Long as we keep on summoning back at home base with a Lya or two for maximised efficiency, you'll find no complaints from me.

Less efficient surely, but at least very "Red Dragon" as a problem-solving when the "sensible" approach of industrialized summonjng and blood sacrifice fails.
Mjnd, I just don't think we can bag all the bodies there before staying there becomes too much of a hassle, that is all.
I'm just beyond all reasonable wrath about this and have entered the serene clarity that comes with the realization that I no longer care about any particular obstacle here anymore.

First the CoS threatened our invasion planning.
Then they turned out too powerful to fight conventionally, interrupting our shedule further, so we cooked up this plan to commit a spot of genocide to power a different genocide.
And now someone poked a hole into the bendystraw we rammed into the Abyss, derailing our schedule yet again.

I don't care if this is the work of gods, demons, nature itself or some ancient Valyrian failsafe.
What I do care about is turning everything within 50 klicks of the problem into finely ground volcanic ash and repeating this process until the problems are all gone.
 
  1. I get this but I think that the logistics of summoning on this scale and the dangers thereof deserve to be investigated at least briefly. It also a allows me to foreshadow some stuff for the major summoning. Having a major attack there without any issues previously just feels random to me.
  2. You can actually use divination to help with this but since it is the sort of thing that takes skill checks it's not going to be solved instantly by it
Is there any point in wearing a fucking Mindblank?

I'm done. Have fun. I'm checking out for this turn. Call me when I'm needed for something.
 
I'm just beyond all reasonable wrath about this and have entered the serene clarity that comes with the realization that I no longer care about any particular obstacle here anymore.

First the CoS threatened our invasion planning.
Then they turned out too powerful to fight conventionally, interrupting our shedule further, so we cooked up this plan to commit a spot of genocide to power a different genocide.
And now someone poked a hole into the bendystraw we rammed into the Abyss, derailing our schedule yet again.

I don't care if this is the work of gods, demons, nature itself or some ancient Valyrian failsafe.
What I do care about is turning everything within 50 klicks of the problem into finely ground volcanic ash and repeating this process until the problems are all gone.
I'm feeling the same frustration. I want everything remotely involved in this strung up and offered up to the gods in bloody sacrifice. Maybe we can have a bidding war for which god gets the most annoying sacrifice.
 
Is there any point in wearing a fucking Mindblank?

I'm done. Have fun. I'm checking out for this turn. Call me when I'm needed for something.

It's not a matter of you guys being divined...

*sigh*

Why do people always assume I'm GMing badly and falling back on 'the enemy saw you'?

This is really frustrating sometimes. I'm trying to foreshadow worldbuilding and all I get is accusations of not playing fair.

I am a little angry and a lot saddened right now.
 
Ah, and here's the salt.
Thinking we'd have one turn without it was premature, it seems :V
 
Keep in mind that it's the 8th day of the month, y'all. This dedicated background Summoning has been going on since the 1st. Eight days of non-stop Summoning could have attracted unwanted attention, or what we're seeing may not be enemy action at all, but the results of weird Planar shenanigans interacting with Brimorak juice.

We can find out a bit more before working out a solution.
 
It's not a matter of you guys being divined...

*sigh*

Why do people always assume I'm GMing badly and falling back on 'the enemy saw you'?

This is really frustrating sometimes. I'm trying to foreshadow worldbuilding and all I get is accusations of not playing fair.

I am a little angry and a lot saddened right now.
Because you aren't foreshadowing anything, my dude, and this isn't bad faith direction, it's just that I can't comprehend what you're doing. I will admit, you have an idea in mind for how you want things to go, but your staging of events weighed against the preparations of the players is lacking.

Is a little honest criticism too much?
 
I think this is getting out of hand for no reason I can see. We basically win at everything ever, sometimes we get curveballs, it happens. We don't even know what this is yet so getting upset at the DP is a little premature.

If the vote doesn't excite one can just not be involved this time. Its that simple.

For all we know we are going to find out Legions of Heaven still exist fighting a war against Demons on another plane and likes planting bombs in Demons and it just happened to blow up randomly in one of our summonings.
 
