We have hit an organisational bottleneck, our population has risen to the point beyond our social ability to manage it. Guided by the herd instinct is deeply flawed, correct. But we lack an alternative option. Keep your family bounds strong and your group united is an extremely vital option, even at the price of discouraging individual action. The currently winning option (Produce new tools ) will solve our lack of tools, but do nothing to maintain our cohesion. It risks us splinting into two groups, and the other group attacking ours.
I support replacing Guided by the herd with a different aspect as soon as possible, but consider preventing a split very important. If we are lucky, keeping our population together will lead to villages, and from there we gain an aspect to replace Guided by the herd.
Guided by the herd instinct is deeply flawed because we don't WANT herd instinct. It reduces smart people and thinking outside the box.
Also we really need to make sure that really bad votes like the "lol let's throw some amazonians at a mountain peak in a cthulu world with 30% chance of success" that had a low risk-reward thing don't win again.
You realise that we didn't have an alternative, at least as you are presenting that dilema?
The choice wasn't "Throw Amazons at mountain? [ ]Y [ ]N" it was "Throw Amazons at mountain. [ ]One [ ]A Few [ ]Lots".
E: Turns out I'm an idiot. I think we always suspected.
Counterpoint, with a lack of proper tools we have
a) Made an entirely artifical hill.
b) Won a war.
We can probably continue for another period of time, its not ideal but splintering puts us at risk of now having to fight other tribes with our military speced aspects as splinters come and fight us.
You realise that we didn't have an alternative, at least as you are presenting that dilema?
The choice wasn't "Throw Amazons at mountain? [ ]Y [ ]N" it was "Throw Amazons at mountain. [ ]One [ ]A Few [ ]Lots".
That's coming from the guy who chose 'lots'.
I am perfectly fine with the outcome, though, as long as we accept throwing amazons at our problems as a solution.
[x] [Hunting the Weak] Send people away, but as armed parties, not emigrants. They will to look for new targets to loot.
Ahem. It was, in fact, a "Throw Amazons at mountain? [ ]Y [ ]N" choice.
That's coming from the guy who chose 'lots'.
I am perfectly fine with the outcome, though, as long as we accept throwing amazons at our problems as a solution.
[x] [Hunting the Weak] Send people away, but as armed parties, not emigrants. They will to look for new targets to loot.
We managed to win a war, expand our population significantly and develop spear-warriors and can now build permanent dwellings.
It is nonsense to suggest "everyone dies from no tools" when we were successful will a much more significant lack (Exhausted lvl 4).
What do you think will happen if we fail to keep the tribe united?
The splinter group/s will take tools with them and may leave us with less resources than we had before producing the new tools.
Centralizing authority tends to reveal the no tool problem and that means somebody must Officially be directed by the leadership to be the ones without tools so that key persons have them. This is generally speaking, not a very popular or successful way to inaugurate a new system of leadership, as it has yet to develop the legitimacy to get away with that.
Centralizing authority tends to reveal the no tool problem and that means somebody must Officially be directed by the leadership to be the ones without tools so that key persons have them. This is generally speaking, not a very popular or successful way to inaugurate a new system of leadership, as it has yet to develop the legitimacy to get away with that.
[] [Guided by the Herd Instinct] Debate and try to establish who is whose niece, aunt, cousin or any combination of these and other similar relations. Keep your family bounds strong and your group united.
Its relative to the present state, where there isn't really any governance. People just do what they need to do, they bring the meat, and materials to the family pot and it hopefully meets needs. It'd be a bit more stable to make sure the shortages are less savage before opening eyes to how things had gotten so bad because there isn't any solution that won't ask quite a lot to sacrifice once you know the problem exists
Its relative to the present state, where there isn't really any governance. People just do what they need to do, they bring the meat, and materials to the family pot and it hopefully meets needs. It'd be a bit more stable to make sure the shortages are less savage before opening eyes to how things had gotten so bad because there isn't any solution that won't ask quite a lot to sacrifice once you know the problem exists
[] [Exhausted] Produce new tools en masse and end your centuries long lack of equipment (Exhausted -1)
Exhausted lost
Matter over Mind acquired
Effect: Resources + 1 per level, Knowledge -0.5 per level
Synergy with We Like Shiny
Description: You prefer to take care of your material needs before moving on to more intangible problems. While in itself it is nothing special, stubborn prevalence of such attitude made you into unusually practical, if a little unimaginative, people.
