Ten Thousand Negates (A Yu-Gi-Oh! Quest)

[X] Condescension would be the least terrible response. Most of your peers see you as a novelty, at best, and a prize at worst that can somehow be 'won' if they beat you in a duel. Approaching from a position of weakness? Hell no. (Girl)

[X] A great machine, the last of twelve, armed to the teeth with advanced weaponry.
 
[X] Condescension would be the least terrible response. Most of your peers see you as a novelty, at best, and a prize at worst that can somehow be 'won' if they beat you in a duel. Approaching from a position of weakness? Hell no. (Girl)
[X] A young shrine maiden, bearing the spirit of a wrathful god.
I haven't seen this card. Though I have doubts that having the opponent activate monster cards on our turn is something we could take advantage of, BIG beat stick and reviving opponents monsters are interesting.
 
[X] They'd laugh in your face. Most of your peers are…maybe it's arrogant to say, but envious of you. You are the tall poppy. Everyone knows you're a skilled duelist and seeing you laid low would just make their days. (Boy)

Kind of tired of all the female duelist and want to give it a go as a guy.

[X]A monstrous beast, bearing the heads of three different creatures

I like the cut of his jib. The others kind of feel "meh".
 
[X] Condescension would be the least terrible response. Most of your peers see you as a novelty, at best, and a prize at worst that can somehow be 'won' if they beat you in a duel. Approaching from a position of weakness? Hell no. (Girl)
[X] A young shrine maiden, bearing the spirit of a wrathful god.

I'll revote, then, with that post clarifying how things will go.
Kind of tired of all the female duelist and want to give it a go as a guy.
It's a direct response to the YGO canon having precisely zero female duelists worth anything
 
Predictable, yes. Dunno about boring if it keeps going on. Maybe too frequent and nothing new.
 
I do think Kurikara Divincarnate's being a bit underestimated. It's a board breaker that also presents itself as an impactful game piece with its potentially high attack stat and ability to steal monsters out of your opponent's graveyard.
In theory but in testing unless you structure every deck we face around Karikara activating its pretty much useless and ends up being a worse kaiju.
 
Come on why are people picking Karikura litteraly every other option is nice and usable its the only one thats a main deck tool thats incredibly situational.
 
[X] Condescension would be the least terrible response. Most of your peers see you as a novelty, at best, and a prize at worst that can somehow be 'won' if they beat you in a duel. Approaching from a position of weakness? Hell no. (Girl)

[X] A young shrine maiden, bearing the spirit of a wrathful god.
 
Really why are people voting for Karikura?

Spite towards the competitive scene mostly. Many people, for some reason, hate good cards and will jump on any opportunity to play weaker cards and have them be viable. Our QM's guarantee that the quest will be run narratively, while nice from a storytelling perspective, has made it impossible to make mechanical arguments. There are a ton of really good reasons as to why the other cards are far, far better, but none of those arguments actually matter if the specific cards in the protagonist's deck have no bearing on whether they win or not. If things run like the anime, then playing like an anime character is fine actually.

A fair number of "Yu-Gi-Oh" fans also hate any summon mechanic that came out after 2007, and/or are unwilling to learn anything new.

Could also be that some of the voters just like how Divincarnate looks, but they'll be in the minority. She has a good aesthetic, but it doesn't outclass cards like Zeus and Baronne to a large degree. [EDIT: This is IMO, I have realized other people have different tastes. *shrug*.]

I guess we could make arguments about how Kurikara would be bad for the narrative... Which she actually might. The problem with Divincarnate is she's very useful against one specific kind of deck (ones that set up a bunch of monsters with costless disruption abilities). She's completely useless against many common deck styles (backrow, monsters with passive or lingering effects, going second decks in general).

She's either a complete blowout, or does nothing. That vastly decreases the number of available options the QM will have when writing. The dichotomy between "Kurikara wins instantly" and "My best monster is useless" would get old quickly. Unless our "ace" monster is relegated to a once-in-a-while type of thing, which I would be fine with. A deck has more then one card after all.
 