I think this is getting out of hand for no reason I can see. We basically win at everything ever, sometimes we get curveballs, it happens. We don't even know what this is yet so getting upset at the DP is a little premature.

If the vote doesn't excite one can just not be involved this time. Its that simple.

For all we know we are going to find out Legions of Heaven still exist fighting a war against Demons on another plane and likes planting bombs in Demons and it just happened to blow up randomly in one of our summonings.
The thing that frustrates me is it almost doesn't matter how much we prepare, there's always a snag that seems ultimately minor, yet is basically the equivalent of shoving a wrench into a turbine of the entire action. We can't move forward because we have one point of failure, yet we didn't perceive it to be a point of failure before BECAUSE IT NEVER WAS AT ANY POINT, and there was no build up beforehand toward it being so, and it's happening just before it would have been relevant since we never needed mass summoning before now.
 
You know, I'm tired of salt.
Justified or not. Percieved or legitimate.

It is cyclical around here, and we don't have enough active people to even have interesting arguments about stuff anymore.

See y'all tomorrow.
If there's anything I learned learned around here in the years I played, is that arguing over shit overnight solves zilch.
 
The thing that frustrates me is it almost doesn't matter how much we prepare, there's always a snag that seems ultimately minor, yet is basically the equivalent of shoving a wrench into a turbine of the entire action. We can't move forward because we have one point of failure, yet we didn't perceive it to be a point of failure before BECAUSE IT NEVER WAS AT ANY POINT, and there was no build up beforehand toward it being so, and it's happening just before it would have been relevant since we never needed mass summoning before now.

Well, there is preparation, but the world still exists. Even with preparation shit can happen. As someone pointed out this is the 8th day in a row of mass summoning. We have not been doing that intense style of summoning before. It is not to me that unreasonable that all our preparations that have worked fine for our one day of summoning hits a snag when we do 8 in a row and grabs someones attention.

Because you aren't foreshadowing anything, my dude, and this isn't bad faith direction, it's just that I can't comprehend what you're doing. I will admit, you have an idea in mind for how you want things to go, but your staging of events weighed against the preparations of the players is lacking.

Is a little honest criticism too much?

Honest Criticism I don't think DP or anyone else minds too much, the previous comment though was -

Is there any point in wearing a fucking Mindblank?

I'm done. Have fun. I'm checking out for this turn. Call me when I'm needed for something.

This seems a bit off for honest criticism. Reiterate again we don't even know what this is. Think salt could wait until we see what DP has built on this instead of divining on what he is doing with it.
 
Because you aren't foreshadowing anything, my dude, and this isn't bad faith direction, it's just that I can't comprehend what you're doing. I will admit, you have an idea in mind for how you want things to go, but your staging of events weighed against the preparations of the players is lacking.

Is a little honest criticism too much?

Well yeah, it's not worldbuilding yet, the point is that the solution to this is going to reveal some answers about how the planes work. Not the sort of answers that hit a wall and make all your preparations moot, but you know actually expanding on how summoning and the plaens work since you guys decided to go with mass blood sacrifice for your war. I'm trying to make this feel like an actual part of the world and the lore you interact with not just a button that gets mashed in the background and part of that involves minor setbacks.

That said no criticism is not bad, if this is bad presentation by all means call me out, but just please don't jump the gun.

You know what I'm making the next update tonight. Never mind the vote. I'll cover all the stuff that is supposed to be covered in the world-building and then you guys don't have to speculate overnight.
 
You know what I'm making the next update tonight. Never mind the vote. I'll cover all the stuff that is supposed to be covered in the world-building and then you guys don't have to speculate overnight.

Your worldbuilding is the bomb, like literally blows me away. You do you. Never gonna complain about some more worldbuilding.
 
@DragonParadox, I could give you a page or two of detailed analysis about why people are annoyed at this, but unless you want to have that I'll not add to the complaint pile by writing it unprompted.

What I do want to say and point out though, which is a repeated core problem, is that you "tell" all your world building. Just having a character recite it IC doesn't make it "show". This is compounded by you being almost deadly afraid of secrets or subtext that exist for the reader to figure out instead of having characters shout it from the rooftops at the slightest prompting.

