Voting is open for the next 1 day, 9 hours
Have Candoru scout the entire land and mine.
[x] Action Plan: Dogs and Dungeon Crawling
Words: 208
  • Off Screen
    • Arrange an escort mission for a Koi expert (with more guards than needed to prevent sabotage)
      • Check with Asuma for approval before submitting it, agree to his input
    • Work on completing the Chakdar seal before departing.
    • Restock on seals, bringing an excess of every type
    • Suggest that Noburi wear his chakra-megalodon leather jacket (if it provides any boost to stats)
  • Enable Dungeon Crawl, with Candoru scouting ahead of the party
    • Approach the mine cautiously
    • Summon remaining Combat Summons and Shadow Clones before we get there
      • Ask Summons if they sense any threats
      • Have Candour scout out the land around the mine
      • Whenever possible, use Shadow Clones and Summons in combat
    • Clear the land around the mine, sealing the lumber inside storage scrolls as we go
    • Have Candoru do the exploration of the mine by himself, scouting ahead as much as possible.
      • Once Candoru gives up/we get impatient, send in the remaining summons.
        • We're trying to get Candoru to admit he needs help.
    • Once clear/summons need help, maintain vigilance (ninjas and summons both) and cautiously enter the mine.
  • In combat, try to avoid explosive seals due to possibility of a cave in.

Specified that Candoru would be scouting ahead of us from the start, and that we'd only do the other summons until right before we get there. Specified that Candoru would be scouting the land around the mine on his own and that he'd also be exploring the mine by himself. Edited the wording of the "send in the remaining summons" for word count. Clarified the conditions upon entering the mine.
 
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I'd prefer to be able to go back in time to do this, but short of getting word that the QMs are okay with that this seems like the best choice.

Unless I'm mistaken, @Velorien said that he would be willing to write a flashback chapter on the Minami conversation, provided that we also include a meeting with Ami, as well --or maybe he meant the meeting between the Minami and Ami?

@eaglejarl We are all hoping to have you write the iron mine update this Sunday, but our response the Minami is something I think we should do now timeline-wise (as begging off now doesn't seem reasonable). Would you be amenable to us skipping over our response to the Minami in favor of writing the iron mine, and having our response be done in a flashback (or similar)? @Velorien your thoughts?
I have no personal objection to that scenario. However, I should note that I also want to write the Ami meeting next week, so it may be in your interests to start thinking about that also.
 
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Something which absolutely needs to be done immediately is to offer a trade to Orochimaru. He gets to examine a rare, valuable new chakra beast as well as profit from them in exchange for figuring out how to care for them. Make sure that the scrub currently working on them sees this. If they're going to die anyway, make sure that the scrub is sent back to Mist before it happens.

-because Mist is screwing us and the very, very best reply to their perfidy is, "Oh, don't worry, Uncle Orochimaru figured it out." The Wakahisa finding out that both their bloodline and their pets are in the wind out of their control will panic them and Mist will be much less likely to try something like this again. Even if we are compelled to revert to the previous system we and Asuma can make Mist pay through the nose for it.

-Oh, and get Asuma's permission.


[X] Action plan: Play Snakes and Sharingans with Akatsuki and Orochimaru.

What is the scariest thing in the world to an Uchiha?
A mirror.

What is the scariest thing in the world to an Inuzuka?
A mirror.


If there's room in the next update, I'd like to ask Ami what she's been telling people about Hazou. On one hand "aw, she's been talking about us" on the other hand "oh shit, she's been talking about us!"

"You're a compulsive traitor with the Devil's luck who worships collateral damage and you have a good taste in gifts."
 