Winter has passed and spring is getting in full bloom. If Willow and other girls were going to go back, they would have done so long ago. It has been over a year now that they had left. Wintergreen's mother is still claiming that her daughter will go back, but she will have to face reality now. Death is a common phenomenon in your reality, you get used to it pretty quickly when most of you die even before reaching adulthood. Yet, there is something peculiar about uncertainty accompanying their death that makes it different this time. As if you have never experience death of a close relative. As if you was completely unprepared for it and a downpour of emotions accompanying such incident. Maybe it is the length of the whole struggle that makes it so unbearable – you can feel, or rather not feel, your child dying slowly, day by day, turning from 'still well somewhere' into 'possibly alive' and then 'just a memory'.
You think, you dealt with it reasonably well. You engrossed yourself in tasks that had to be done. Not that it utterly deprived you of time to think of your dead granddaughter. It deprived you of time to think of her excessively and it was enough. You have been knapping flint whole day and your arms are aching terribly. In truth, you have been knapping flint, carving spears and stitching garbs since autumn and you are seriously starting to hate it all. Not simply the activities, but everything that comes with it – the touch of a cold stone or a smooth bone hammer especially so.
Nonetheless, there is a merit in your work, you have to admit. With proper clothes you were not freezing for the whole winter, something that happened first time in your life and you will definitely invite it to happen more often. When you add others' contribution to keep food stockpiled and fire burning, it turns out your life during times of the cold was not so bad.
You will have to move your camp somewhere further in the near future. Nearby edible plants are close to being exhausted and big game is already avoiding your neighborhood. You do not need main advantages your current position provided anymore – milder temperature thanks to wind protection and good insolation. You will probably move over to the location just over the next mountain – a group of man claimed that they had found a nice spot with a spring nearby.
Soon you are drawn from your increasingly boring work to the sound of arguing and shouting. People argue all the time and you usually do not give a damn, but you could use some entertainment right now. Additionally, they are especially loud, so after a while you decided to get up, throw your tools on the ground and go see what is happening.
You find much more chaotic situation than you have expected. Large crowd is gathered near the everburing bonfire in the middle of the camp. People are no longer only loud, they are roaring at each other, arguing with all their might. Several people grabbed their spears and shake them vigorously above their heads. A pair almost burst into a fight and they are kept away from each other by loads of arms. One very young, and very amused child must have misinterpreted what is enfolding in front of him, because he started to drum with a pair of stones encouraging adults to continue the show.
It takes you a while but you finally get to know what is going on. You had to poke more angry individuals than you would like to earn that knowledge.
A lot of people wish to leave your group. In truth, when they figured out more precisely who harbored such wish, it turned out there were less folks who wanted to stay than to leave. It immediately sprang a discussion of where and when to leave exactly. It made people realize, that they do not know of any place they could go to, beside the mountains. Vision of leaving for the mountains made more than one person laugh. It aggravated Wintergreen's mother, who declared that she will go and live there, to make it easier for her daughter to come back. It aggravated her husband, who sharply told her to snap out of it. Instead of calming them down, someone joined into the quarrel throwing an argument in favor of the wife's position. 'Specialists' decided it was a good moment to present their vision of a proper migration target. Group wishing to stay was not silent for the whole time and started voicing their objection and swaying more undecided souls towards them. It was at this moment, that someone proposed a brilliant idea - since more people want to leave than to stay, maybe instead of moving out they should stay at current hunting grounds and it was the group that wished to stay that should leave. Surprisingly, quite large number of previous leaving sympathizers liked the idea and begin to push it harder. When you add into the mix all the old grudges of wobbly basis that resurfaced in lack of better accusation options, ranging from 'you ate tastier part of the fish' and 'you snore' to 'you banged my wife', you get more or less what is happening right now.
Seriously, at times like this you get the impression that none of them is more mature than the child happily making loud noise with stones. You better get down to calming this bunch right now, because you see yet another person discreetly checking if his knife is sliding out smoothly.
Many shouts and ominous whispers later you are able to bring back some composure to your ungrateful family.
What idea do you advise to the rest of your family?
Undermentioned decisions have certain probabilities of success, unknown to you before deciding. Cost indicate loosing stockpiled 'Progress' and increasing chance of success, by 5.5% per point spent in current era.
