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Warhammer Fantasy: Divided Loyalties - an Advisor's Quest

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Prospalz said:
Can someone provide me Winter Wolf tabletop or WHFroleplay stats?
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Lupercal said:
No they have never been officialy stated up. However, when they were created (In the 8th Edition Empire Army Book) they were explicitly stated to be equivalent with Demigryphs.

Fan stats for both are avalible at the warhammer armies project. I'm sure official stats for Demigryphs are floating round the internet. If not I'll post them in ~8 hours when I get off from work.
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As promised.

Official Demigryph Stats:
M WS BS S T W I A Ld
8 4 0 5 4 3 4 3 7

Official Demigryph Special Rules: Fear, Armour Piercing

WAP Fan Demigryph Stats:
M WS BS S T W I A Ld
8 4 0 5 4 3 4 3 7

WAP Fan Demigryph Special Rules: Fear

WAP Fan Winter Wolf Stats:
M WS BS S T W I A Ld
9 4 0 5 4 3 4 3 5

WAP Fan Winter Wolf Special Rules: Fear, Crush the Weak (Re-rolls to hit against enemies with low leadership)

WHFRP 4E Official Demigryph Stats and Special Rules:

M WS BS S T I Ag Dex Int WP Fel W
7 35 - 55 40 30 45 - 15 25 - 30
Traits: Armour 1, Bestial, Bite+9, Night Vision, Size (Large), Stride, Weapon+9
Optional: Trained (Broken, Drive, Guard, Mount, War))

Keep in mind that none of these are canon to the quest as such.
 
[X] Take an active hand in the EIC
[X] Donate it to whoever ends up leading the Undumgi.
[X] Avatar: You're growing worryingly familiar with being used as a conduit by deities. ???
[X] Windreader > Windsage: Your magical senses see more than your normal ones. +2 Learning, even more able to see and understand emotion and magical effects in others.
[X] Plan recruit everyone!
[X] Plan One step after another
[X] Plan Golden Amber
[X] Plan Fields of Gold

Can I vote for multiple plans? Did some of these plans vanish? I'm not entirely caught up on the thread yet.
 
Lupercal said:
As promised.

Official Demigryph Stats:
M WS BS S T W I A Ld
8 4 0 5 4 3 4 3 7

Official Demigryph Special Rules: Fear, Armour Piercing

WAP Fan Demigryph Stats:
M WS BS S T W I A Ld
8 4 0 5 4 3 4 3 7

WAP Fan Demigryph Special Rules: Fear

WAP Fan Winter Wolf Stats:
M WS BS S T W I A Ld
9 4 0 5 4 3 4 3 5

WAP Fan Winter Wolf Special Rules: Fear, Crush the Weak (Re-rolls to hit against enemies with low leadership)

WHFRP 4E Official Demigryph Stats and Special Rules:

M WS BS S T I Ag Dex Int WP Fel W
7 35 - 55 40 30 45 - 15 25 - 30
Traits: Armour 1, Bestial, Bite+9, Night Vision, Size (Large), Stride, Weapon+9
Optional: Trained (Broken, Drive, Guard, Mount, War))

Keep in mind that none of these are canon to the quest as such.
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According to 4e, demigryphs are exactly as good researchers as wolves
 
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Humbaba said:
My final worry is that Johann is both a magister with seniority (and thus might get more credit on any papers we send back)
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He's just a magister, no seniority. Specifically one pretending to be a journeyman. We're in charge here and should just need to ensure that he isn't part of any paper we don't want him to be a part of.
 
As far a Johann not admitting he knew dispel might have weakened our arrangements on the expedition goes; he was with the artillery and counter-battery fire directed by a mage is a very good dispel as we know from the destruction of castle Drakenhof.
 
Quest said:
I really want to influence this. Not only I'd it important for trade and ranald stuff but because we'll have to literally live with him. We've established a certain degree of control over the group and we should be able to leverage that alongside our other skills to set up a suitable leader.

What do people think about spending an action on this next turn?
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Definitely approve. This also combos well with giving them the torq, and it would be cool if we could get an Ulrican to charge it up in the sacred flame they are carrying for maximum legitimacy and signals of approval from other human leaders.

