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A Sword Without a Hilt: A Song of Ice and Fire/D&D 3.5 Crossover

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DragonParadox said:
Was the vote too open ended? I figured it would be best to let you guys ask the questions so I don't miss anything, but if you want me to cover it I can.
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It is kind of open ended. I would have mentioned something earlier, but I got distracted IRL.

How's this?

[X] Ask Ryelle to tell us all she knows of the cult, sparing no details. The smallest clue could be of vital importance. Including, but not limited to:
-[X] Structure of the Green Cult
-[X] All individuals of note within or closely allied to the cult, including men and "ascended beings" (pay special attention to the prophet leading them, where he came from, and what his powers are)
-[X] Doctrines and rituals of the cult
-[X] Known or perceived goals of the cult
-[X] Places important to the cult
-[X] Enemies of the cult
 
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TalonofAnathrax said:
It would have been nice to have some of the other type of "inhuman PoV" stopes, like focusing on weird details to identify people, use of an extra sense mortals don't have, or avoiding using names and instead using weird identifiers for other characters. But many of the common "inhuman PoV" tropes don't work here (failure to understand basic concepts or the importance of random details to humans, etc) because Xor knows his way around the human mind quite well.
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Xor: "My goodness, you're looking radiant today!"

Rhaella: "Ah, you flatter me, Wisdom Xor."

Xor: "No, no, I speak only the truth. And I cannot help but notice that your presence in the Plaidforce is especially deep as well. Have you been gazing into eternity more frequently?"

Rhaella: ???
 
@Goldfish, please include the following:

-[] Structure of the Green Cult
-[] All individuals of note within or closely allied to the cult, including men and "ascended beings" (pay special attention to the prophet leading them, where he came from, and what his powers are)
-[] Doctrines and rituals of the cult
-[] Known or perceived goals of the cult
-[] Places important to the cult
-[] Enemies of the cult

[X] Goldfish
 
Duesal said:
@Goldfish, please include the following:

-[] Structure of the Green Cult
-[] All individuals of note within or closely allied to the cult, including men and "ascended beings" (pay special attention to the prophet leading them, where he came from, and what his powers are)
-[] Doctrines and rituals of the cult
-[] Known or perceived goals of the cult
-[] Places important to the cult
-[] Enemies of the cult

[X] Goldfish
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Done.
 
So a bit of a random thought but... I watched the live action Mulan while sick yesterday and it was terrible, do not pay money to see it. It's like all their research was buzz-words repeated ad nauseaum. The word chi gets spoken enough times to make a musical refrain (if they had not taken out the music) but they don't even mention cultivation in their pseudo-Wuxia movie.

I mean the point of cultivation is that it takes effort and time, which is in keeping with the ethos of the original legend, working to fit in with the role of soldier. Instead we get super hero Mulan. What message is that supposed to send to girls: "You too can be the equal of any man... if you have the Force."

By contrast Disney's anemic bows to the original source material is referencing the last line in the ballad in a rushed, stilted and random rabbit scene (the line goes 'I saw two rabbits running side by side and could not tell the male from the female'). Oh and the villains are called rorans not huns.

Never mind that if you actually look at the historical context in which Mulan was supposed to have lived her having the skills to go to war makes a lot more sense since she was from a tribe of still half settled pastoralists in the north of China who would still keep up the traditions of training young women to ride and shoot. Mulan's emperor is refereed to as 'Great Khan', this is one group of nomads getting on top in China and making sure the next bunch can't replicate their success.

But OK I get why they did not introduce that. It would be like opening a King Arthur movie by explaining he was actually a Saxon all along, not really the kind of thing you want Disney to handle. But the thing is I got all this poking around the internet for half and hour. Why did I do more research writing Yi Ti for ASWAH than a entertainment giant put into a 200 million dollar movie?

*glances up at rant*

Well that got away with me,

In my defense I get passionate about poor research in movies with pretensions of 'cultural sensibilities' and 'being more adult'. The lion king remake was stupid, this is just insulting to sit though.
 
