Cold Iron, Empty Throne

Sure, all the most magical defences are likely gone, but the assumption that all traps or defenses are gone is optimistic indeed.
Mundane traps or guards are easily possible, and there's always the possibility that others had the same idea, and we'll face competition.
 
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you're right, there are probably normal traps, but we are highly trained.

And getting there before anyone else thinks of it and/or uses them is kind of a core tenant of my argument.
 
A study of becoming more than human
I put together a little primer on the supernatural elements that our protagonists would know in character, in case this assists anyone in making a decision. If there's no change when I come to write the next update, I'm going to declare myself a tiebreaker and go for the choice I think is more interesting to write.

If you think you recognize something: yes, you probably do. I tried to make interesting twists on the magic for this setting, but it's definitely drawing inspirations shamelessly.

- -

For mortals, there are generally accepted to be a few specific methods to acquire superhuman power. There are enlightened martial arts and the five paths of magic: Conceptual Magic, Elemental Magic, Contracts, Tome Magic, and Divination. It's far from unheard of for any given great man or woman to take an eclectic approach to these, mixing and combining various talents to find the best tricks that the individual can achieve. Thus, terminology is quite inconsistent, both due to the radical differences possible and the fact that, even with the seer network, long-distance communication in the Shallow Ocean is slow and unreliable. The most typical terms are just "hero" and "mage". A hero is someone who has more combat power than average when they fight, either with a weapon or barehanded: typically, anyone who could defeat at least three normal fighters at once is going to be called 'hero' by someone. Mages are those whose primary talent is magic.

Not every person who can use magic is considered a mage. There are countless people with some small talent, usually some weakly-bound concept or a specific effect or two that mimics tome casting. From the village elder who has some power to soothe pain to the champion pearl diver who can charm oysters into giving up themselves to the hedge witch who can bless or wither crops (a bit), these hardly count. For one, it doesn't put them beyond human capacity, for all that their specific trick gives them some new ability. Something more is needed.

The enlightened martial arts are a varied lot. Most established schools expose some intrinsic flaw in how the world works, and exploit it ruthlessly and in increasingly difficult and subtle ways, as mastery grows. Most can be used either bare-handed or with weapons, though many clearly lean to some specific angle. A comprehensive list would be difficult and beyond what you currently know, anyway. There are three that you know of that are currently in use in the capital. The first is Bear's Mantle, focused on superhuman strength and shifting weight in impossible ways to make oversized weapons both easier to handle and hit even harder than they should. The second is Viper's Kiss, which manipulates the user's own body chemistry to generate poisons they can pass with a touch, as well as synthesize other things to boost their own abilities. The third is Untouchable Blade Style, which apparently is creepy to watch and is great for one-on-one fights against other people, but you don't know anything about its mechanisms. There are a few others you're familiar with. Stroke of Midnight is a technique that combines divination magic to fight both in the present moment and prep for the future, while gracefully avoiding attacks and hazards, though its users occasionally get so caught up in the future that they falter in the now. Screaming Fiery Monkey involves acrobatics and converting body heat into flame attacks. Swirling Winds reads the air around and uses small changes, caused by its user's own breath, to control thrown and missile weapons to attack beyond sensible range, redirect in midair, or just fire absurdly quickly.

Conceptual magic is probably the most common type, and is considered close to the intrinsic supernatural power of a god, angel, or spirit. By binding a specific concept to the soul through meditation and enlightenment, the user can focus will to evoke related effects. For instance, someone who has bound the concept of "Fire" can do things from lighting a candle to throwing great balls of fire (at least, if the user has enough magical strength and stamina), but the more they press themselves, the more they can pull off effects tangentially related to the concept, such as sparking fiery anger. The concepts themselves aren't necessarily perfectly described by one word, as they are concepts, but it's rare to find. Concepts can also change over time, based on usage and intent. Wind and Music are somewhat infamous for flipping from one to the other, but many concepts somewhat overlap each other, meaning that it can take some observation to figure out the exact concept of a mage you don't know. Other common concepts to bind include water, weather, fields, healing, earth, and shadow. A powerful mage who binds an unexpectedly useful concept is a staple of many tales, but rare in reality.

