrating the backlines came along. Hell, they could even just ram into enemy infantry formations and have the iron sides fire point blank. This isn't even a new idea, it's been used for a long while by the empire, frankly, now I just feel like I'm stating something obvious that could be implemented. I'm not saying that they should be permanent mounts for the Ironsides since war wagons obviously shouldn't be used in terrain like the Bugman liberation campaign. But on flatter terrain where the enemy has more mobile assets, having a mobile firing platform that can fire indefinitely even when being attacked by enemy cavalry could be invaluable. The war wagons could just be an optional mount for certain situations where they could be viable. It wouldn't even be that hard to train since they'd just be shooting from a stable platform.
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- Pronouns
- Warkeymon
Moving from a Company of ranked fire riflemen to small units on mobile platforms is a fairly significant difference. The Ironsides also aren't used to close range combat and don't have any personnel trained in the use of war wagons or what to do in the case of executing a charge, which they've never historically been part of. This is a company of infantrymen, any departure from standing still and shooting is significant.
The Wissenland has no history of the use of war wagons, the country is notably poor quality for smooth riding even on just horseback let alone on a mobile platform. The Imperial Gunnery School would likely be very interested in the idea of the creation of a war wagon company, but the expertise is not currently widespread in Nuln and certainly doesn't exist amongst the Ironsides in particular.
Fair enough, though would it still be possible to build open-top non-armored wagons drawn by mules to be stationed in the backlines so that Ironsides can fire from an elevated position above infantry? It'd just be the most basic of platforms that could be drawn by horse and stationed in a place. There's no need to separate the Ironsides into groups since the open-top wagons will be together, they won't be firing while moving nor do the crew need to trained for melee or charging enemies since they'll always be behind the lines, and they'll be easier to ride in rougher terrain since they'll be far smaller (the size of a regular wagon) and pulled by unarmoured mules instead of horses. Basically a Hussite wagon fort as shown below:
We use something like this anyway to carry supplies and troops right? Why not just use it as a deployable platform instead? A good 20 of these carrying 5 people each can be stationed behind an infantry line, giving a higher elevation to fire shoot from at a safe area instead of constantly repositioning to higher elevations or different firing angles and potentially getting exposed to enemy cavalry like regular hand gunners would be.
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- Pronouns
- Warkeymon
Fair enough, though would it still be possible to build open-top non-armored wagons drawn by mules to be stationed in the backlines so that Ironsides can fire from an elevated position above infantry? It'd just be the most basic of platforms that could be drawn by horse and stationed in a place. There's no need to separate the Ironsides into groups since the open-top wagons will be together, they won't be firing while moving nor do the crew need to trained for melee or charging enemies since they'll always be behind the lines, and they'll be easier to ride in rougher terrain since they'll be far smaller (the size of a regular wagon) and pulled by unarmoured mules instead of horses. Basically a Hussite wagon fort as shown below:
We use something like this anyway to carry supplies and troops right? Why not just use it as a deployable platform instead? A good 20 of these carrying 5 people each can be stationed behind an infantry line, giving a higher elevation to fire shoot from at a safe area instead of constantly repositioning to higher elevations or different firing angles and potentially getting exposed to enemy cavalry like regular hand gunners would be.
I have added the below option to Martial:
Modify the Company Wagons
An idea has been raised amongst some members of the Ironsides that modifying the logistics wagons could turn them into mobile pavises from which the handgunners can fire at a higher elevation and with higher protection. Have the logistics wagons retrofitted for this purpose.
Cost: 500 Marks, 500 Materials per Die
Required Effort: 0/200
This is an actual thing in WHF.
Empire War Wagon - Warhammer - The Old World - Lexicanum
- Location
- Poland
It's more that they are too much effort to do anything about without any real gain. Sure they are a bit of a pain but are confined to Nuln and are only a -5 while having a DC of 250 to even begin dealing with them. It's just not worth the effort at the moment.
think of the current wagons as proto war wagons. they serve as the foundation for the war wagons that are used later on.This is an actual thing in WHF.
Empire War Wagon - Warhammer - The Old World - Lexicanum
whfb.lexicanum.com
I say we give them concessions like recognizing them as an official cult so that they can be coerced into helping our intrigue against the vampires later on. I'm also open to increasing the rights of nuln industrial workers if we can negotiate for reasonable concessions, but I'm not willing to make the title of mayor into an elected position by the people. If the title of mayor were voted on by the masses, any vampire masquerading as an unlanded lord or a particularly rich merchant could potentially run for elections and win, thus compromising the city and making the foundations for further sabotage. That and the Ranaldins could take it as a sign that they could ask for more political concessions to the people, you know how the saying goes, "Give them an inch ad they'll take a mile".
- Location
- USA
For Ranaldians we might want to look into upping our intrigue score first and getting more agents in Nuln which will also help with future problems.