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[X] Condescension would be the least terrible response. Most of your peers see you as a novelty, at best, and a prize at worst that can somehow be 'won' if they beat you in a duel. Approaching from a position of weakness? Hell no. (Girl)

[X] A young shrine maiden, bearing the spirit of a wrathful god.
 
Are we really going with a monster who is 1. Not a actual boss monster 2. Is completely useless in most matches 3. and if it is useful just OTKs? Its also something we would need to draw into where as every other option is a extra deck option.
 
I voted for it because I liked the Asthetics, changed because it was not mechanically good, but it was then clarified that the mechanics do not apply and it is based on rolls, so I changed back for the original reason I voted for it.
 
That is what I was worried about. @Flintlock, could you clarify on how the duels will work? Because making the entire system rolls based seems to me like it would completely disincentivise any reason to actually pick up new cards and strategize.

A mishmash of random cards would be equally as strong as a meta competetive deck if a duel's outcome was completely luck based, no?
 
Dueling Mechanics
That is what I was worried about. @Flintlock, could you clarify on how the duels will work? Because making the entire system rolls based seems to me like it would completely disincentivise any reason to actually pick up new cards and strategize.

A mishmash of random cards would be equally as strong as a meta competetive deck if a duel's outcome was completely luck based, no?

As it stands, here is how dueling will be happening:

There are four 'Personal' stats tied to the character, representing a character's unique strengths. These stats will remain somewhat stable, increasing slowly based on explicit circumstances. Those stats are:

Knowledge (Accounts for preparation, ability to apply rulings and knowledge of what an opponent will do)
Talent (Accounts for on the fly thinking/intuition, as well the ability to follow through with your own combo line)
Guile (Accounts for trickery, mind games, and generally being able to manipulate what the opponent is thinking)
Drive (Accounts for persistence and ability to power through adversity, as well as resilience vs the supernatural)

These stats are supplemented by a fifth, more volatile stat:

Mastery (The nebulous anime zone where skill is luck is skill, affected by your 'skill as a duelist' as well as your relationship with the spirits of the monsters in your deck)

At the start of the duel, 1D10 is rolled for each personal stat. Mastery + the two personal stats with the highest rolls are added together. The higher roll starts with the advantage and is allowed to make the first Argument; a set of circumstances that strongly favour that character, whether that's putting their big boss monster on the field, or a nasty floodgate or what have you. Alternatively, the winner can choose to make no argument. If so, the opponent must make an Argument and cannot pass priority.

NOTE: Arguments are NOT explicit, long form plans, but rather general themes. They will be issued in the form of relatively short statements that explain the basic thrust of the play and why it'll result in victory. Arguments do not need to be good, nor even necessarily true (I'll be providing examples during the first couple duels).

The MC's arguments will be elected by the players (I'll naturally be providing examples as part of the vote).

Once an argument is presented, the opposing duelist has the opportunity to make a Rebuttal; a similar 'statement' to an argument that contradicts the original argument as a win condition. The success of a rebuttal is determined by a roll of 1D10 + the stat that would be relevant in being successful (Mastery for drawing a specific card, Knowledge for using an edge case in ruling, Guile for manipulating the opponent, etc). An argument will have a difficulty check based on the strength of the board in context (i.e. how easily a character can turn the tables using the resources they have). A rebuttal that is more likely to succeed will receive a bonus. A rebuttal that requires exception luck skill to pull off will inflict a Mastery penalty for the rest of the duel.

The MC's Rebuttals will also be elected by the players. I will be pre-rolling all stats. If there's at least one roll that will contextually be successful, I'll present options around those stats. If there are no successful rebuttals available, I'll present options for how you'd like the MC to go down swinging.

If a character defeats their opponent's argument, they gain the advantage (i.e. can choose to make an argument or force the opponent to) and the opponent takes a penalty to their Mastery stat for the remainder of the duel based on the resources they used up and/or how foolish they look. Note that some rebuttals may constitute an argument in and of themselves.

