Upon further consideration, I am retracting my vote. It's high reward, but also high risk.
Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest
- Thread starter eaglejarl
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- naruto rationalist romance armageddon is looking better and better damn you kishimoto explosions everywhere explosives solve everyone if in doubt surrender to the mercy of zabuza it seemed like a good idea at the time looks like a really bad case of being a jōnin my god. where does the lore end? precommitting is the winning plan screaming in kagome screw the rules i have explosives something bad might still happen sometimes you gotta sociopath stabby zabby subsection c of paragraph 9 should include we can weaponize this so hard open voting
Upon further consideration, I am retracting my vote. It's high reward, but also high risk.
From what I can tell this argument is roughly:
1. Jiraiya gave us written permission as the Hokage to "save the world and let nothing stand in our way"
2. Increasing our personal power allows us to achieve this goal better.
3. Therefore, anything that adds to our personal power can be considered to be ordered by will of the Hokage.
4. Since getting the snake scroll adds to our power, this section of Jiraiya's will constitutes an order for us to have it.
I'm pretty sure that #3 would never fly, and that the Hokage can't just decree that it's now Leaf law that his clan will have as much power as they want.
E: I also don't know that his giving us "permission" to do something constitutes a valid order to the rest of Leaf to re-allocate their resources to prioritise what we want.
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Emstar
The Shining One
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- Trapped in an extradimensional rift.
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- She/They
I think we could either try to get Tsunade on board with this or contact the snakes in advance to try to set up a Pangolin-Snek alliance in exchange for recognizing us--and only us-- as Summoner in Chief.
She
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- Actually pretty lost
Apologies, corrected.
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- Yes.
Google Docs says 267 words.
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She's the most likely one to have some of Orochimaru's blood, and we'll probably need her there so he doesn't just instantly try to murder us as soon as we summon him (if he's alive), but we shouldn't actually be making the attempt to summon him without a lot more preparations.
I went by the in-built comment word count - you can tell I've never made a plan before, huh? I'll correct that.
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QMs prefer Google Docs because... ... ... they want to?
Emstar
The Shining One
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- Trapped in an extradimensional rift.
- Pronouns
- She/They
I'm sorry, what? Thats not how it works I don't think. If we sign the scroll we are either the summoner or not. There can only be one active one, so at best this would boot him out of the position if hes alive or we'd get a big fat "ERROR: Snake Summoner Limit Reached" or something?
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I've misunderstood the old plan to reverse-summon Naruto by his blood, then. How was that going to work?
Emstar
The Shining One
- Location
- Trapped in an extradimensional rift.
- Pronouns
- She/They
It was going to work by having J sign the toad scroll with Naruto's blood, but it was shot down by the J man because he didn't think it would work and didn't have a blood sample.
Something something the scroll would know something something intent matters
Vecht
Self-Requested Ban
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- Snarksville, Snarkland
Actually, no.
My argument (for us to use IC) is that we we have orders from the Hokage to save the world, and we have demonstrably used a summoning scroll directly and unequivocally towards the ends of saving the world. Therefore, we are laying claim to the Snake scroll, on the basis that we will use it as effectively as we have the Pangolin scroll to the same ends.
If this works, I expect it to work exactly once. There are other great ideas others have suggested to augment the base plan.
My arguments OOC/in-thread are an entirely different matter, and are aimed at convincing other players. It is important to keep these straight.
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Ah.
Well, then can someone think of a more convincing reason we can give than "Jiraiya wrote us a blank check to do whatever we want if we think it'll benefit us personally?" It's just not going to work.
@Oneiros , feel free to take everything I put in my plan about Naruto and stick it in yours. He's just going to be much more convincing than us. And take any of the other little tweaks too.
That makes slightly more sense. Is there any way I can convince you to save that single use for something that won't blow up in our faces politically, right before an incredibly important political event?
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- Pacific standard
Does.... does Naruto get the food his clones eat? Was that a shadow cloned food? Wuh?
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How did we save the world with pangolins?
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Yessss fun proactive things
[X] Action Plan: Optimising a Bad Idea
[X] Action Plan: Optimising a Bad Idea
Vecht
Self-Requested Ban
- Location
- Snarksville, Snarkland
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- Australia
How the hell is that distinct from
It is just increasing our personal power under the assumption that we will use it to save the world (and not say, perpetuate a genoicide for gold).
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Vecht
Self-Requested Ban
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- Snarksville, Snarkland
I dunno. Maybe read the post a couple posts up where I directly responded to that post?
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I did. Your argument is
1. Jiraiya gave us written permission as the Hokage to "save the world and let nothing stand in our way"
2. Increasing our personal power has allowed us to achieve that goal better in the past because we helped out Jiraiya who then helped out Leaf.
3. Therefore, anything that adds to our personal power can be considered to be ordered by will of the Hokage.
4. Since getting the snake scroll adds to our power, this section of Jiraiya's will constitutes an order for us to have it.
Which is not meaningfully distinct from
There's also the issue that if we really want to protect Leaf and the World then the scroll should probably go to someone who has Jounin chakra levels.
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Emstar
The Shining One
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- Trapped in an extradimensional rift.
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- She/They
AFAICT:
It's different in that we have demonstrably used summoning scrolls for The Big Good in the past, thus we can use this resource (a summoning scroll) for The Big Good. This need not apply to other sources of power.
Thats not true. There aren't likely many Jonin with our values and who would take the same initiatives we would. In all likelihood, it would go to some clan schmuck who would use it for personal power and prestige.
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Any source of power would have cemented Jiraiya's position and granted him more freedom. I don't believe summon scrolls have some special world saving ability.
You don't need to have our values to save the world. Remember that Hiashi was part of the assault on the Akatsuki.
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The thing is, all of these arguments are perfectly logical OOC. I agree with them, even! But IC, absolutely no one who we need to convince is going to be convinced. We are literally going in and taking the scroll on the justification that "it makes us stronger, and that's a good thing". Literally! We aren't even trying to hide it! Promising to use our power well is going to be supremely unconvincing to all of the clans we need to convince to vote for our candidate!
You're preaching to the converted, but anyone who doesn't automatically buy into "Clan Goketsu getting stronger is an unambiguous good" is not going to.
Also, Naruto would still be a more convincing person to spout this nonsense - he might get away with it on grounds of raw charisma and being a hero.
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Emstar
The Shining One
- Location
- Trapped in an extradimensional rift.
- Pronouns
- She/They
I consider it far more likely that we will put it to better use than any other person who could get it.
I'm not against Naruto leading the charge here.
Also nitpick: Asuma is not our candidate. Quite frankly its very hard to make our odds at getting the Hat worse, since ISC + Sarutobi + Minami + (Our three votes) all have an extremely large interest in making sure that Hiashi doesn't take the throne.
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If it makes it harder to convince the people who are undecided - which I really, really think it will - it makes it harder for our candidate to win. Also, I didn't specify Asuma.