Whatever you cooked up, I'm certain that Lya will now proceed to narrate it at us. And given that this action just experienced a full stop, there's not really a way around that other then just failing our plan. But like this, the world building does not arrive organically, but as an interruption that feels like an informical. The pacing of the action and the overall narrative has ground to a complete halt here and we as players have no agency, but must comply with the mandatory cutscene instead of having the chance to figure something out on our own or intentionally shining the spotlight on it.
 
@DragonParadox, I could give you a page or two of detailed analysis about why people are annoyed at this, but unless you want to have that I'll not add to the complaint pile by writing it unprompted.

What I do want to say and point out though, which is a repeated core problem, is that you "tell" all your world building. Just having a character recite it IC doesn't make it "show". This is compounded by you being almost deadly afraid of secrets or subtext that exist for the reader to figure out instead of having characters shout it from the rooftops at the slightest prompting.

Whatever you cooked up, I'm certain that Lya will now proceed to narrate it at us. And given that this action just experienced a full stop, there's not really a way around that other then just failing our plan. But like this, the world building does not arrive organically, but as an interruption that feels like an informical. The pacing of the action and the overall narrative has ground to a complete halt here and we as players have no agency, but must comply with the mandatory cutscene instead of having the chance to figure something out on our own or intentionally shining the spotlight on it.
YES. This is why I was frustrated, I was just incapable of articulating it that concisely.
 
@DragonParadox, I could give you a page or two of detailed analysis about why people are annoyed at this, but unless you want to have that I'll not add to the complaint pile by writing it unprompted.

What I do want to say and point out though, which is a repeated core problem, is that you "tell" all your world building. Just having a character recite it IC doesn't make it "show". This is compounded by you being almost deadly afraid of secrets or subtext that exist for the reader to figure out instead of having characters shout it from the rooftops at the slightest prompting.

Whatever you cooked up, I'm certain that Lya will now proceed to narrate it at us. And given that this action just experienced a full stop, there's not really a way around that other then just failing our plan. But like this, the world building does not arrive organically, but as an interruption that feels like an informical. The pacing of the action and the overall narrative has ground to a complete halt here and we as players have no agency, but must comply with the mandatory cutscene instead of having the chance to figure something out on our own or intentionally shining the spotlight on it.

Minor spoiler the 'grind to a halt part' is not going to happen but all the rest... yeah I need to work on delivery, sorry about this guys.
 
Part MMMDCLXXI: Those that Skitter
Those that Skitter

Eight Day of the Third Month 294 AC

Time warps and halts at your command. The tanar'ri are not dying a True Death, the world is not so kind as to grant you that, but they are being consumed for there are evils in the heart of the Abyss older than the sins of men that gestate into Demonkind, parasites of the soul reduced from mighty tyrants of yore. Nameless they are to all but the most depraved or the most ambitious of conjurers, forgotten almost even by the dream for the revulsion of their being, but of the tomes Lya has read they are not misplaced... qlippoth.

"They are parasites," Lya proclaims, barely above a whisper. "We did not call them, but they were already feeding on the demons. They ate it from the inside the moment it became stone, unable to defend itself." Here yet not, feasting at the bleeding edge of realities between the Spheres. It is your own demiplane that allowed them to remain unseen by the sharp eyes of erinyes and watcher-creatures. You almost wished they stayed that way, after speaking the wish as Lya asked you to.

A thognorok is a uniquely hideous thing even besides all the ugliness you have ever witnessed, twitching like a spider, pulsing like cancerous flesh, always hungry, always feeding.


One of the mages dry heaves as he averts his eyes. You cannot blame him, even the brief glimpse of the thing before it was sealed in a vial was enough to make you wonder if the Abyss touched some deep wound to madness deeper still.

"How many demons have we summoned so far?" you ask his slightly more strong stomached companion.

"Eight hundred and twelve... er, eleven now, Your Grace," the sorceress replies.

"One in eight hundred is not statistically relevant," Lya notes clinically. "But we are going to need a way to pull them fully into the demiplane to deal with them that isn't wishcraft. I'd like to study the ability, but..."