[] Let the large group leave and spread around.
[] Make the smaller group leave. (Cost Military)
[] Let the large group leave but advise them not to divide. (Cost Population)
[] Force people to stay a bit longer, before you figure something out. (Cost Population, Military)
[] Listen closely, we will do it like this… Write-in (cost might vary)
[] [Pay cost]
[] [Do not pay]
Is there any grand initiative that strikes your fancy right now? Choose up to three (cost cannot overlap):
Possible community projects. They replace random event that happens when stockpiled value reaches maximum. You can pump your progress into projects or you can stockpile value and spend it on immediate decisions effect and increasing their chance of success. More projects unlocked along higher levels of aspects and eras.
[] (Cost Population 4) [Event] Organize a party to look for the Spear warriors lost in the mountains.
[] (Cost Resources 4) [Event] Hold commemoration event for Willow, the first spear-warrior and her three sisters.
[] (Cost Knowledge 4) Come up with better tools to aid you in hunting and gathering.
[] (Cost Knowledge 9) Come up with new methods of acquiring more food in the mountains.
[] (Cost Population 4) Send Hunters to search for optimal hunting and gathering spots in your vicinity.
[] (Cost Population 9) Send Hunters to search for other communities.
[] (Cost Resources 4) Improve living conditions by spending excessively.
[] (Cost Resources 9) Arm all your people.
[] (Cost Military 4) [Hunting the Weak] Send Spear-warriors to look for new targets to loot.
[] (Cost Knowledge 6) [Guided by the Herd Instinct] Establish your family bonds more precisely, to keep people united.
[] (Cost Knowledge 4) [Cult of the Old Ones] Establish and remember unified chant to the Old Ones.
[] (Cost Knowledge 10) [Prophecies from Beyond] Gaze into your dreams to interpret them.
[] (Cost Knowledge 4 Population 4 Resources 4) [They Can Be Beaten] Migrate into the mountains.
[] (Cost Knowledge 4 Population 4 Resources 4) Migrate somewhere else.
[] [Project] Choose projects.
Some old values becomes forgotten, some sink deeper into your culture. Choose one unpopular aspect to forget. Random one not chosen will increase in level.
[] [Forget] We Like Shiny
[] [Forget] Slightly Misguided Gender Inequality
[] [Forget] Guided by the Herd Instinct
Your life passes with you doing your things. What were you enjoying the most?
Riot vote. You can currently focus on Being Amused by Nature, Gathering Berries, Making Children, Building Dwellings, Slightly Misguided Gender Inequality, We Like Shiny, Cult of the Old Ones, Guided by the Herd Instinct, Hunting the Weak, Amazonian Spear Warriors, Matter over Mind, They Can Be Beaten or Prophecies from Beyond.
[] [Aspect] Choose one aspect.
Sorry for the delay, I ended up scrapping and rewriting the whole chapter, because I did not like it at all. Ask about mechanics and decisions if something is unclear.
Adhoc vote count started by Not ImporTant on Nov 16, 2018 at 8:54 AM, finished with 16 posts and 6 votes.
[X] Force people to stay a bit longer, before you figure something out. (Cost Population, Military)
-[X] There are good points on both sides. We cannot stay here in such a large group or we will starve. But we are family so we shouldn't split up. The solution is to head somewhere that can support us. Back to the flatlands, where the people are fat and soft and we can hunt them as wolves... But to do this we must stay together, wolves are fearsome in a pack and even the lowlanders won't fear two lone wolves.
[X] [Project] Choose projects.
-[X] (Cost Population 4) Send Hunters to search for optimal hunting and gathering spots in your vicinity. -[X] (Cost Resources 4) [Event] Hold commemoration event for Willow, the first spear-warrior and her three sisters.
-[X] (Cost Knowledge 6) [Guided by the Herd Instinct] Establish your family bonds more precisely, to keep people united.
[X] Listen closely, we will do it like this… Write-in (cost might vary)
-[X] There are good points on both sides. We cannot stay here in such a large group or we will starve. But we are family so we shouldn't split up. The solution is to head somewhere that can support us. Back to the flatlands, where the people are fat and soft and we can hunt them as wolves... But to do this we must stay together, wolves are fearsome in a pack and even the lowlanders won't fear two lone wolves.
[X] [Project] Choose projects.