Angelform said:
I intend this message to take the form of polity but firmly packaging him up on a gyrocopter heading north to 'take his exams'. If Magister Johann wants to return to K8P and study the Skaven then he is entirely welcome. We will hppily recruit him when he gets back. (And if he could bring a Bright journeyman down with him that would be grand.*)
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Very much in favor of this. There is so much *potential* to what he can offer us and we can offer him, but we need to be able to trust him and he needs to see us as more than an obstacle to what he really wants. Getting everything out and in the open is the only way I see this happening.


Re:Avatar, I want the ability to play in the big leagues without spending our whole character build getting there. This seems a ticket to being relevant at need without breaking our plans now.
 
One thing I'm very curious about is how familiars work, exactly; IIRC, we've been told that:
1: you can have multiple familiars.
2: familiars can gain more than one of the familiar traits, although we don't really know how.

and that's kinda it, with regards to things stated about them; could someone more familiar (heh) with the RPG shine a light on managing them?
 
Prospalz said:
Define "fairly average" please. In detail, if possible.
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I understand how my choice of words could be contrued as poor here.
What I meant is that while Mathilde is in meta-terms more capable of magic than a lot of her colleagues and she has some major victories on the board, she is not someone who stands head and shoulders above the rest of the College.
Whether she is an above average Magister depends of course on how you would measure it. Understanding of Ulgu? Probably above average, though it's not super-clear. Contributions to the College? Just the matrix for now. While this might be better than what a lot of others did, it's really nothing all too special in terms of the entire College. Contributions to the Empire? Well there's Drakenhof, but I personally don't see how it makes her a better Magister of the Grey Order. Perhaps the dismantling of the 'guild' is a better example. But it's still not clear to me if this would make her a better Magister.

Is that clear enough?
I didn't mean to say she is not extraordinary, but merely that she is not even close to the level of say, the Patriarch or the Bursar.
 
[X] Plan 2 wizards
-[x] Recruit Panoramia
-[x] Recruit Maximilian

[X] Plan all but the ambers.
-[X] Recruit Panoramia
-[X] Recruit Maximilian
-[X] Recruit Johann

[X] Plan Role Model for the Younglings
-[x] Recruit Esbern and Seija
-[x] Recruit Maximilian
-[x] Recruit Panoramia

New Trait:
[x] Infiltrator: Nobody seems to guard anything well enough to keep you out. +2 Intrigue, +10 bonus to infiltration.
[x] Scout: Sometimes the best weapon is knowing where everything is. +2 Intrigue, +20 to infiltrating all but the highest-security areas.
[x] Assassin: Combat is easiest when the other person doesn't realize they're in it. +2 Intrigue, +40 bonus against unaware targets.
[x] Polyglot: Your time with the Dwarves has revealed that you have an ear for languages, and learn new languages much faster.
[x] Marksman: Blackpowder is a wonderful thing. +2 Martial, +10 to attacks with blackpowder weapons.
[x] Collegiate: They say managing Wizards is like herding cats. Herding cats isn't actually that difficult. Can manage three other wizards per action spent.
[x] Magical Duellist: Anyone unwise enough to try to cast spells you don't want them to will quickly regret it. +2 Learning, +10 bonus to dispelling and inducing miscasts.

Changed Traits:
[x] Blooded > Campaigner: You've seen more than your share of battles. +2 Martial, +10 bonus to fighting alongside others.
[x] Practical > Collaborator: Though you still prefer fieldwork to paperwork, you've found that as long as someone else is doing the actual writing, you're capable of producing some amazing papers. +2 Learning, +20 bonus to dictating papers.
[x] Windreader > Windsage: Your magical senses see more than your normal ones. +2 Learning, even more able to see and understand emotion and magical effects in others.

[x] Donate it to whoever ends up leading the Undumgi.
[x] Donate it to the Winter Wolves of Ulrikadrin.
[x] Keep it around in case you ever want to study non-Ulgu enchantments.
[x] Keep it anyway - you might need to encourage allies at some point.
 
I'm not really feeling the "Panormia will be around anyway" argument.

No, she's not a "freebie". She might stick around for a while, but she could leave at any time and she will do only such work as interests her for as long as it interests her, and then she'll leave to go somewhere to continue her journey of being a journeyman. Recruiting her means she'll be around for years, not months, and we can actually direct her on specific tasks.
 
I honestly think we should probably be hiring four wizards if we're only getting two or three before the turn time we should put in for more wizards from Altdorf, even with out the trait that makes managing them easier and plus of all the traits it seems like the one most naturally suited to gaining organically.
 