"This is not the time," you finish firmly. It might not even be relevant outside a demiplane. The concept of forming a pseudo-ethereal realm is admittedly fascinating, but the thought of dealing with an entirely new sort of foe, one that feeds on demons, is not pleasant.

Qlippoth Research Unlocked

Layered Demiplane research unlocked


"Have you considered simply leaving the statues in the acid a few moments more, my lord?" Mereth interjects. "I doubt such creatures as would parasitize a lesser tanar'ri have the wit to wait to devour the whole of their host until they are out of immediate danger."

Specifically calling another infected demon takes much of the rest of the day's study and reading from Lya, but once you manage it Mereth's words prove true. All you have to do is not pull the petrified demons from the ooze instantly and their passengers will destroy themselves in the moment of their gruesome feast.

What next?

[] Write in

OOC: And here we go, I got some low rolls for summoning and thought, 'this is the chance to introduce some more about how the Abyss works' as well as the way artificial planes imitate real ones. The idea was to have more fresh research projects for next month. Looking back @Azel and @Crake are right, I definitely could have introduced it better.
 
Last edited:
Minor spoiler the 'grind to a halt part' is not going to happen but all the rest... yeah I need to work on delivery, sorry about this guys.
For all we know every 10th Demon going pop is part of a ritual to smite us out of existence so ignoring it would be extremely reckless. We can't read your mind and you have provided us with next to zero information about this phenomenon except that it happens, so we are completely incapable of assessing the potential risks of any course of action that is not "stop" or "investigate".

And you know this quite well, since you called the information that we could indeed just carry on a spoiler. But if the information that it is not a complete stop is something you know is not apparent to the players, why would expect us to not react as if it was the case? The long term outcome of a chain of events is irrelevant to the feelings about the events in the moment that they happen and those depend entirely on the information available and what can be extrapolated from it, not hidden information that is impossible to know.

If you miss your flight to a long anticipated vacation, you will be royally pissed about that. When that very flight later crashes and you survive by virtue of not being on it, you will obviously be happy and relieved, but that does not change the emotions you had previously. Missing the flight is a very bad thing in the moment it occurs, since the knowledge that the ultimately consequences are positive is not available and neither can it be inferred from available information.
 
For all we know every 10th Demon going pop is part of a ritual to smite us out of existence so ignoring it would be extremely reckless. We can't read your mind and you have provided us with next to zero information about this phenomenon except that it happens, so we are completely incapable of assessing the potential risks of any course of action that is not "stop" or "investigate".

And you know this quite well, since you called the information that we could indeed just carry on a spoiler. But if the information that it is not a complete stop is something you know is not apparent to the players, why would expect us to not react as if it was the case? The long term outcome of a chain of events is irrelevant to the feelings about the events in the moment that they happen and those depend entirely on the information available and what can be extrapolated from it, not hidden information that is impossible to know.

If you miss your flight to a long anticipated vacation, you will be royally pissed about that. When that very flight later crashes and you survive by virtue of not being on it, you will obviously be happy and relieved, but that does not change the emotions you had previously. Missing the flight is a very bad thing in the moment it occurs, since the knowledge that the ultimately consequences are positive is not available and neither can it be inferred from available information.

It's actually every 800th demon and it has to do with how demons work, see above. I wanted to introduce some chaos to the plane defined by it as well as get to use the horror that are Qlippoths without introducing a new evil faction to worry about. They are just demon parasites, but some of them can be quite powerful so they are a potential danger to summoners proportional to the demons you summon.
 
Those that Skitter

Eight Day of the Third Month 294 AC

Time warps and halts at your command. The tanar'ri are not dying a True Death, the world is not so kind as to grant you that, but they are being consumed for there are evils in the heart of the Abyss older than the sins of men that gestate into Daemonkind, parasites of the soul reduced from mighty tyrants of yore. Nameless they are to all but the most depraved or the most ambitious of conjurers, forgotten almost even by the dream for the revulsion of their being, but of the tomes Lya has read they are not misplaced... Qlippoth.