Elemental magic is the most physically oriented magic. Elementalists, as they are often called, have to step out into a dangerous situation where two or more elements meet, and find an internal balance between the two. This lets them control and shape both the related elements, though unlike concept magic, it doesn't extend to more metaphorical connotations. Still, someone who is properly open to it while walking along a beach during a thunderstorm may find that commanding the waves and summoning lightning has great utility for him. Poison elementalists are always some of the most sought-after, because of their ability to extend a poison to food stores, to protect it from vermin, then counter it when it's time to eat. Although the strength of the effect depends on the elementalist in question, much of the reshaping of the ocean and islands to make them friendlier to mortal lives, as well the speeding of ships along routes that might not be quite in line with natural currents, spin from the actions of teams of elementalists. If not for the danger involved in gaining elemental magic, it would be even more popular.

Contracts are a form of magic that exploit the differences between mortals and spirits. The mortal gains some powers related to the spirit they contracted with, and the spirit can extract whatever concessions both agree to. Contracts are absolute to the parties involved: the magic structure is delicate. If the mortal agrees to a blood sacrifice every moon, the magic cannot consider extenuating circumstances that weren't hashed out ahead of time. Far-sighted or experienced spirits thus tend to offer contracts with detailed clauses to cover minor or unintentional breaches. Contract powers can be both broader and more esoteric than conceptual magic. Between this and the relative simplicity of gaining contract magic, contract magic is extremely popular. Beyond the delicate structure, another downside of contract magic is that the spirit feels, in the back of their mind, something of the mortal's thoughts. This is not a deep mind-reading ability, and is often mostly a headache, both for the mortal with minimal privacy and the spirit who may not want to listen in or who may get distracted from too many too disparate voices and suffer various mental maladies from it. To combat this, most of the spirits (such as gods) who have a large number of contractors specify codes of conduct for the 'clerics' or 'paladins' who echo their power. A god who values cold logic and even tempers may demand celibacy, or something close to it, while a deity of passion and desire may demand, ahem, something else.

Tome magic is the most difficult branch to master, but offers the broadest possibilities. It approaches magic from a studious, logical perspective, where known theories lead to specific results. Magic on this level is intricate and arcane, however: a spell to light a candle and one to throw a fire ball may have almost nothing in common, and you certainly can't replace the one with the other. Still, nothing prevents a tome mage from knowing a wild collection of spells: something to silence movement, to hurl bolts of force, to read the lips of someone facing away from you, to generate giant sticky ropes. Tome magic is called as such due to how complex spells are: without a substrate to simplify things that other branches allow, tome mages write down most of the spell and connect to it when they cast. Usually, this takes the form of a book, hence the name, where the caster touches the inscribed magical symbols and makes it part of the spell, only finishing the spell in their mind to decide such things as "where do I aim this" and similar effects that are best decided on the fly. Some casters will use other things to hide the powers they have with them: staves with subtle magic circles or perhaps clothing with the spell shape stitched into the cloth. Sometimes, a spell is learned so thoroughly that no external aid is needed, which is usually the case for those who pick up one or two spells that are technically "tome magic". For them, without further theoretical grounding or broader applications, it ends up as singular tricks. For a lot of non-mages, they think of tome magic as the highest or best type, assuming that its challenging nature and broad ability completely counter its lack of flexibility. In fact, few mages dedicate themselves solely to tome magic, and most have at least one bound concept or some elemental ability.

Tome magic is also closely related, fairly intuitively, to the creation of magic items. Laying down spells logically and using physical aids is only a skip away from making the entire magic item. Technically, most magic items are a type of artificial soul, though not one that has any sapience or sentience. Instead, they create, for instance, a soul in a sword that exists only to cast "my blade is sharp, hard, and casts a glowing light" over and over, forever, thus creating the effect. Despite centuries of effort, no one has been able to create a soul with any more of a self than this. The most complex they've ever achieved is something like "cast my spell when this condition is met", such as the fancy lights for the rich that turn on or off when verbally commanded to. Potions are distinct from this; they use a special brewing process to arrange most of the spell, but not to attach it to anything. It simply stays in a specially-prepared glass container that doesn't react to it. When used, the soul that they use to 'cast' themselves is the one holding the container. This means that a potion spilled during an earthquake will be wasted, but will not trigger itself. It also means that mechanical aids to pour out a potion while the setter is far away tend to be frustratingly difficult to arrange, and tend to require a specialize magic item to get any effect.