If a duelist is unable to defeat their opponent's argument or if any of their stats are reduced to zero by any means, they lose. If a character's mastery is reduced to zero, their opponent makes a closing argument that is automatically victorious.

Please note that a Yugioh equivalent of the Chunky Salsa rule is in place. If your opponent is allowed to put you in a position that's literally impossible for you to counter, you're losing, no matter how good your stats are.

Well, unless you manage to convince your opponent to throw.

If you have any criticisms of/opinions on the above system, please share them.
 
Vote closed
Scheduled vote count started by Flintlock on Sep 7, 2022 at 6:12 AM, finished with 69 posts and 41 votes.
 
I like it. These rules
An argument will have a difficulty check based on the strength of the board in context (i.e. how easily a character can turn the tables using the resources they have).
Please note that a Yugioh equivalent of the Chunky Salsa rule is in place. If your opponent is allowed to put you in a position that's literally impossible for you to counter, you're losing, no matter how good your stats are.
still incentivize collecting new cards and deck building and the "Rebuttal" and Argument" systems will hopefully give the QM enough flexibility to write entertaining duels while still letting the players strategize.

The one small concern I have is that there doesn't really seem to be much mechanical benefit to making an "Argument" as opposed to a "Rebuttal". A Rebuttal still gets to choose what stat they get to use, and they also gain the ability to slowly degrade the opponent's mastery. While making an Argument gives you the chance to insta-win, it doesn't seem likely that you'd would be able to do that unless the opponent rolls really badly and/or you severely outclass them since the opponent would also be able to use their highest rolls consistently.

You also mentioned
or if any of their stats are reduced to zero by any means, they lose.
this, but didn't really state how this could happen aside from how Mastery could be reduced to zero.

Also, will Traits still be a thing?

EDIT: I'm going to guess that probably means Destiny Draws/Heart of the Cards are mostly covered by making an Argument or a Rebuttal that uses up Mastery to draw the card needed for one last ditch effort to win rather than their own separate mechanic? Though, I'm not sure how you could actually use that as a comeback mechanic since Mastery also doubles as a healthbar. By the time you're about to lose, wouldn't you be so low on Mastery that you wouldn't be able to pay the cost to draw what you need?
 
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[Pilot - Fourth of Six (2)] Character Creation 2
Should've been done way earlier, but was out all day today.

Just glanced around this and the use of rebuttals and arguments make it seem more fitting for an ace attorney quest.

It's wording I've seen used to describe fight scenes before, and I feel like it especially fits the frequently very 'take turns putting up boards/breaking them' way that duels occurs in the anime.

The one small concern I have is that there doesn't really seem to be much mechanical benefit to making an "Argument" as opposed to a "Rebuttal". A Rebuttal still gets to choose what stat they get to use, and they also gain the ability to slowly degrade the opponent's mastery. While making an Argument gives you the chance to insta-win, it doesn't seem likely that you'd would be able to do that unless the opponent rolls really badly and/or you severely outclass them since the opponent would also be able to use their highest rolls consistently.

You also mentioned

this, but didn't really state how this could happen aside from how Mastery could be reduced to zero.

Also, will Traits still be a thing?

EDIT: I'm going to guess that probably means Destiny Draws/Heart of the Cards are mostly covered by making an Argument or a Rebuttal that uses up Mastery to draw the card needed for one last ditch effort to win rather than their own separate mechanic? Though, I'm not sure how you could actually use that as a comeback mechanic since Mastery also doubles as a healthbar. By the time you're about to lose, wouldn't you be so low on Mastery that you wouldn't be able to pay the cost to draw what you need?

As the MC gets stronger/has to deal with stronger duelists, there will be additional rules I'll be elaborating on, but I think you might be underestimating how much pain you can potentially put your opponent through when given the opportunity to set-up a board. As an extreme example:

- Number 86: Heroic Champion Rhongonymiad (with 5 XYZ Materials)
- Naturia Bamboo Shoot (tribute summoned using a Naturia monster)
- Dark Simorgh

Your opponent is unable to normal/special summon monsters, activate spells/traps or set cards.