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DragonParadox said:
So a bit of a random thought but... I watched the live action Mulan while sick yesterday and it was terrible, do not pay money to see it. It's like all their research was buzz-words repeated ad nauseaum. The word chi gets spoken enough times to make a musical refrain (if they had not taken out the music) but they don't even mention cultivation in their pseudo-Wuxia movie.

I mean the point of cultivation is that it takes effort and time, which is in keeping with the ethos of the original legend, working to fit in with the role of soldier. Instead we get super hero Mulan. What message is that supposed to send to girls: "You do can be the equal of any man... if you have the Force."

By contrast Disney's anemic bows to the original source material is referencing the last line in the ballad in a rushed, stilted and random rabbit scene (the line goes 'I saw two rabbits running side by side and could not tell the male from the female'). Oh and the villains are called rorans not huns.

Never mind that if you actually look at the historical context in which Mulan was supposed to have lived her having the skills to go to war makes a lot more sense since she was from a tribe of still half settled pastoralists in the north of China who would still keep up the traditions of training young women to ride and shoot. Mulan's emperor is refereed to as 'Great Khan', this is one group of nomads getting on top in China and making sure the next bunch can't replicate their success.

But OK I get why they did not introduce that. It would be like opening a King Arthur movie by explaining he was actually a Saxon all along, not really the kind of thing you want Disney to handle. But the thing is I got all this poking around the internet for half and hour. Why did I do more research writing Yi Ti for ASWAH than a entertainment giant put into a 200 million dollar movie?

*glances up at rant*

Well that got away with me,

In my defense I get passionate about poor research in movies with pretensions of 'cultural sensibilities' and 'being more adult'. The lion king remake was stupid, this is just insulting to sit though.
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Welcome to the "We hoped for better" club, DP. Our members include former fans of Game of Thrones, Star Wars, and other dumpster fires.
 
A lot of the more modern remakes are crap due to attempts to pander to politics.

Just make a movie, don't try and make some political statement.

Focus on the actual quality and enjoyability of the film rather than trying to get people to join in to look "Culturally sensitive" and such.

If people are watching just because it is new, shiny, nostalgic, and supports their political views and not because it is an actually enjoyable film then it is not a good movie no matter how much it makes in the end
 
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DragonParadox said:
So a bit of a random thought but... I watched the live action Mulan while sick yesterday and it was terrible, do not pay money to see it. It's like all their research was buzz-words repeated ad nauseaum. The word chi gets spoken enough times to make a musical refrain (if they had not taken out the music) but they don't even mention cultivation in their pseudo-Wuxia movie.

I mean the point of cultivation is that it takes effort and time, which is in keeping with the ethos of the original legend, working to fit in with the role of soldier. Instead we get super hero Mulan. What message is that supposed to send to girls: "You do can be the equal of any man... if you have the Force."

By contrast Disney's anemic bows to the original source material is referencing the last line in the ballad in a rushed, stilted and random rabbit scene (the line goes 'I saw two rabbits running side by side and could not tell the male from the female'). Oh and the villains are called rorans not huns.

Never mind that if you actually look at the historical context in which Mulan was supposed to have lived her having the skills to go to war makes a lot more sense since she was from a tribe of still half settled pastoralists in the north of China who would still keep up the traditions of training young women to ride and shoot. Mulan's emperor is refereed to as 'Great Khan', this is one group of nomads getting on top in China and making sure the next bunch can't replicate their success.

But OK I get why they did not introduce that. It would be like opening a King Arthur movie by explaining he was actually a Saxon all along, not really the kind of thing you want Disney to handle. But the thing is I got all this poking around the internet for half and hour. Why did I do more research writing Yi Ti for ASWAH than a entertainment giant put into a 200 million dollar movie?

*glances up at rant*

Well that got away with me,

In my defense I get passionate about poor research in movies with pretensions of 'cultural sensibilities' and 'being more adult'. The lion king remake was stupid, this is just insulting to sit though.
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In unrelated news, big corporate executives don't care about doing the research, and that informs their opinions when hiring someone (what will sell to modern consumers? Being Woke and identity politics).