The last of the paths of magic is divination. Divination is the only path that does not seem to be able to be taught or imparted. Mostly, it seems to be a gift people are either born with or not, and training simply enhances and helps this. Seers, as users of divination are often called, can typically see communicate with each other over long distances, if both parties are willing. This is the "seer network" that constituted most fast communication across the Shallow Ocean. Seers can also sometimes see distant locations, catch frustratingly almost-but-not-quite trustworthy images of the past or future, intuit people's thoughts and motivations, or otherwise manifest knowledge they shouldn't be able to have. The exact set of talents varies by individual.
 
[X] Go back to the temple, try a self-guided crash course to power.

As I've understood, the vote is still open. Sorry, if I am wrong.
And in fact, I agree with Teloch that it would be nice to sign up for the next boat somewhere else, but, unfortunately, this is unpopular option.
 
we're still going to be facing this situation.
Different scopes.
Revolutions and power struggles mostly happen at capitals, not in provinces.
The power is concentrated in a) governing cities, b) wealth-generating nexuses, so fights for the said power is fierce at those places. Fringes and rural areas are mostly concerned about getting through harsh times as peacefully as possible, usually hoping that the neighboring states won't go for incursions, seduced by the opportunity to prey on a weakened state.
 
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As I've understood, the vote is still open. Sorry, if I am wrong.
And in fact, I agree with Teloch that it would be nice to sign up for the next boat somewhere else, but, unfortunately, this is unpopular option.

Not only was it still open, I was looking to close it after someone broke the tie!

Thank you, and, hey, maybe next time you can sway people to leaving.

For now, though, it's probably going to take me a couple of days to update.
 
Different scopes.
Revolutions and power struggles mostly happen at capitals, not in provinces.
The power is concentrated in a) governing cities, b) wealth-generating nexuses, so fights for the said power is fierce at those places. Fringes and rural areas are mostly concerned about getting through harsh times as peacefully as possible, usually hoping that the neighboring states won't go for incursions, seduced by the opportunity to prey on a weakened state.
Solid point, if we stay away from major cities and the like we won't see this kind of struggle.

I simple assumed that we would be going into major cities and the like. Avoiding them would make this a story about trying to avoid the changing times, rather than about rising or falling as the new world takes shape.

If the idea is simply to go somewhere we will be unchallenged to hole up and train, it still means giving up everything we could have gotten in the short term and the influence we would have on things (not necessarily political) from having been here from the beginning.
 
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A memorable night
Gradually, the consensus of the discussion comes around to the benefits of building some power now. Although the potions are tempting, they aren't quite enough for you to risk it. Presumably most defenses on them are gone, courtesy of the Great Dying, but that doesn't mean everything is. Plus, for all you know, someone else has already looted them if they were available. Learning at least something first sounds more practical.

You make your way back to the temple of Tal-Roshath and ensure the outer doors are reasonably barricaded.

Samir pipes up with a concern once you're all there and sealed away. "Are you sure this is going to work? It didn't work for us before."

It will. You feel... oddly certain of that. It's not exactly related to what Ant said. You never had a good reason to try hard before. Before, succeeding might have given you some praise, but it would only have meant your quicker death at the hands of your god. You flash back to a handful of half-remembered faces of people who had succeeded, gone on to private training, and then gone off to their deaths as ritual sacrifices with nowhere near enough power to stand up for themselves. That's not what you're going for any longer. For the first time ever, you're going to try for yourself. For... whatever ideals you think are important.