Not entirely happy with this but is the play we need to make. Suggestions are appreciated
[X] Action plan: A chain forged of gold

  • Continue the conversation with Minami
    • The Hyuga are no friends of the Goketsu
    • Hiashi constantly schemed to usurp power from Lord fifth
      • And yet Jiriaya was willing to put that animosity aside for the greater good
        • (Invoke The Hokage (was) my new dad)
      • Waiting for the proper moment to strike at an enemy while the expect that the animosity between you has vanished is a characteristic all ninjas should strive for
    • Hypothetically if the Goketsu found themselves in a confrontation with the Hyuga there are 3 path we would could choose from
      • The path of Kagome. With explosions and destruction he would destroy our enemies utterly.
        • This would lead to losses on both sides and weaken Leaf no matter what the outcome
      • The path of Keiko. She would smile and nod. Invite Neji into our trade network. Slowly move more and more of Leaf's economy through the 7th path. Till one day the laws of the organization would allow us to economically destroy them if necessary
        • The Mori did this to the Kobayakawa. Utterly destroying them
      • The path of Mari. She would realize that the Hyuga having suffered incredible losses. That Neji joins the summon network he will be surrounded by progressive. His team is already deeply intertwined with the Nara, Gōketsu and, the KEI. That he could be turned into a tool to reshape the Hyūga and there young and impressionable clan head into something that the old guard would despise
      • (Invoke Creative Idealist)
    • We would ask you to walk the path of Gōketsu Mari with us. If you Choose not to realize that the Gōketsu will never abandon there allies

I would suggest:
-Add how the Hyuga behaviour is damaging to Leaf as a whole (We remained filthy traitors to Hiashi to the moment of his death, regardless of how much we believe the WoF and helped Leaf)
-Clarify how Hazou's plan improve Leaf as a whole
-Don't commit to any extreme phrases, so i would say less "The Hyuga are no friends of the Goketsu" and more "The relationship the Hyuga wanted with the Goketsu is plain to see" and so on. It could create problems later, especially if someone is listening in.
-Let Aika talk with her Clan Head, if she is so inclined.

I'll vote later, but i admit the plan seems interesting.
 
Minor alterations in word choice to cut down on the word count. Any suggestions?
[x] Action Plan: Dogs and Dungeon Crawling
Words: 203
  • Off Screen
    • Arrange an escort mission for a Koi expert (with more guards than necessary to prevent sabotage)
      • Check with Asuma for approval before submitting it, agree to his input
    • Complete the Chakdar seal before departing.
    • Restock on seals, bringing an excess of every type
    • Suggest that Noburi wear his chakra-megalodon jacket (provided it gives a boost to stats)
  • Enable Dungeon Crawl, with Candoru scouting ahead along the way there
    • Approach the mine cautiously
    • Summon remaining Combat Summons and Shadow Clones before we get there
      • Ask Summons if they sense any threats
      • Have Candour scout out the land around the mine
      • Whenever possible, use Shadow Clones and Summons in combat
    • Clear the land around the mine, sealing the lumber inside storage scrolls as we go
    • Have Candoru do the exploration of the mine by himself, scouting ahead as much as possible.
      • Once Candoru gives up/we get impatient, send in the remaining summons.
        • We're trying to get Candoru to admit he needs help.
    • Once clear/summons need help, maintain vigilance (ninjas and summons both) and cautiously enter the mine.
  • In combat, avoid explosive seals due to possibility of a cave-in.
 
@RandomOTP I have minor hesitance about the phrasing "we get impatient". Outside of that, looks reasonable, will offer more feedback post work. Tentatively throwing the vote in anyways.
[x] Action Plan: Dogs and Dungeon Crawling

@Oneiros / @Raichu1972 -- any reason we're not doing this as a flashback scene for Vel next plan? I like the general structure of the plan (minor thoughts to include Lailoken / SentientTree's comments, but that can be worked with / out), but feel like:

a) we benefit from a tad more time re: discussion
b) EJ has expressed interest in the mining operation (as a sole plan point)
c) Vel has expressed interest in concluding the conversation + discussion with Ami
 
a) we benefit from a tad more time re: discussion
b) EJ has expressed interest in the mining operation (as a sole plan point)
c) Vel has expressed interest in concluding the conversation + discussion with Ami
Mostly because this is a full plan trying to cram an Ami meeting and the rest of this negotiation in one plan won't happen. So we can just put of the mine for one week
 
Am currently moderately uncomfortable with Oneiros' plan right now, but only mildly uncomfortable with it after Lord Marshal's suggestions. Main thing leaving me worried not covered by LM's suggestions is the 'Hypothetically if the Goketsu found themselves in a confrontation with the Hyuga' line which I worry, if delivered wrong, might sound too close to treasonous intention for our thin-ice position, so if there's another way to phrase that which doesn't risk sounding like that, I'd be more comfortable with it.