Just look at star wars. That had no genuine desire to introduce concepts of female empowerment in any way in a constructive manner, it was blatant pandering which makes all semblance of plot disappear into a black hole that coincidentally makes no bones about its dismissiveness for the (perceived) male dominated source material and seems to take delight in eroding all achievements it had via character assassinations with actors who are dead inside.

Because it makes money... and really, we can trace all "we did not do the research" for any big budget production back to "because that doesn't actually make money, and this film isn't really for you".
 
Azurath said:
Someday, perhaps Disney will actually hire actual writers that can write.
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I heard a rumor (which I desperately hope is true) that Disney is considering retconning all three of the new Star Wars movies and remaking them.

They might actually be hiring writers that aren't brain dead.

But at the same time I know better than to get my hopes up.
Crake said:
In unrelated news, big corporate executives don't care about doing the research, and that informs their opinions when hiring someone (what will sell to modern consumers? Being Woke and identity politics).

Just look at star wars. That had no genuine desire to introduce concepts of female empowerment in any way in a constructive manner, it was blatant pandering which makes all semblance of plot disappear into a black hole that coincidentally makes no bones about its dismissiveness for the (perceived) male dominated source material and seems to take delight in eroding all achievements it had via character assassinations with actors who are dead inside.

Because it makes money... and really, we can trace all "we did not do the research" for any big budget production back to "because that doesn't actually make money, and this film isn't really for you".
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Star Wars also wasn't planned at all.

And that's not necessarily a bad thing... except if you have a totally different director come in for the middle movie and shit all over everything, leaving the first guy to try to pick up the pieces in the last half.
 
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Frankly, the whole thing just shows just how shallow corporate progressivism is. They're not interested in creating something that'll uplift young girls. This whole thing was an attempt to make as much money as possible, using the language of 'Woke' culture. TBH, it's not as if we should expect anything less from a soulless corporation.
 
Duesal said:
I heard a rumor (which I desperately hope is true) that Disney is considering retconning all three of the new Star Wars movies and remaking them.

They might actually be hiring writers that aren't brain dead.

But at the same time I know better than to get my hopes up.
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It's very possible, tbh. Again, while milking the Far Left fads for all they are worth is fine, it isn't a sustainable solution to "how can we get more money in a short amount of time". Eventually those circles will abandon a fandom when they have determined that they have "improved it for the better" and will not spend any more money on it.

They have to make it up for the genuine fans and get them back on board somehow, and booting the previous people in charge of their dumpster fire will even make them look like heroes coming to redeem themselves. "We didn't mean for that to happen", etc.
 
Tbh, while pandering to the current progressive generation does play a part, the biggest fault still lies with the shit quality writers. You can pander to identity politics, just make sure your story makes sense and the plot with it.

Like what happened to storm troopers being abducted child slaves of all genders and races. But you know what, let's have the defector happily shoot his former friends without thinking of the people you just humanized.
 
SeekerofLight said:
Frankly, the whole thing just shows just how shallow corporate progressivism is. They're not interested in creating something that'll uplift young girls. This whole thing was an attempt to make as much money as possible, using the language of 'Woke' culture. TBH, it's not as if we should expect anything less from a soulless corporation.
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Yeah, it was definitely pandering.

And it worked. That's the thing, it's almost not worth being angry about, because we both know that doesn't impact money-driven executives who specifically try to divorce any attachment from their product and the actual end result, which is lining their own pockets.

Woke culture got their win, and then they will promptly forget about Star Wars, assuming that it will forever be a champion for their ethos and they have no need to put more care or concern into the franchise anymore.

And Disney will come in behind all of that, get rid of the obstacles to a reboot, and sell another set to genuine fans with expectations it will do fairly well, despite the previous betrayal.

And they aren't wrong about that, either.
 
Crake said:
In unrelated news, big corporate executives don't care about doing the research, and that informs their opinions when hiring someone (what will sell to modern consumers? Being Woke and identity politics).

Just look at star wars. That had no genuine desire to introduce concepts of female empowerment in any way in a constructive manner, it was blatant pandering which makes all semblance of plot disappear into a black hole that coincidentally makes no bones about its dismissiveness for the (perceived) male dominated source material and seems to take delight in eroding all achievements it had via character assassinations with actors who are dead inside.