As a bottom level duelist, without something like Ash Blossom in your deck that can explicitly interrupt your opponent on their turn, you have no natural defense against getting styled on like that. That'll come with time (and executing such combos will have their own restrictions once that sort of complexity becomes relevant).

Penalties to other stats are derived from external factors. For example, a Shadow Duel may sap your Drive with every exchange (which is how I would probably interpret the ending of Joey vs Marik in this system).

Traits will probably be a thing, but not to start with.

You're correct regarding a destiny draw. Functionally, in this system, a destiny draw would just be a normal rebuttal, but with a heavy mastery penalty. Though it might be more appropriate to say that every draw is a destiny draw.

x X x X x​

"Justice must be served. The blade must be wielded, and the dragon focused."

It has a wielder.

"Does it? How can I be considered its wielder, trapped within this prison as I am? It should be held by one able to deliver its verdicts."

That shall not remain the truth.

"My fate is clear; escape is impossible."

A lie.

A second one.

"Oh?"

Your intentions are ill-masked.

"I should not think they were masked at all. I desire freedom. From both my fates."

This one shall grant one. The other is one of your own making.

"The justice I pursued is complete. She desires a new justice, so she should wield the blade."

An arrangement that is lesser.

"Lesser? Unbound, my power remains great. Unassisted, she is without worth."

Worth.

Worth is relative. Within the rules of this world, this one's worth is evident.


CHOOSE ONE

(Stat Array; if a stat is voted as both strength and weakness, the side with the higher vote will take priority)

[] Balanced (6/6/5/4) - 2 Strengths / 1 Weakness
[] Equilibrium (7/5/5/4) - 1 Strength / 1 Weakness
[] Lopsided (7/6/4/4) - 2 Strengths / 2 Weaknesses
[] Specialist (8/5/4/4) 1 Strength / 2 Weaknesses

CHOOSE ANY

[] Strength: Knowledge
[] Strength: Talent
[] Strength: Guile
[] Strength: Drive

CHOOSE ANY

[] Weakness: Knowledge
[] Weakness: Talent
[] Weakness: Guile
[] Weakness: Drive

But more so than that…

This one will seek justice, with blade or without.

Unshackled, you will seek naught but your own ends.

"...A claim without proof."

Your hesitation is proof enough.

"You would condemn me so readily?"

This is no mortal court. Your salvation lay in convincing this one to take up your burden. That power lies with this one.

"Feh. 'Natural justice'."

It is the way of the world.

"Nothing has changed. I still remain bound. If you want justice, there must be a wielder able to act."

There shall be a wielder.

"So does that mean
—"

This one shall not wield the blade.

This one shall wield you.


x X x X x​

There's something just inexplicably depressing about the old stadium.

Actually, scratch that, it's very explicable. It's a big concrete eyesore in the place of something that should inspire awe and/or joy, bereft of ornamentation and befouled by thirty years of smog. Like everything else in the districts, it was made to satisfy a checklist and has been barely maintained since it was made. Even today, surrounded by a sea of people, it looms with a dampening gravitas.

Speaking of which…Why is this a sea? It should be a river. Why is nobody moving?

The crowd isn't exactly packed tight, but it is…lethargic, you would describe it? People grumble quietly about the hold up at the edges, but activity seems to deaden the closer you get to the centre. It quickly becomes clear that you don't have the body mass to bully your way through this.

It's time for your little parlour trick.

Prickle.

Your spirit flares. You step forward and heads turn. Worried faces peer back at you as their owners shift to give you space.

It's not actual mentalism. You aren't actively manipulating anyone when you do this. The people around you are simply reacting to stimuli they can only perceive subconsciously. They can tell you're a dangerous one, and it manifests as a sourceless sense of fear. Within your own senses, it manifests as almost like a crackling fire. Above it, you can just about make out a keening whine, deep within your soul. Though you can't identify any operative effects on yourself, it is enough to unnerve. You ignore that feeling. You spent all of yesterday off your game, you're not going to let something like that stop you today. Soon enough, you reach the front of the crowd.