Currently, though, I do find myself more preferring the Mine plan, as it does not interfere with our response here in a following update.
[x] Action Plan: Dogs and Dungeon Crawling

Have Candoru do the exploration of the mine by himself, scouting ahead as much as possible.
Could you add a line saying to drive waves of beasts at Candoru if he's not getting enough challenge through regular scouting? I think that would be a good way to flesh out our intentions there.
 
@RandomOTP I have minor hesitance about the phrasing "we get impatient". Outside of that, looks reasonable, will offer more feedback post work. Tentatively throwing the vote in anyways.

How do you feel about something akin to "should the other Summons become impatient?" We'll be there with Keiko and the Pangolins --not to mention Noburi's combat Toads --so they may grow bored and want to dispel if we stand around for too long. Or they might understand why we're doing this to Candoru --everyone has that arrogant friend who needs a reality check, right? --and watch on in amusement.

Could you add a line saying to drive waves of beasts at Candoru if he's not getting enough challenge through regular scouting? I think that would be a good way to flesh out our intentions there.
How does "If Candoru isn't challenged, use Summons and Shadow Clones to direct beasts toward him" sound?
 
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I would suggest:
-Add how the Hyuga behaviour is damaging to Leaf as a whole (We remained filthy traitors to Hiashi to the moment of his death, regardless of how much we believe the WoF and helped Leaf)
-Clarify how Hazou's plan improve Leaf as a whole
-Don't commit to any extreme phrases, so i would say less "The Hyuga are no friends of the Goketsu" and more "The relationship the Hyuga wanted with the Goketsu is plain to see" and so on. It could create problems later, especially if someone is listening in.
-Let Aika talk with her Clan Head, if she is so inclined.

I'll vote later, but i admit the plan seems interesting.
Am currently moderately uncomfortable with Oneiros' plan right now, but only mildly uncomfortable with it after Lord Marshal's suggestions. Main thing leaving me worried not covered by LM's suggestions is the 'Hypothetically if the Goketsu found themselves in a confrontation with the Hyuga' line which I worry, if delivered wrong, might sound too close to treasonous intention for our thin-ice position, so if there's another way to phrase that which doesn't risk sounding like that, I'd be more comfortable with it.
implemented the suggested edits
 
Works just fine for me.

Implemented it!

[x] Action Plan: Dogs and Dungeon Crawling
Words: 220
  • Off Screen
    • Arrange an escort mission for a Koi expert (with more guards than necessary to prevent sabotage)
      • Check with Asuma for approval before submitting it, agree to his input
    • Complete the Chakdar seal before departing.
    • Restock on seals, bringing an excess of every type
    • Suggest that Noburi wear his chakra-megalodon jacket (provided it gives a boost to stats)
  • Enable Dungeon Crawl, with Candoru scouting ahead along the way there
    • Approach the mine cautiously
    • Summon remaining Combat Summons and Shadow Clones before we get there
      • Ask Summons if they sense any threats
      • Have Candour scout out the land around the mine
      • Whenever possible, use Shadow Clones and Summons in combat
    • Clear the land around the mine, sealing the lumber inside storage scrolls as we go
      • If Candoru isn't challenged, use Summons/Shadow Clones to direct beasts towards him, specifically
    • Have Candoru do the exploration of the mine by himself, scouting ahead as much as possible.
      • Once Candoru gives up/we get impatient, send in the remaining summons to help him.
        • We're trying to get Candoru to admit he needs help.
    • Once clear/summons need help, maintain vigilance (ninjas and summons both) and cautiously enter the mine.
  • In combat, avoid explosive seals due to possibility of a cave-in.
 