Because it makes money... and really, we can trace all "we did not do the research" for any big budget production back to "because that doesn't actually make money, and this film isn't really for you".
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What gets to me is how tinny the changes would have to be to improve this movie:
  • Mention cultivating chi, maybe show it a bit
  • Make the witch a spirit, i.e. not human and you get rid of the western fantasy element of 'witch' in your Chinese fantasy
  • Have the bloody Emperor actually respect Mulan's wishes when she says no (some empowering message that, having our heroine be badgered into working for the state)
This would not have made a great movie, but it would at least have been passable and not actively insulting to Western and Chinese audiences alike
 
Duesal said:
Welcome to the "We hoped for better" club, DP. Our members include former fans of Game of Thrones, Star Wars, and other dumpster fires.
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I liked the new Star Wars movies, but I think that was mainly because I never got into the old Star Wars, so there was nothing to ruin for me.

And even then, I agree that their mutilating of the lore was stupid, I just enjoyed them as mindless popcorn films.

I was also disappointed with the second and third of the new movies, I liked Finn in the first, and he seemed to become less and less relevant in the subsequent movies.
 
tarrangar said:
I liked the new Star Wars movies, but I think that was mainly because I never got into the old Star Wars, so there was nothing to ruin for me.

And even then, I agree that their mutilating of the lore was stupid, I just enjoyed them as mindless popcorn films.

I was also disappointed with the second and third of the new movies, I liked Finn in the first, and he seemed to become less and less relevant in the subsequent movies.
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Because he was less and less relevant after the first one.

The hiring and other production decisions were all based around the concept that, once they had achieved a "win" via inclusivity, diversity and feminism, once they had asserted an idea, that was it.

There was no further need for anything more, no character arcs are necessary. It was just to show an audience that their opinions were being validated.

Even the bad opinions.
 
Crake said:
It's very possible, tbh. Again, while milking the Far Left fads for all they are worth is fine, it isn't a sustainable solution to "how can we get more money in a short amount of time". Eventually those circles will abandon a fandom when they have determined that they have "improved it for the better" and will not spend any more money on it.

They have to make it up for the genuine fans and get them back on board somehow, and booting the previous people in charge of their dumpster fire will even make them look like heroes coming to redeem themselves. "We didn't mean for that to happen", etc.
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Honestly their main problem, and I've heard this from other folks too, is that they tried to remake the original trilogy after the original trilogy.

They mangled the old characters to fit molds they were never destined to fit in order for them to act in ways that the dead characters from the Original Trilogy would act.

That's why Luke became a hermit instead of the head of a new order and what have you. They even brought back Papa Palpatine because force forbid some new evils step up and fill the gaping bleeding power vacuum he left, like, oh I don't know, a certain force sensitive kid seduced by the dark side due to his ambitions to become great and the stories of his grandfather who brought a galaxy to its knees even while horrifically crippled.

And don't even get me started on how they did Rey dirty...

That aside, on more positive matters I suppose, we've seen that the Black Mother isn't planning a world conquest scheme, she just wants to play with some new toys now that she's found out the "Plane of Balance" expansion pack is back online, so that's nice.

I wonder what it says about me that I find the idea of an evil pseudo-deity that only wants to consume and break humanity in an eternal cycle of death and rebirth instead of consuming all reality in an unrelenting void a calming change of pace.

Nothing good probably...
 
Duesal said:
I heard a rumor (which I desperately hope is true) that Disney is considering retconning all three of the new Star Wars movies and remaking them.

They might actually be hiring writers that aren't brain dead.
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Long ago, in a galaxy far, far away...

Luke wakes up with a naked Twi'lek girl draped across his chest, an empty bottle of Correlian brandy still clutched in his prosthetic hand. The partying after the destruction of the second Death Star had been intense, but the dreams he experienced after getting blackout drunk were even more powerful. Either they were a sign that he should avoid alcohol forevermore, or the Force was sending him a warning that Han needed a vasectomy sooner rather than later.
 
Changing the subject, any way we can powerlevel Jeyne or hire psionic mercenaries? We really need high lvl characters with Knowledge Psionics/Psicraft.
 
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