-[X] (Cost Knowledge 6) [Guided by the Herd Instinct] Establish your family bonds more precisely, to keep people united. -[X] (Cost Resources 4) [Event] Hold commemoration event for Willow, the first spear-warrior and her three sisters. -[X] (Cost Military 4) [Hunting the Weak] Send Spear-warriors to look for new targets to loot.
[X] [Project] Choose projects.
-[X] (Cost Knowledge 6) [Guided by the Herd Instinct] Establish your family bonds more precisely, to keep people united. -[X] (Cost Resources 4) [Event] Hold commemoration event for Willow, the first spear-warrior and her three sisters. -[X] (Cost Military 4) [Hunting the Weak] Send Spear-warriors to look for new targets to loot.
[X] Plan Waargh! -[X] Listen closely, we will do it like this… Write-in (cost might vary)
--[X] There are good points on both sides. We cannot stay here in such a large group or we will starve. But we are family so we shouldn't split up. The solution is to head somewhere that can support us. Back to the flatlands, where the people are fat and soft and we can hunt them as wolves... But to do this we must stay together, wolves are fearsome in a pack and even the lowlanders won't fear two lone wolves.
--[X]Pay the Cost -[X] (Cost Military 4) [Hunting the Weak] Send Spear-warriors to look for new targets to loot.
-[X] (Cost Knowledge 4 Population 4 Resources 4) Migrate somewhere else.
[X] Force people to stay a bit longer, before you figure something out. (Cost Population, Military)
[X] [Pay cost]
[X] [Project] Choose projects.
-[X] (Cost Resources 4) [Event] Hold commemoration event for Willow, the first spear-warrior and her three sisters.
[X] Gathering Berries
[X] [Project] Choose projects. -[X] (Cost Population 4) [Event] Organize a party to look for the Spear warriors lost in the mountains.
-[X] (Cost Knowledge 6) [Guided by the Herd Instinct] Establish your family bonds more precisely, to keep people united.
[X] [Project] Choose projects.
-[X] (Cost Knowledge 6) [Guided by the Herd Instinct] Establish your family bonds more precisely, to keep people united. -[X] (Cost Resources 4) [Event] Hold commemoration event for Willow, the first spear-warrior and her three sisters. -[X] (Cost Military 4) [Hunting the Weak] Send Spear-warriors to look for new targets to loot.
[X] Plan Waargh! -[X] Listen closely, we will do it like this… Write-in (cost might vary)
--[X] There are good points on both sides. We cannot stay here in such a large group or we will starve. But we are family so we shouldn't split up. The solution is to head somewhere that can support us. Back to the flatlands, where the people are fat and soft and we can hunt them as wolves... But to do this we must stay together, wolves are fearsome in a pack and even the lowlanders won't fear two lone wolves.
--[X]Pay the Cost -[X] (Cost Military 4) [Hunting the Weak] Send Spear-warriors to look for new targets to loot.
-[X] (Cost Knowledge 4 Population 4 Resources 4) Migrate somewhere else.
[X] Force people to stay a bit longer, before you figure something out. (Cost Population, Military)
[X] [Pay cost]
[X] [Project] Choose projects.
-[X] (Cost Resources 4) [Event] Hold commemoration event for Willow, the first spear-warrior and her three sisters.
[X] Gathering Berries
Hey look at that. Rampantly having tools doesn't help when the group is splintering. @Not ImporTant you missed out one crucial detail. Why do people want to leave? Also does they can be beaten turn Cult of the Old Ones into a Anti Old One cult?
Hey look at that. Rampantly having tools doesn't help when the group is splintering. @Not ImporTant you missed out one crucial detail. Why do people want to leave?
[X] Force people to stay a bit longer, before you figure something out. (Cost Population, Military)
[X] [Pay cost]
[X] [Project] Choose projects.
-[X] (Cost Resources 4) [Event] Hold commemoration event for Willow, the first spear-warrior and her three sisters.
-[X] (Cost Knowledge 4) Come up with better tools to aid you in hunting and gathering.
-[X] (Cost Military 4) [Hunting the Weak] Send Spear-warriors to look for new targets to loot.