The relationship the Hyuga wanted with the Goketsu was plain to see
I think you should be more specific with this, I'm not sure what you are getting at.
  • Hiashi constantly schemed to usurp power from Lord fifth
    • And yet Jiriaya was willing to put that animosity aside for the greater good
So I'm unsure what, exactly, the bolded is referring to. Jiraiya was certainly willing to use Hiashi and his clan's resources to help him find Naruto, but Jiraiya was Hokage at that point and therefore had the power to order Hiashi to do that sort of thing. But the way this is written implies something different: it implies Jiraiya made deals with Hiashi that weren't the sort of thing he could do as Hokage, but as Gouketsu Clan Head or similar. I'm struggling to figure this out. Is this when Jiraiya took the hat?

...anyway, I do recall that Jiraiya's immediate plan was to supplant the Hyuga with the Minami, a plan that went kibosh with Nikko's death. Aika probably knows this (she's a Jonin and therefore an important figure in the Minami clan), and considering this was Jiraiya's first real interaction with the Hyuga/Minami situation (beyond getting the clans to pool resources in finding Naruto, which I've discussed above), I don't think saying this is accurate.

The rest of this part is good, especially mentioning how Hiashi made that shitty vote. Mentioning that, especially since Minami voted for Hiashi then, makes the point that clearly the Hyuga can't be that bad without having to say it out loud and uncomfortable truths blah blah. Sorta undermines the whole "Minami will never do anything to benefit Hyuga" deal they've been going on.
  • The path of Keiko. She would smile and nod. Invite Neji into our trade network. Slowly move more and more of Leaf's economy through the 7th path. Till one day the laws of the organization would allow us to economically destroy them if necessary
    • The Mori did this to the Kobayakawa. Utterly destroying them
Does Hazou know about the Kobayakawa? I'm not certain he would know about the Mori Clan's involvement.

Regardless, I think we need to be a bit more detailed when explaining this. What does mean to move more of Leaf's economy through the Seventh Path, what laws/organization are we referring to, how subservient are they to the Hokage, MC worries, is it really safe to be putting Leaf's economy onto Summoners when losing a scroll could be catastrophic to trade...<having some difficulty articulating my concerns, mostly worried about accusations of treason from creating another powerful organization not wholly beheld to the Hokage>

I'd have offered to talk about how we could introduce Seventh Path jewels and other stuff the Hyuga Clan has traditionally held the monopoly in, in order to break it, but Jiraiya didn't exactly sell them in Leaf.
  • The path of Mari. She would realize that the Hyuga having suffered incredible losses. That Neji joins the summon network he will be surrounded by progressive. His team is already deeply intertwined with the Nara, Gōketsu and, the KEI. That he could be turned into a tool to reshape the Hyūga and there young and impressionable clan head into something that the old guard would despise
  • (Invoke Creative Idealist)
Might be a good idea to add how Keiko is 'mentoring' Hanabi (reading between the lines: making her less influenced by Hyuga shitty ideals, and thus less likely to be one of the "other"). But that's just what I would do, not 100% if that is the best play.
We would ask you to walk the path of Gōketsu Mari with us. If you Choose not to, we will still not abandon our alliance with the Minami
Maybe be more specific with the "alliance" (did we even have that, beyond convenience)? We could point out that we're still planning on making the Hyuga...not the Hiashi-kind of Hyuga, but something better, in this way.
If you need to consult with your clan head and tell us if you wish to join us on the path
Does this mean that we're offering for her to consult with the clan head, and *later* tell us if she accepts?
 
I think you should be more specific with this, I'm not sure what you are getting at.

So I'm unsure what, exactly, the bolded is referring to. Jiraiya was certainly willing to use Hiashi and his clan's resources to help him find Naruto, but Jiraiya was Hokage at that point and therefore had the power to order Hiashi to do that sort of thing. But the way this is written implies something different: it implies Jiraiya made deals with Hiashi that weren't the sort of thing he could do as Hokage, but as Gouketsu Clan Head or similar. I'm struggling to figure this out. Is this when Jiraiya took the hat?