And the temple itself won't hurt. The effect is not large, because it never is, but it was constructed with the intent of making it easier to channel energies while inside it. You also have access to all the memories of training you've had, and a library with further resources.

Just as you're feeling good and considering how to express it to Samir, Zahira pipes up instead. "Didn't work for you losers. I had a broad suite of destruction powers until my patron rolled over and died. Help me set up and bind a concept already." No one moves to help her. "...er, please?"

In the end, it does prove easiest to just get Zahira set up and out of your hair. All she actually wants is a lit candle on a holder. She sets it on a table, stares at it intently from very close, and is thus completely disinterested in whatever you're up to.

What you're up to ends up being a lot of discussion. Dawn points out that the marble floor and high ceilings to catch smoke could allow a nice, brisk fire. You could use that to try to set up an elementalism course... but elementalism is all about the balance between two dangerous forces. A heated discussion follows about what you could use to balance it out. In the end, no one can think of a good way to bring in hurricane winds, crushing water flows, or the like.

One of the classic methods to teach someone enlightened martial techniques is to put increasingly stiff competition between them and their only meal of the day. Then, step up the competition and decrease the amount of food each time. For some, they can overcome the limits of possible and turn this into fighting as a hero. You have a spirited debate on exactly how likely it could work by compressing the time scale and having it be water but the fighter would be thirsty.

Divination magic is the only path you and your group never were tested for. It's not a path that normally leads to any special combat ability, and thus not something that would up your sacrificial value. The school called Stroke of Midnight is the exception, which still doesn't really up your power at all, but rather just lets you fight by planning ahead and relying on hunches on how to secure an advantage. If you wanted to gamble on someone possessing that, you could blindfold them and scatter caltrops, which is exactly the style's usual first exercise.

The biggest challenge, of course, is that there's no good way to train everyone at once. The only somewhat solo method you have right now is trying to bind a concept, like Zahira is doing,and none of your squad thinks that they have that lined up right now. You're going to have to pair up instead, or even go three-on-one, instead. It's just a basic fact of how you can try to arrange things.

Before you can settle on that, Zahira abruptly makes a high-pitched "oh", which catches your attention. You turn to see her. Her stare is intense, focused, all-encompassing. She's been staring at the flame for so long, trying to bend her will to it, that you're not sure she's been blinking. After a moment, you realize that the wick hasn't gone down the whole time she's been exerting her will on it, either. It's a tiny miracle, just the smallest possible spell effect... but it's being maintained.

Then, Zahira reaches out with one hand, and pinches the fire. Somehow, it comes off the wick, remaining between her thumb and finger as she pulls it away. In an almost dream-like state, she pulls the flame away and presses it to her chest, just over her heart, where it disappears. Then, she seems to wake up. "I... I did it!" Zahira jumps up, excitedly, clapping her hands for joy.

She turns back to the now-snuffed candle. With a deep breath and a gesture, and three tries to get it right, she manages to relight it, magically. "I did it!" She's louder now.

"Big deal," Samir grouses. "I could've done that in half the time and without so much effort just with a quickmatch. And good luck setting anyone on fire faster than they could put an arrow through your eye socket."

Ignoring Samir, Zahira dances a couple of loopy spins while little flames spark from her fingertips, laughing the whole while. She stumbles about halfway into the third spin, and you have to catch her. "Whoo..." she continues. "Right. Overdid it. I need to build up my magical strength and stamina. But I did it." Impulsively, Zahira grabs you by the temples and pulls you into for a quick kiss. It's not a romantic gesture; she just had to express overflowing emotion and anyone would have done. Except maybe Samir.

Still, you find yourself blushing. "Er... uh... let me help you to bed. You'll feel stronger in the morning." You sling one of her arms around your shoulder. She's short, but you're not so tall that it's impractical to help her along this way. Samir has changed his tune and now chases you out of the room with a wolf whistle and some comment you try very hard not to hear. Zahira shouts something back at him, still way too happy to take anything badly. You try not to listen to her, either.

When you exit Zahira's room, though, your mood sobers up instantly. Ant's manifesting again. Its robed figure seems to be waiting for you in the hall. "What now, Ant? Are you going to tell me this isn't going to work and offer me something else?"