[X] [Forget] Slightly Misguided Gender Inequality
[X] [Aspect] Amazonian Spear Warriors
People wish to leave your family because of numerous reasons. Main problem is that small area within walking distance is not enough to sustain group as large as yours with your current economy and technology, so people simply need to go away to prevent starvation. Lack of wives and husbands from outside the family is also important. Not everyone is interested in marriage with her or his cousin. There is also matter of grudges and simply 'not liking' some other family members and other 'petty' problems that adds up - your family is too big to stick together with complete lack of any established norms and rules.
Aspects are written in front so you know why you have access to a particular project, to help you decide what to focus on. They might upgrade aspect as a result or not.
And if you are asking about:
-[X] (Cost Knowledge 4) Come up with better tools to aid you in hunting and gathering.
-[X] (Cost Knowledge 4) [Cult of the Old Ones] Establish and remember unified chant to the Old Ones.
[X] Force people to stay a bit longer, before you figure something out. (Cost Population, Military)
[X] [Pay cost]
[X] [Project] Choose projects.
-[X] (Cost Population 4) Send Hunters to search for optimal hunting and gathering spots in your vicinity.
-[X] (Cost Resources 4) [Event] Hold commemoration event for Willow, the first spear-warrior and her three sisters.
-[X] (Cost Knowledge 6) [Guided by the Herd Instinct] Establish your family bonds more precisely, to keep people united.
[X] Gathering Berries
Mountains are a bad idea for growing population, and I think the lowland heat from our murder spree should have died down enough now.
Lets migrate again next turn, finishing the Event first(culture being important). We don't HAVE a use for mountainous terrain until we at least hit the bronze age.
[X] Force people to stay a bit longer, before you figure something out. (Cost Population, Military)
[X] [Pay cost]
[X] [Project] Choose projects.
-[X] (Cost Population 4) Send Hunters to search for optimal hunting and gathering spots in your vicinity.
-[X] (Cost Resources 4) [Event] Hold commemoration event for Willow, the first spear-warrior and her three sisters.
-[X] (Cost Knowledge 6) [Guided by the Herd Instinct] Establish your family bonds more precisely, to keep people united.
[X] Gathering Berries
Mountains are a bad idea for growing population, and I think the lowland heat from our murder spree should have died down enough now.
Lets migrate again next turn, finishing the Event first(culture being important). We don't HAVE a use for mountainous terrain until we at least hit the bronze age.
You will not be able to migrate next turn, unless you want to abandon some projects. (Cost Knowledge 6) [Guided by the Herd Instinct] Establish your family bonds more precisely, to keep people united. will take 3 turns to complete with your current progress gains. Commemoration will take 8... I will do something about it, this event should be completed by the next turn, otherwise it makes no sense.
Projects are midrange tool, choosing aspects is long term strategy and stockpiling progress is for emergency instant gains.
Well seems we've got a fair few problems, these can mostly be solved by heading to low lands looking to fight.
Nothing brings people together like war.
I want to forget shiny as its actually purely detrimental to our society, however this is more thematic to the plan I think. @Not ImporTant would you tell me this write in cost. Also what happens if we chose not pay? That just stinks of a trap vote.
Oh and can I bundle the projects into a plan?
[X] Listen closely, we will do it like this… Write-in (cost might vary)
-[X] There are good points on both sides. We cannot stay here in such a large group or we will starve. But we are family so we shouldn't split up. The solution is to head somewhere that can support us. Back to the flatlands, where the people are fat and soft and we can hunt them as wolves... But to do this we must stay together, wolves are fearsome in a pack and even the lowlanders won't fear two lone wolves.
[X] (Cost Military 4) [Hunting the Weak] Send Spear-warriors to look for new targets to loot.
[X] (Cost Knowledge 4 Population 4 Resources 4) Migrate somewhere else.
[X] [Forget] Slightly Misguided Gender Inequality
You will not be able to migrate next turn, unless you want to abandon some projects. (Cost Knowledge 6) [Guided by the Herd Instinct] Establish your family bonds more precisely, to keep people united. will take 3 turns to complete with your current progress gains. Commemoration will take 8... I will do something about it, this event should be completed by the next turn, otherwise it makes no sense.
Projects are midrange tool, choosing aspects is long term strategy and stockpiling progress is for emergency instant gains.
Adjusting the timeline to migrating as soon as it frees up then?
The only reason I'm not choosing to migrate immediately is that we have that event and we'd miss it otherwise.
Also if we're moving back to the lowlands we really shouldn't pick a fight until we settle in. Got no idea what we're even facing.