...anyway, I do recall that Jiraiya's immediate plan was to supplant the Hyuga with the Minami, a plan that went kibosh with Nikko's death. Aika probably knows this (she's a Jonin and therefore an important figure in the Minami clan), and considering this was Jiraiya's first real interaction with the Hyuga/Minami situation (beyond getting the clans to pool resources in finding Naruto, which I've discussed above), I don't think saying this is accurate.

The rest of this part is good, especially mentioning how Hiashi made that shitty vote. Mentioning that, especially since Minami voted for Hiashi then, makes the point that clearly the Hyuga can't be that bad without having to say it out loud and uncomfortable truths blah blah. Sorta undermines the whole "Minami will never do anything to benefit Hyuga" deal they've been going on.

Does Hazou know about the Kobayakawa? I'm not certain he would know about the Mori Clan's involvement.

Regardless, I think we need to be a bit more detailed when explaining this. What does mean to move more of Leaf's economy through the Seventh Path, what laws/organization are we referring to, how subservient are they to the Hokage, MC worries, is it really safe to be putting Leaf's economy onto Summoners when losing a scroll could be catastrophic to trade...<having some difficulty articulating my concerns, mostly worried about accusations of treason from creating another powerful organization not wholly beheld to the Hokage>

I'd have offered to talk about how we could introduce Seventh Path jewels and other stuff the Hyuga Clan has traditionally held the monopoly in, in order to break it, but Jiraiya didn't exactly sell them in Leaf.

Might be a good idea to add how Keiko is 'mentoring' Hanabi (reading between the lines: making her less influenced by Hyuga shitty ideals, and thus less likely to be one of the "other"). But that's just what I would do, not 100% if that is the best play.

Maybe be more specific with the "alliance" (did we even have that, beyond convenience)? We could point out that we're still planning on making the Hyuga...not the Hiashi-kind of Hyuga, but something better, in this way.

Does this mean that we're offering for her to consult with the clan head, and *later* tell us if she accepts?
These are all really good ideas. Will do my best to figure out how to implement them. (Stuck doing HW for a while)

Edit: got to them. Not sure if they are perfect but can keep trying
 
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[X] Action Plan: Dogs and Dungeon Crawling
I am down to have another 4 days to think about the Minami. I'm worried that our initial preconceptions from the last update are overwriting the larger picture due to recency bias, and having more time to equilibrize is good.

"I wish that I had known enough to invite you first. Unfortunately, Hyuuga has already agreed to the initial meeting and it would be dishonorable to disinvite him without clear evidence of directly relevant offense. If he drops out or I can find a way to address your objections to your satisfaction, may we revisit this matter?"

"Oh, and I would also ask you to consider something. The Hyuuga are the weakest they have ever been specifically because the old guard are dead. Their leader is a flexible youth. They are inevitably going to go through a radical change this generation. The question is, will it be a new openness to others to capitalize on desperately needed opportunities, or a retreat to extreme conservatism to reestablish their authenticity? Hopefully this cooperative project will bend them to the former, but I will regret if they profit and grow stronger from it while you do not."
I often disagree with Lailoken (in fact, I think letting Orochimaru obtain possession of the koi as an essential ingredient for FOOM is not necessarily a choice we should be making), but this is an absolute masterpiece of wordsmithing.

Not entirely happy with this but is the play we need to make. Suggestions are appreciated
[X] Action plan: A chain forged of gold