SuperSonicSound said:
I honestly think we should probably be hiring four wizards if we're only getting two or three before the turn time we should put in for more wizards from Altdorf, even with out the trait that makes managing them easier and plus of all the traits it seems like the one most naturally suited to gaining organically.
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I definitely do not mind picking up a full 4/6 (latter with Collegiate) coterie of wizards, but I am not sure how much actions we have for all that?
Mind, I am a bit sad Collegiate is unlikely to win, cause it seems fairly useful for a series of our plans - we want to either create local chapterhouse or become leader of College(s), and both require ability to herd wizards, I think.
 
Briefvoice said:
I'm not really feeling the "Panormia will be around anyway" argument.

No, she's not a "freebie". She might stick around for a while, but she could leave at any time and she will do only such work as interests her for as long as it interests her, and then she'll leave to go somewhere to continue her journey of being a journeyman. Recruiting her means she'll be around for years, not months, and we can actually direct her on specific tasks.
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We got WoG that the only ones leaving in their own on the medium term are the Ambers.
Kornet said:
And his super-impressive stewardship is only two higher than ours (easily turned into only one higher via 1 action), but no, apparently our stewardship is shit and we are not qualified for the post.

I'm not as salty as I try to appear and I can live with the choice made but damn, do I want to grumble about questers having skewerd understanding of stat values.
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Maybe even match, if the trait is +2.
vsh said:
He's also liable to disregard our orders, do his own thing and lie about it.
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Like I said, he is a Magister trusted enough to study skaventech.

Someone stupid enough to do what you suggest wouldn't have made it to Magister, much less have been sent with the College's Blessing to study warpstone-based technology.

He didn't want the trouble of being a Magister on the expedition. That's understandable.

Outright mutiny might well be grounds for getting his throat slit in the night.

The title of "Court Wizard" isn't a joke. If we recruit him and he pulls that kind of shit, his ass is grass.
 
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Honestly, I feel like this vote might have been better timed to after the first council meeting, so we knew what our first task would be and which wizards would be best for it.
 
SuperSonicSound said:
I honestly think we should probably be hiring four wizards if we're only getting two or three before the turn time we should put in for more wizards from Altdorf, even with out the trait that makes managing them easier and plus of all the traits it seems like the one most naturally suited to gaining organically.
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We're going to run out of actions.

Okay, so it's pretty obvious by this point that the trait for managing wizards is not going to win and that spending one action per turn managing the EIC will win. We get assigned 2 to 4 actions per turn for our duties. If we get 4 wizards then on a 'heavy duty' turn:

4 (duty) + 1 (EIC) + 2 (wizards) = 7 and we're actually dropping the ball on something, forget personal actions.

On a normal turn
3 (duty) + 1 (EIC) + 2 (wizards) = 6 and we have no time for literally anything else

And only on a "light" turn of 2 duty actions is there any time for personal projects.
 
Briefvoice said:
We're going to run out of actions.

Okay, so it's pretty obvious by this point that the trait for managing wizards is not going to win and that spending one action per turn managing the EIC will win. We get assigned 2 to 4 actions per turn for our duties. If we get 4 wizards then on a 'heavy duty' turn:

4 (duty) + 1 (EIC) + 2 (wizards) = 7 and we're actually dropping the ball on something, forget personal actions.

On a normal turn
3 (duty) + 1 (EIC) + 2 (wizards) = 6 and we have no time for literally anything else

And only on a "light" turn of 2 duty actions is there any time for personal projects.
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What do you think the wizards do?

2 on wizards is throwing 4-16 actions at a problem.
 
Question: How much would recruiting Panoramia help her pay off her College debt? And is that a good reason to hire her, or not?
 
Briefvoice said:
We're going to run out of actions.

Okay, so it's pretty obvious by this point that the trait for managing wizards is not going to win and that spending one action per turn managing the EIC will win. We get assigned 2 to 4 actions per turn for our duties. If we get 4 wizards then on a 'heavy duty' turn:

4 (duty) + 1 (EIC) + 2 (wizards) = 7 and we're actually dropping the ball on something, forget personal actions.

On a normal turn
3 (duty) + 1 (EIC) + 2 (wizards) = 6 and we have no time for literally anything else

And only on a "light" turn of 2 duty actions is there any time for personal projects.
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Wrangling wizards counts as a proper adviser action if we're directing them on hold based tasks for the benefit of K8P.
 
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