Ant shakes its head and rolls up its sleeves. It seems to be re-establishing itself more. It's got all four limbs quite defined, now, though hood and loose clothing still hide half its face and anything to hint at a gender. "No, it's probably going to work, at least partially," Ant says. That's odd. The teeth seem a lot less pointed now. They're still sharp, but it's not the array of horrible needles any longer. "But, yes, I'm here to offer a trade."

You sigh, and head up the hallway. Ant keeps up, of course. This figure is an illusion, after all. Ant's real body is in your pocket, forced into a magical prison. "Okay, so what's your trade?"

"I'm offering two," Ant says. "But you can only pick one, at most. If you would like, I will help you all train, physically. Let me out of my prison and I'll beat some enlightenment into your bodies. I won't break anything or cause lasting damage, but it will be extremely painful, because I'll just batter you until you're able to fight on a reasonable level. I know it won't last and I'll get stuck in this form again afterward, but a chance to stretch my muscles and exert myself like that is all the payment I need... for now. If you prefer, I'll just tell you and your group what I can of your potential and what I think you're each capable of with proper growth. I don't recommend you take that option, though. I think you'll be upset at what I say if you do."

"And I don't get to pick both, huh?"

"Nope!" Ant lounges back, crossing its arms behind its head. "I don't want to, so that's not an option."

You consider. If you do take Ant's offer, that would solve one logistical problem. One mighty spirit could absolutely challenge all four of you at once, and with the specifics of Ant's situation there's no chance of this going too wrong. Its prison is very thorough, and it will be returned to its current state if Ant so much as acts funny, never mind actually breaking either the intent or spirit of the training class. On the other hand, Ant's never been shy about oversharing. Why is it playing coy now, when you've previously shown such trust and openness with your team?

You don't have much time to puzzle it out. You're almost back to the others.

[] Let Ant spar with all of you, see what develops from such a rough challenge.
[] Listen to Ant's rundown of your true potential.
[] Never mind Ant. Keep to the plan you already have, and pick two people to be the focus of training:
- [] Yourself
- [] Kalju
- [] Dawn
- [] Samir
 
[X] Let Ant spar with all of you, see what develops from such a rough challenge.

As they say, Reach Heaven Through Violence
 
I'd like to ask a question:
How close is the nearest beach?
Way I see it, The problem of Elementalism is that it's unstable. if it works it's awesome but if it fails the person trying tends to die.

So my thought is thusly:
Get big fire. Not a bonfire, more raging forest fire. Stand...I want to say inbetween Fire and Sea, or something.
Have Ant Manifest inbetween the two.
Something something The elemental clash between Fire and Sea, with Ant standing inbetween trying to hold the two at bay.
The idea is effectively tap into Ant's 'Struggle' theme, and pitting it against the power that Elementalism can bring to the table to satisfy that requirement/stablize it while basically enduring the power of the elements.
The HOPE is to create a mixture of Elementalism and Ant's personal powers to create a cross between Elementalism and Divine power that hopefully can then be bestowed...Maybe not without risk, but more reliably then trying to get caught inbetween two natural disasters and hoping you unlock the power instead of dying.
 
As they say, Reach Heaven Through Violence

Meti's Sword Manual may, indeed, grant you some insight in this world.


I'd like to ask a question:
How close is the nearest beach?
Way I see it, The problem of Elementalism is that it's unstable. if it works it's awesome but if it fails the person trying tends to die.

So my thought is thusly:
Get big fire. Not a bonfire, more raging forest fire. Stand...I want to say inbetween Fire and Sea, or something.
Have Ant Manifest inbetween the two.
Something something The elemental clash between Fire and Sea, with Ant standing inbetween trying to hold the two at bay.
The idea is effectively tap into Ant's 'Struggle' theme, and pitting it against the power that Elementalism can bring to the table to satisfy that requirement/stablize it while basically enduring the power of the elements.
The HOPE is to create a mixture of Elementalism and Ant's personal powers to create a cross between Elementalism and Divine power that hopefully can then be bestowed...Maybe not without risk, but more reliably then trying to get caught inbetween two natural disasters and hoping you unlock the power instead of dying.