  • Continue the conversation with Minami
    • The relationship the Hyuga wanted with the Goketsu was plain to see
    • Hiashi constantly schemed to usurp power from Lord fifth
      • And yet Jiriaya was willing to put that animosity aside for the greater good
        • (Invoke The Hokage (was) my new dad)
        • The Hyuga behaviour is damaging to Leaf as a whole (We remained filthy traitors to Hiashi to the moment of his death, regardless of how much we believe the WoF and helped Leaf
      • Waiting for the proper moment to strike at an enemy while the expect that the animosity between you has vanished is a characteristic all ninjas should strive for
    • Hypothetically if the Goketsu found themselves in a confrontation with the Hyuga there are 3 path we would could choose from
      • The path of Kagome. With explosions and destruction he would destroy our enemies utterly.
        • This would lead to losses on both sides and weaken Leaf no matter what the outcome
      • The path of Keiko. She would smile and nod. Invite Neji into our trade network. Slowly move more and more of Leaf's economy through the 7th path. Till one day the laws of the organization would allow us to economically destroy them if necessary
        • The Mori did this to the Kobayakawa. Utterly destroying them
      • The path of Mari. She would realize that the Hyuga having suffered incredible losses. That Neji joins the summon network he will be surrounded by progressive. His team is already deeply intertwined with the Nara, Gōketsu and, the KEI. That he could be turned into a tool to reshape the Hyūga and there young and impressionable clan head into something that the old guard would despise
      • (Invoke Creative Idealist)
    • We would ask you to walk the path of Gōketsu Mari with us. If you Choose not to, we will still not abandon our alliance with the Minami
    • If you need to consult with your clan head and tell us if you wish to join us on the path
I don't think this needs to be that long or that metaphorical with all the "paths of [Goketsu clan member]."
Reworded Short Plan (now with RandomOTP's edit coloring) said:
  • Conclude the conversation with Minami
    • The relationship the Hyuga wanted with the Goketsu was plain to see
    • Hiashi was constantly at odds with Lord Fifth
      • And yet Jiriaya was willing to put that animosity aside for the greater good
        • (Invoke The Hokage (was) my new dad)
        • The Hyuga behaviour risked weakening Leaf at a point when we needed strength. Hiashi's actions risked causing division, while Lord Seventh has made strides toward unity [subtext: we massively prefer Asuma to Hiashi and remain no great fans of the Hyuga. We don't think destroying the Hyuga when Leaf needs strength is the best choice though.]
    • While we can understand your reaction to the Hyuga given what you described, we would like you to consider that there are other options than the admittedly crude physical battle or the more subtle economic warfare.
      • The Hyuga have suffered incredible losses, and in fact are at their weakest because of the loss of the conservatives that made up a large part of their strength. If Neji joins the summon network he will be surrounded by progressives - us, you, and even a member of KEI. His team is deeply intertwined with the Nara, Gōketsu and, the KEI as well. Given his close relationship with the clan head, he could be a part of guiding the Hyuga in a new direction.
      • (Invoke Creative Idealist)
    • If you need to consult with your clan head, we are willing to wait - and regardless of your choice on this matter, we respect what you have gone through and are still committed to you.
Took out the part emphasizing our hatred of the Hyuga, acknowledgement that the Minami are totally right (speaking of ninja, lying is something that ninja do. I vote for further investigation afterward), and talking about hiding animosity to strike, which might come off as an oblique reference to attacking via means of the summon network - sounds like something we want to avoid. Not sure if we have a formal alliance with the Minami or not - the Keiko vote seemed questionably motivated and they did blame Jiraiya for Nikko's death, so I remained non-committal on that front.

I think this strikes a good balance of agreeing and supporting the Minami, but emphasizing that our beliefs have led us to take a less directly confrontational approach, while avoiding any suggestion of treason.

Note that this isn't a formal plan, as I'd prefer to save the Minami convo for next week, and it's also without taking faflec's solid analysis into account.
 
@RandomOTP I have minor hesitance about the phrasing "we get impatient". Outside of that, looks reasonable, will offer more feedback post work.
How do you feel about something akin to "should the other Summons become impatient?" We'll be there with Keiko and the Pangolins --not to mention Noburi's combat Toads --so they may grow bored and want to dispel if we stand around for too long. Or they might understand why we're doing this to Candoru --everyone has that arrogant friend who needs a reality check, right? --and watch on in amusement.

Decided to go ahead and implement it for specificity's sake. If anyone else has any other feedback, I'd love to hear it!