"They are parasites," Lya proclaims, barely above a whisper. "We did not call them but they were already feeding on the demons. They ate it from the inside the moment it became stone, unable to defend itself." Here yet not, feasting at the bleeding edge of realities between the spheres. It is your own demiplane that allowed them to remain unseen by the sharp eyes of Erinyes and watcher-creatures. You almost wished they stayed that way, after speaking the wish as Lya asked you to.

A Thognorok is a uniquely hideous thing even besides all the ugliness you have ever witnessed, twitching like a spider, pulsing like cancerous flesh, always hungry, always feeding.


One of the mages dry heaves as he averts his eyes. You cannot blame him, even the brief glimpse of the thing before it was sealed in a vial was enough to make you wonder if the Abyss touched some deep wound to Madness deeper still.

"How many demons have we summoned so far?" you ask his slightly more strong stomached companion.

"Eight hundred and twelve... er, eleven now, Your Grace," the sorceress replies.

"One in eight hundred is not statistically relevant," Lya notes clinically, "But we are going to need a way to pull them fully into the demiplane to deal with them that isn't wishcraft. I'd like to study the ability, but..."

"This is not the time," you finish, firmly. It might not even be relevant outside a demiplane. The concept of forming a pseudo-ethereal realm is admittedly fascinating, but the thought of dealing with and entirely new sort of foe, one that feeds on demons is not pleasant.

Qlippoth Research Unlocked

Layered Demiplane research unlocked


"Have you considered simply leaving the statues in the acid a few moments more, my lord?" Mereth interjects. "I doubt such creatures as would parazitize a lesser tanar'ri have the wit to wait to devour the whole of their host until they are out of immediate danger."

Specifically calling another infected demon takes much of the rest of the day's study and reading from Lya, but once you manage it Mereth's words prove true. All you have to do is not pull the petrified demons from the ooze instantly and their passengers will destroy themselves in the moment of their gruesome feast.

What next?

[] Write in

OOC: And here we go, I got some low rolls for summoning and thought, 'this is the chance to introduce some more about how the Abyss works' as well as the way artificial planes imitate real ones. The idea was to have more fresh research projects for next month. Looking back @Azel and @Crake are right I definitely could have introduced it better. Not yet edited
Here's an edited version of the chapter, @DragonParadox.

Qlippoths! I had completely ruled them out as being part of our cosmology. Very neat way to introduce them, too, DP. What's worse than being a Demon? Being a Demon with Qlippoth cooties.
 
It's actually every 800th demon and it has to do with how demons work, see above. I wanted to introduce some chaos to the plane defined by it as well as get to use the horror that are Qlippoths without introducing a new evil faction to worry about. They are just demon parasites, but some of them can be quite powerful so they are a potential danger to summoners proportional to the demons you summon.
See above.

Was this information available to us the chapter before? No.
Can it then influence our reaction to the last chapter? No.

It would have been a lot better to supply the information that it is a rare random chance up front, say by having one of the statues spontaneously destroying itself after it was already made ready for storage. Then other summonings would have already occurred, making it clear that the effect is random and the report could have already included that this wasn't the 8th demon, but the 800th. That also means it would have been a strange event reported by regular grunts for the higher ups to investigate, thus removing the contrived feeling serendipity of things happening only when a PC is watching it. (I'm aware that you misread part of the vote here and thought Viserys was doing the summoning already, but this is also a reoccuring thing, so I feel the need to point it out here.)
 
See above.

Was this information available to us the chapter before? No.
Can it then influence our reaction to the last chapter? No.

It would have been a lot better to supply the information that it is a rare random chance up front, say by having one of the statues spontaneously destroying itself after it was already made ready for storage. Then other summonings would have already occurred, making it clear that the effect is random and the report could have already included that this wasn't the 8th demon, but the 800th. That also means it would have been a strange event reported by regular grunts for the higher ups to investigate, thus removing the contrived feeling serendipity of things happening only when a PC is watching it. (I'm aware that you misread part of the vote here and thought Viserys was doing the summoning already, but this is also a reoccuring thing, so I feel the need to point it out here.)

Fair points all. I'll avoid leaving stuff on break points that could create artificial drama from now on.
 
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