The nearest beach is relatively close! This is set on an island. As long as you don't mind it not being a particularly nice beach, no problem.

As far as how that would interact with this setting's metaphysics... I admit you came up with something I hadn't! I'm going to have to think about that.

I wouldn't mind it as a write-in. I'd say that Ant would demand a certain promise of violence to attempt this, though. "You must spill a foe's blood at least thrice a year", for instance.
 
[]Write-in: The Flame, the Sea, the Ant inbetween.
-[]Start a large fire that's decidedly out of control on a beach.
--[]Manifest Ant inbetween the Fire and Sea, with Ant pitting his strength against the two to hold them off.

And the hope is we get Divine Elementalism! Because if we don't we die.
EDIT: Ritually removing X's in the hope of lord Tally-sama not using the wrong set of orders.
 
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NO. Never learn your true potential, it limits you. It's when you don't know that something is impossible, that you figure out a way to pull it off.


[X]Write-in: The Flame, the Sea, the Ant inbetween.
edit: Taking this if it means fighting Ant between those two elements.


Instead, let's get beat up by the closest thing left to a god. It's what we trained for anyway-

Wait. waaaaait. We actually are trained for this! We've been trained for fighting an angel of a god of combat or whatever, for years!

Of all the possible training-actions in which we might have a preexisting 'foundation' this is probably it.

It also ties in well to Ants concept of [Struggle].

Meanwhile, having the knowledge of what your true potential is handed to you weakens that. I'm not sure the knowledge option is outright a trap, but it might be, well, limiting.
 
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[X]Write-in: The Flame, the Sea, the Ant inbetween.
I confess I'm not clear on the particulars, but this plan sounds interesting!
In it's current incarnation I'm not sure how we get elementalism out of it, but it's definitely a solid sounding base of a plan.

Also, I'm fairly sure Ridiculously Average Guy is right about what learning our potential will do.
 
Okay, so being the man who came up with the write-in, it falls to me to ask the voters supporting me a question:
Do you want to go for the original write-in, or for the modification?
Original is simply to stay under Ant as he prevents a Raging Fire from rolling down the beach and forcing the team into the Sea, providing the elements of Fire and Water, with Ant getting to tap his theme of [Struggle] throughout.
Ridiculously Average Guy's modification is to fight Ant in those same conditions.
I'm mostly asking out of courtesy, though I will admit I personally am highly tempted to alter the write-in accordingly if only because that's seriously awesome.
 
Okay, so being the man who came up with the write-in, it falls to me to ask the voters supporting me a question:
Do you want to go for the original write-in, or for the modification?
Original is simply to stay under Ant as he prevents a Raging Fire from rolling down the beach and forcing the team into the Sea, providing the elements of Fire and Water, with Ant getting to tap his theme of [Struggle] throughout.
Ridiculously Average Guy's modification is to fight Ant in those same conditions.
I'm mostly asking out of courtesy, though I will admit I personally am highly tempted to alter the write-in accordingly if only because that's seriously awesome.
I assumed the second, with the Flame and the Sea acting as walls to a corridor (possible a closed corridor if the fire spreads to envelop). Each also growing closer (as the fire spreads, and as the tide comes in).

So, please change to the second I guess?
 
I think I'm alright with either, but I don't think it matters much. If the plan is foolish in some way, we'll almost certainly get some feedback in character.
 
[X]Write-in: The Flame, the Sea, the Ant inbetween.
-[X]Start a large fire that's decidedly out of control on a beach.
--[X]Manifest Ant inbetween the Fire and Sea, with any who wish to grow stronger through struggle facing him between these two forces.

VOTE CHANGED!
 
I think I'm alright with either, but I don't think it matters much. If the plan is foolish in some way, we'll almost certainly get some feedback in character.

If it's something that you would know in character to be a bad decision, I'd absolutely tell you. You can't make informed decisions if I deliberately keep you uninformed.
 
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