[x] Action Plan: Dogs and Dungeon Crawling
Words: 225
  • Off Screen
    • Arrange an escort mission for a Koi expert (with more guards than necessary to prevent sabotage)
      • Check with Asuma for approval before submitting it, agree to his input
    • Complete the Chakdar seal before departing.
    • Restock on seals, bringing an excess of every type
    • Suggest that Noburi wear his chakra-megalodon jacket (provided it gives a boost to stats)
  • Enable Dungeon Crawl, with Candoru scouting ahead along the way there
    • Approach the mine cautiously
    • Summon remaining Combat Summons and Shadow Clones before we get there
      • Ask Summons if they sense any threats
      • Have Candour scout out the land around the mine
      • Whenever possible, use Shadow Clones and Summons in combat
    • Clear the land around the mine, sealing the lumber inside storage scrolls as we go
      • If Candoru isn't challenged by this, use Summons and Shadow Clones to direct beasts toward him, specifically
    • Have Candoru do the exploration of the mine by himself, scouting ahead as much as possible.
      • Once Candoru gives up/the summons get impatient, send in the remaining summons to help him.
        • We're trying to get Candoru to admit he needs help.
    • Once clear/summons need help, maintain vigilance (ninjas and summons both) and cautiously enter the mine.
  • In combat, avoid explosive seals due to possibility of a cave-in.
 
Something which absolutely needs to be done immediately is to offer a trade to Orochimaru. He gets to examine a rare, valuable new chakra beast as well as profit from them in exchange for figuring out how to care for them. Make sure that the scrub currently working on them sees this. If they're going to die anyway, make sure that the scrub is sent back to Mist before it happens.

-because Mist is screwing us and the very, very best reply to their perfidy is, "Oh, don't worry, Uncle Orochimaru figured it out." The Wakahisa finding out that both their bloodline and their pets are in the wind out of their control will panic them and Mist will be much less likely to try something like this again. Even if we are compelled to revert to the previous system we and Asuma can make Mist pay through the nose for it.

-Oh, and get Asuma's permission.
Mm, it's an excellent idea, except for the part where we actually do that. This would just give Mist an opportunity to publicly call us the defector (and rightly: they never permitted us to study their clan-secret koi, just make use of them), and blame Sadaharu's disappearance on us, and everything will be very bad.

Rather, what we should do is give Mist every impression that this is what's happening, without any concrete evidence. Act strangely uninterested and unconcerned about Sadaharu's disappearance, a-little-too-conspicuously keep Wataru away from the koi tanks for several hours several times a week, maybe make a few koi seemingly disappear for a few hours and ensure Wataru notices but is immediately distracted so he isn't sure, have us be "seen" walking to Orochimaru's compound by Wataru/someone, maybe have Asuma "leak" some suggestive information to known Mist spies, take up a habit of awkwardly inserting snakes into idiomatic expressions, et cetera.

@Oneiros, @RandomOTP, can you include something to that effect in your plans?
  • Run by Mari, then seek Asuma's approval:
    • Seems likely Mist never sent Sadaharu: they want to blame us for her disappearance and screw us out of the koi.
      • Wataru might not know this plan.
    • Let's pretend we're so desperate we've given them to Oro for research. No direct evidence, of course. Examples:
      • Act unconcerned about koi's fate.
      • Be seen visiting Oro's compound.
      • Conspicuously keep Wataru away from koi tanks for several hours.
      • Disappear a fish, quickly return it so Wataru isn't sure it actually disappeared.
"I wish that I had known enough to invite you first. Unfortunately, Hyuuga has already agreed to the initial meeting and it would be dishonorable to disinvite him without clear evidence of directly relevant offense. If he drops out or I can find a way to address your objections to your satisfaction, may we revisit this matter?"

"Oh, and I would also ask you to consider something. The Hyuuga are the weakest they have ever been specifically because the old guard are dead. Their leader is a flexible youth. They are inevitably going to go through a radical change this generation. The question is, will it be a new openness to others to capitalize on desperately needed opportunities, or a retreat to extreme conservatism to reestablish their authenticity? Hopefully this cooperative project will bend them to the former, but I will regret if they profit and grow stronger from it while you do not."
...

...

[x] Make Lailoken the Supreme Dictator of th—
 
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Rather, what we should do is give Mist every impression that this is what's happening, without any concrete evidence. Act strangely uninterested and unconcerned about Sadaharu's disappearance, a-little-too-conspicuously keep Wataru away from the koi tanks for several hours several times a week, maybe make a few koi seemingly disappear for a few hours and ensure Wataru notices but isn't sure, have us be "seen" walking to Orochimaru's compound by Wataru/someone, maybe have Asuma "leak" some suggestive information to known Mist spies, take up a habit of awkwardly inserting snakes into idiomatic expressions, et cetera.