Four stand guard in front of the stadium.

You recognise the garb of three of them. Same style as robes worn by the examiners in the past, best you can remember. But they aren't the normal plain black. Those colours, set alongside each other?

It's not exactly difficult to figure out what's going on.

Fiery red and orange. The Crimson Palace Academy.

Black and white, lined with gold. The F.W. Military Academy.

Purple and black, with a faint lightning bolt motif. The Academy of the Welkin Lords.

The fourth…wears a long black duster over a white shirt and black pants.
Incongruous, to say the least, but the brass badge pinned to his lapel aligns him with the Gaian Heritor Academy.

The four great schools.

The four great schools are performing the examination here.

It's…surreal. You wouldn't dare assume it was fake; nobody could possibly be stupid enough to attempt such an impersonation, but it's just…

Why?

Out here, in the middle of woop woop?

It's…

Well.

It quickly becomes clear that there's a story here, of which you are only glimpsing the edges. That much is obvious from first glance.

Crimson and F.W. are represented by two more or less dignified older men who you wouldn't have looked twice at if they'd been normal examiners, but it's pretty clear that the other two are far from the standard administrative types.

As people are wont to remind you, frequently and without provocation, women rarely become duelists, and even more rarely one of any note. A woman that achieves such a position almost inevitably ends up a bombshell, and the Welkin Lord examiner is no exception. Though most of her body is hidden beneath the heavy robes, the long blonde hair and porcelain skin imply the woman is a high enough level to have influence over her own body, albeit perhaps marred by her severe expression.

The man from G.H.A is…definitely an unusual looking sort, though you've definitely seen stranger in the exhibition duels you've caught. Tall and wiry, with long red hair and a mild tan that speaks of someone frequently out in the sun. He slouches against the wall, speaking with a casual familiarity to the Welkin examiner, as the other two look on with clear apprehension.

"—surely there has to be a better way to do whatever it is you're trying to do here, rather than hijacking this exam," he drawls, "The kids out there sure as heck won't be happy when this all blows over."

"We are doing them a favour," she answers, without a trace of irony, "Anyone worthy of entering will see the attention they would otherwise need to spend years attracting, and the others will be disabused of their beliefs that they are anything but small fish in a smaller pond."

The man rolls his eyes.

"You say that like the people here couldn't make something of them—'scuse me, are you waiting for an invitation, girl?"

It suddenly becomes apparent that he's addressing you.

"Ah, I'm sorry, is there a reason nobody else is going in?" you ask.

He makes a show of looking around.

"I don't know. Door's been open the past twenty minutes. Hey, Professor, how about you let everyone know it's time to enter?"

The Welkin examiner shoots him an annoyed look, before raising her voice to echo over the crowd.

"Any of you lot interested in taking part in the tournament exam?"

Her intent washes over you, now fully unveiled. A sort of tingling sense of portent, almost like looking up at dark clouds, but rather than lightning, it promises impending violence.

Those closest to the stadium try to step back, pressing into the crowd behind them. Some try to make a break for it, pushing desperately through the crowd. Some further back are struck by the same loss of nerve. The rest remain as they are. Thankfully, it somehow doesn't turn into a stampede.

The man from G.H.A looks back towards you with a wink.

"Guess not. Now, if you'll go inside..."

Right, probably shouldn't test the examiners' patience.

You step past the door.

And into another world.

Reflexively, you shield your eyes against the harsh light, as concrete turns to sand beneath your feet. As your eyes adjust, you find yourself transported back in time…You think? Though you stand upon an arena plucked straight out of an era long past, surrounded by empty, stone stands, artificial light streams down from on high, painting everything in orange hues.

You just stand there for a moment, taking it all in.

You knew this was possible. In fact, you're vaguely aware of a card that looks exactly like this one. It's another thing entirely to see it for yourself.

To your side, there's an anachronistic little table. Upon it, a painfully mundane pen and clipboard, with a list of names scrawled on it.

WRITE-IN

[] Suggest a name.
 
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