I'm extremely reluctant to do that because it might draw Orochimaru's personal attention towards Hazou --something we're not strong enough to handle just yet. A worse possibility is that, since we'd be openly using his reputation for our personal gain, such a ploy might irritate Orochimaru. He doesn't play politics, and this could be seen as Hazou either trying to draw him into "useless political games," or piggybacking off of Orochimaru's reputation --something he keeps sharp and ever-utilized towards "don't bother me" ends, much like Tsunade.

Remember, Orochimaru is a less political animal than even Tsunade. The extent of his politicking has thus far been "give me this, or else" or "leave me alone, or else." He uses his political power and his reputation like sludgehammers, because he doesn't need subtlety. Even Asuma is quietly terrified about Orochimaru. Tsunade loves the Leaf and wants to further humanity's overall health. No one knows why Orochimaru returned, or why he's staying. If we poke the sleeping dragon, we will be munched on and all the other knights will be forced to watch and do nothing, under pain of the same.

It'd also add too much wordspace to an update that we want to primarily dedicate to the Iron Mine Mission (I suspect that it would be too complex to have as an offscreen thing).
 
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I'm extremely reluctant to do that because it might draw Orochimaru's personal attention towards Hazou --something we're not strong enough to handle. Worse, since we'd be openly using his reputation for our personal gain, it might irritate Orochimaru. He doesn't play politics, and this could be seen as either trying to draw him into "useless political games," or piggybacking off of Orochimaru's reputation --something he keeps sharp and ever-utilized towards "don't bother me" ends, much like Tsunade.
But how would he even notice? The entire point is that the very targets of this scheme barely notice that anything weird is going on. How would Orochimaru, who sits in his underground lab 24/7, notice the hint of a whisper of the idea that we're using his name for something?
 
But how would he even notice? The entire point is that the very targets of this scheme barely notice that anything weird is going on. How would Orochimaru, who sits in his underground lab 24/7, notice the hint of a whisper of the idea that we're using his name for something?
We also didn't think that anyone would learn about the letter to the Akatsuki. What if he has agents, or people who serve him to help further his experiments? Who knows what concessions Asuma has made to keep Orochimaru content? I'm not saying that he'd figure it out the very next day, but it has the potential to draw his attention to Hazou before we're ready for that. Or, should this come out later on, taint whatever goodwill that we had managed to build up until then.

I'm just not really willing to poke the sleeping S-rank Sannin who could kill us all without a care in the world and suffer zero personal consequences for doing so bear right now.
 
This is me, clearly stating that I am observing a Lailoken in the wild. The memetic defense seems to be ineffective at the moment.

No bet. I said they wouldn't address the deal squarely. As Asuma said, Mist is already set to profit from it, plus all the koi die and they get to pretend to be angry about that as well. This is a Mist plot. There should have been a Leaf escort the entire way for exactly this reason.

Fortunately, we can ask Uncle to fill in in exchange for a cut.




"I wish that I had known enough to invite you first. Unfortunately, Hyuuga has already agreed to the initial meeting and it would be dishonorable to disinvite him without clear evidence of directly relevant offense. If he drops out or I can find a way to address your objections to your satisfaction, may we revisit this matter?"

"Oh, and I would also ask you to consider something. The Hyuuga are the weakest they have ever been specifically because the old guard are dead. Their leader is a flexible youth. They are inevitably going to go through a radical change this generation. The question is, will it be a new openness to others to capitalize on desperately needed opportunities, or a retreat to extreme conservatism to reestablish their authenticity? Hopefully this cooperative project will bend them to the former, but I will regret if they profit and grow stronger from it while you do not."




It figures that these are the one ridiculously fragile chakra monster species. They might as well have sent us chakra dodos.

Jokes aside, this should go into one of the next couple plans almost verbatim.
 
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